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March 13th, 2008, 12:24 am
October 28th, 2009, 11:33 am
anarchyisbliss wrote:The main reason it is illegal is because moralists in Washington think it is to immoral yet they legalize strip clubs. pornography, and sex shops.
October 28th, 2009, 10:41 pm
Juice wrote:Sorry WTS but I am going to have to disappoint. Being a man of experience, not only my own but also through conversations with men who have similarly availed themselves of various aspects of life I can honestly say with no trepidation that had I known I would meet my wife I would have waited for her. Sure one can say that I am lucky, but the men who comprise my circle of friends and acquaintances value family above anything else and live their lives IAW that priority, children love mothers but learn from fathers.
We have to respect, defend and honor woman. That is how we honor ourselves as men. I watch Gladiator at least once a week since one of the underlying values it expresses is that point of view. I have raised my son with that perspective and I am grateful that he is becoming a better man than I am since I talk to him about intimacy, love and respect, and how adopting those precepts will make him a better man.
[...]I believe that we should look at women and approach our dealings with them in as an honorable manner as possible and we should encourage our sons to act accordingly so that more and more pornography and prostitution become passe'.
October 30th, 2009, 11:20 am
Scott in post 3 wrote:I just made a blog post that further explains the benefits of legalizing prostitution. It also points out that prostitution prohibition drastically increases the spread of AIDS.
Scott in post 13 wrote:prohibition of prostitution does not stop prostitution form occurring; prohibition makes prostitution more dangerous and disables us from regulating it. You wouldn't say that having a more dangerous STD-ridden black market filled with many unwilling sex slaves of all ages is more conducive to a 'free society' than a regulated, legal market of consenting adults; would you? Legalization of prostitution doesn't promote prostitution but rather enables us to regulate it and discourages sex slavery, underage prostitution and STD-filled prostitution.
Nick_A in post 19 wrote:All legalizing it will do is to make it more attractive and invite more prostitution out of the Govt. approved brothels. the result will be more STDs
Nick_A wrote:What does the general welfare mean to you? Does it mean providing a welfare state or an environment that is conducive for a person becoming themselves?
Juice wrote:Once prostitution becomes legal then it sends the message that it has become socially acceptable, and therefore negates the necessity for familiar discourse.
Nick_A wrote:When you legalize prostitution you are not directly promoting it but rather putting it on the same level as other institutions. I'm in a minority but I'd prefer a brothel not being considered on the same level as a hospital even though the trend is to consider them equal in their legality.
Juice wrote:The activity is exploitive and foments other criminal enterprises such as pedophilia and drug trafficking. Ninety percent of prostitutes are drug addicts.
October 30th, 2009, 4:12 pm
Juice wrote:Let's make it clear that it is the "activity" of prostitution itself that promotes destructive and criminal activity regardless of its legality.
October 31st, 2009, 10:06 am
Juice wrote:...the obvious circumstance that prostitution compounds further anti-social behaviors and criminal activities.
Juice wrote:No one is denying anyone the freedom to engage in any consenting activity...
Juice wrote:Would you want or encourage your daughter, son, sister, brother or wife to become a legal tax paying prostitute?
Juice wrote:Would you want to live next door to a house of ill repute (being nice)?
Juice wrote:Would we allow people to become prostitutes so they can support a legal drug habit?
Juice wrote:Could I go to the job fare at the local high school to promote careers in prostitution?
Juice wrote:Would a ugly person be cheaper than a beautiful person? Can we establish price control so as to make it fair for the less accomplished sexual servers? Could I get a refund if I am not satisfied? Where could I get a reference? Will the better business bureau provide them? Could virgins be actioned? What's the retirement age? Do we wait until the server is used up? Can I serve alcohol in my business of ill repute? Will Johns have to show proof of marital status? Will the hotel be sectioned off like they do for smoking so I don't have to worry about stains or unpleasant odors? If I solicit my next door neighbor or her daughter will the law protect me from stalking laws? Could I solicit your wife or daughter, and if you don't like it and hit me do I have grounds to sue for medical expenses or more?
November 2nd, 2009, 10:59 am
November 4th, 2009, 1:44 pm
Nick_A wrote:Hi ScottNick_A, I'm not celebrating prostitution. I am not proposing we celebrate prostitution. I think you are incorrect when you conflate legalization with celebration. For instance, I would definitely support replacing the expensive, ineffective war on prostitution with a less expensive public health campaign similar to what is done with cigarettes and alcohol.
You are suggesting that we battle prostitution by legalizing it. But when you legalize it you are claiming it to be a non threat to the preservation of a free society.
November 12th, 2009, 1:57 pm
January 27th, 2010, 12:36 am
Juice wrote:I am for as little and even no government intrusion into the freedoms and lives of humanity at all. All government is inherently corrupt and should be limited to keeping the citizenry free from force so that they can conduct their business according to their own rational will.
