Too Much Tolerance?

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Alias
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Re: Too Much Tolerance?

Post by Alias »

deronmoped wrote: It's the same thing with being liberal or conservative.
What do you mean by those terms?
In the times of scarcity - say, between 400,000 and 4000BC everywhere on earth; up to 1900 AD in some parts of the world -
settled peoples tended to be more culturally enclosed than they are now, which means conservative in the sense of being slow to change,
but also far more egalitarian in the distribution of wealth and labour - which means, economically liberal.

At the same time, in communities of roughly equal size and prosperity, there was a vast variety of attitudes to family relations, sexual conduct, status, aggression, dress, speech, individual rights, education and the supernatural; a vast difference of tolerance for deviation from the norm and for self-expression.
People are allowed to be more liberal when there is excess (overabundance) in society.
How does opinion, and whether one may express it openly, affect abundance - or vice versa?
Life or Mother Nature is the ultimate decider on how society functions. Get too far out of wack and society will not survive. Society will be driven to be more conservative in order to survive.
What is the "wack" that a society can be or out of? Which particular wacks threaten its survival?
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Mark1955
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Re: Too Much Tolerance?

Post by Mark1955 »

Nick_A wrote:
Dolphin42 wrote:I can definitely say, hand on heart, that I do not aspire to become human.
At least you are honest. Most would probably claim they do want to become human. Your sincerity is admirable.
As dolphin42 is most probably classed as human by most other humans I think he needs to focus on how he could raise himself, at least in his own eyes, from such abject poverty to something better.
If you think you know the answer you probably don't understand the question.
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Atreyu
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Re: Too Much Tolerance?

Post by Atreyu »

Everything should be "tolerated" by a society unless there is clear and direct harm to others...
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Rr6
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Re: Too Much Tolerance?

Post by Rr6 »

Atreyu wrote:Everything should be "tolerated" by a society unless there is clear and direct harm to others...
Humans have been tolerating of polluting the environment that sustains for many years now. How long will humanity tolerate that.

Humans tolerate enough hydrogen bombs to destroy all humans many times over. How long will that go on?

Humans tolerate nuke plants that are destined to eventually kill off nay humanity that survives global warming. How long will that go on?

All energy production results in death of humans and polluting the environment. Solar and wind would appear to be the least detrimental humans and ecological environment that sustains them

r6
"U"niverse > UniVerse > universe > I-verse < you-verse < we-verse < them-verse
Steve3007
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Re: Too Much Tolerance?

Post by Steve3007 »

Atreyu:
Everything should be "tolerated" by a society unless there is clear and direct harm to others...
What about things that harm others indirectly and things that harm ourselves? Do you believe that all such things should be tolerated? The society in which I live disagrees with that to some extent. It makes it illegal to ride a motorcycle without a crash helmet or ride in a car without a seat-belt. It makes some harmful and addictive substances illegal and imposes large taxes on some others. And so on. Are you a classic Libertarian (J .S. Mill style) in the sense of disagreeing with these kinds of policies?
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Lark_Truth
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Re: Too Much Tolerance?

Post by Lark_Truth »

Rr6 wrote:
Atreyu wrote:Everything should be "tolerated" by a society unless there is clear and direct harm to others...
Humans have been tolerating of polluting the environment that sustains for many years now. How long will humanity tolerate that.

Humans tolerate enough hydrogen bombs to destroy all humans many times over. How long will that go on?

Humans tolerate nuke plants that are destined to eventually kill off nay humanity that survives global warming. How long will that go on?

All energy production results in death of humans and polluting the environment. Solar and wind would appear to be the least detrimental humans and ecological environment that sustains them

r6
It will all go on until humanity joins together and throws a fit big enough to make the governments of the world say, "We should do something about this" and are motivated into action. Weapons of mass destruction will exist until humanity has grown out of waging war. Nuclear plants will exist until we can find a better and safer way to gain clean energy. It seems that we will tolerate pollution until we start chocking on poisonous gas, or it will be tolerated as long as we have electricity to power our devices.
Truth is Power. Reason is Wisdom. Intelligence is Experience. Hope is Bright!
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Mark1955
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Re: Too Much Tolerance?

Post by Mark1955 »

Atreyu wrote:Everything should be "tolerated" by a society unless there is clear and direct harm to others...
So if you are threatening my immortal sole by not allowing me to practice my religious belief that homosexuality is evil, witches should be killed etc.I don't have to tolerate you.
If you think you know the answer you probably don't understand the question.
Gamnot
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Re: Too Much Tolerance?

Post by Gamnot »

I believe that the philosopher Karl Popper who wrote: "The Open Society and its Critics" was attempting to get a handle on this topic. He raised the question of to what extent intolerance in itself should be tolerated. I don't think that there is an overall formula that can be used, but is a matter of the character and competence of the population and its leadership. Some people who consider the family a pillar of culture tend to be adverse to the radical individualism occurring in our time and I agree with them.


"If God is dead, then everything is permitted." ...... Dostoevsky
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Mark1955
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Re: Too Much Tolerance?

Post by Mark1955 »

Gamnot wrote:. Some people who consider the family a pillar of culture tend to be adverse to the radical individualism occurring in our time and I agree with them.
Spend a day in the family courts listening to the evidence of physical and sexual abuse that goes on in families and then come and say that again. As to god, I've no problem with him, just all the perverts who claim to believe in him and use him to justify what they do.
If you think you know the answer you probably don't understand the question.
Alias
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Re: Too Much Tolerance?

Post by Alias »

Gamnot wrote: "If God is dead, then everything is permitted." ...... Dostoevsky
While god was alive, everything was forbidden.
Nothing changed: people were horrible to one another because a god told them to; now they're horrible to another because they want to.
You'd almost suspect that gods tell bad people to do the bad things they wanted to do all anyway, while good people behave well whether anyone tells them to or not.
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LuckyR
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Re: Too Much Tolerance?

Post by LuckyR »

Am I alone in not appreciating what "tolerating" means as pertains to different world views? Where in the hierarchy of possible levels does not "tolerating" an idea fall?

1- Illegal in the society at large, followers are incarcerated/fined
1a- Legal, but as in the case of some anti-abortion crazies, murder/arson etc
2- Legal but opposed through active, also legal demonstration
3- Legal, though silent disagreement, vote against their agenda when it comes up for a vote
"As usual... it depends."
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