May 16th, 2011, 6:51 pm
BubbaD0g wrote:I don't advocate criminalizing presently lawful, albeit harmful, activities; whenever a massive social change is proposed, my position is that the onus is on proponents of that change to demonstrate that it is a change
BubbaD0g wrote:Maybe you and Scott are right. Maybe our society's attitude towards women is so distorted and evil that the state placing its imprimatur on the sex trade can't really make things that much worse.
May 21st, 2011, 7:54 pm
BubbaD0g wrote:Still, so long as there are legitimate arguments on both sides, my inclination is to allow each community its own voice in the debate, whether I agree with that voice or not.
BubbaD0g wrote:I concede many of the practical advantages of a legal but regulated sex industry, with regulation probably very similar in form to that of the pornography industry now--valid proof of age, mandatory routine STI testing, mandatory use of barrier contraceptives for penetrative acts and the like--but that still does not address my concern about furthering the objectification of women.
May 23rd, 2011, 6:53 pm
BubbaD0g wrote:1. My arguments that human trafficking is made worse by legal prostitution in the European Union are taken from articles on Humantrafficking.org which cite Europol officials on the subject and solwodi.org; as best I can tell, both sources are reliable.
David A. Feingold, PhD wrote:The intersection of the highly emotive issues of sex work and human trafficking generates a lot more heat than light. Some antitrafficking activists equate 'prostitution' with trafficking and vice versa, despite evidence to the contrary. The U.S. government leaves no doubt as to where it stands: According to the State Department Web site, 'Where prostitution is legalized or tolerated, there is a greater demand for human trafficking victims and nearly always an increase in the number of women and children trafficked into commercial sex slavery.' By this logic, the state of Nevada should be awash in foreign sex slaves, leading one to wonder what steps the Justice Department is taking to free them. Oddly, the Netherlands, Australia, and Germany--all of whom have legalized prostitution--received top marks from the Bush administration in the most recent Trafficking in Persons Report.
Moreover, some efforts to prohibit prostitution have increased sex workers' risk to the dangers of trafficking, though largely because lawmakers neglected to consult the people the laws were designed to protect. Sweden, for example, is much praised by antiprostitution activists for a 1998 law that aimed to protect sex workers by criminalizing their customers. But several independent studies, including one conducted by the Swedish police, showed that it exposed prostitutes to more dangerous clients and less safe-sex practices.
3. Your cigarette analogy fails because a legal cigarette looks very different than an illegal vial of cocaine, whereas a legally employed prostitute (in such juridsictions as allow that) is indistinguishable from a trafficked one; a greater level of scrutiny is required. Moreover, the legal trade in tobacco products is relevant here in that it has given rise to a massive illegal trade therein, especially in smuggling cigarettes across national borders so as to circumvent taxes.
BubbaD0g wrote:Your preference for regulated legalization over decriminalization assumes that brothel operators, including those who deal in sex slaves and children, will be upfront and honest with the regulating agencies and law enforcement. You assume that an inspection under controlled conditions arranged in advance by the proprietor of an establishment will be enough to ensure that said establishment doesn't engage in unlawful, off-the-books activity. Such precautions have worked for no other industry of which I am aware; I can't imagine why they would work for the sex industry.
BubbaD0g wrote:Keeping prostitution illegal gives police leverage to encourage cooperation and automatically legitimates any investigation without law enforcement having to present a judge with cause and secure a warrant beforehand.
BubbaD0g wrote:Finally, is anyone going to address the sociological issue of the effect legalizing prostitution would have on society's attitudes toward, and thus treatment of, women?
November 15th, 2011, 2:40 am
December 9th, 2011, 1:58 am
Scott wrote:Most of the arguments for legalizing prostitution stem in part from at least part of the following premise, and many stem almost entirely from it: Legalizing regulated prostitution between otherwise consenting, mentally competent adults in a non-violent setting who are otherwise law-abiding reduces the spread of STDs, reduces sex slavery, reduces child/underage prostitution, reduces rape, reduces sexual violence, and reduces violent crime. I bet most people who support legalizing prostitution would not support it if they did not believe the previous statement to be true. For those who after reading this topic still do not support legalizing prostitution, I politely ask you to if you do not mind state clearly whether or not you agree with the bold sentence in this paragraph. If you do not, then I think then our disagreement is not philosophical but simply a disagreement over that alleged fact.
Bubbad0g wrote:That is, I think, the source and font of my skepticism on the matter. The factual claim you advance runs counter to my intuitions, my experience, and the bulk of what I've read (apart from this discussion) about the matter. Can you provide factual support for it? Or are we saying that, given that this is a forum for philosophical rather than factual debate that facts don't matter? Because structurally, your case is quite strong; if your factual claim above is true, then your conclusion seems nigh inescapable. But as we all know (or ought to anyway) an argument is sound only if it is structurally valid and contains only true premises.