Why do we exist?

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Chili
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Joined: September 29th, 2017, 4:59 pm

Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Chili »

Jan Sand wrote:Whether or not I decide to climb out of the hole makes me the agency.
A hard scientist watching you will understand those events in terms of your constituent neurons, their constituent molecules, atoms, particles - as these interact with one another like dominoes falling over in a cascade / avalanche which began with the big bang if not before. I specifically asked CL since he has espoused a very hard-nosed hard-scientific approach to several issues.
Jan Sand
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Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Jan Sand »

Very happily I hardly rate a hard scientist enough interest to watch.
Chili
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Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Chili »

Jan Sand wrote:Very happily I hardly rate a hard scientist enough interest to watch.
Are you getting adequate food, sleep & Sun?

Does any of this resonate?
https://www.lifeline.org.au/get-help/to ... -isolation
Jan Sand
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Joined: September 10th, 2017, 11:57 am

Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Jan Sand »

The days here in Helsinki are getting rather short but I eat and sleep rather adequately. It never occurred to me that this is the meaning of life but you may be on to something. Whatever it is I hope its not illegal.
Chili
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Joined: September 29th, 2017, 4:59 pm

Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Chili »

Jan Sand wrote:The days here in Helsinki are getting rather short but I eat and sleep rather adequately. It never occurred to me that this is the meaning of life but you may be on to something. Whatever it is I hope its not illegal.
The inner sensation that one's life has meaning can be tricky and not something to be attacked head-on. Many people find that just taken better care of themselves may put them in a state such that life seems more meaningful after a while.
Jan Sand
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Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Jan Sand »

I must admit,at 92, I have to stay away from cheese to assure proper intestinal flow. And, of course, drink a couple of liters of water per day. Delighted that that solves all philosophical problems.
Chili
Posts: 392
Joined: September 29th, 2017, 4:59 pm

Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Chili »

Jan Sand wrote:I must admit,at 92, I have to stay away from cheese to assure proper intestinal flow. And, of course, drink a couple of liters of water per day. Delighted that that solves all philosophical problems.
Perhaps whatever will help hasn't helped yet. Have you found anything previously to help? Are any particular philosophical areas seeming somewhat helpful?
Steve3007
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Joined: June 15th, 2011, 5:53 pm

Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Steve3007 »

I live in southern England and (call me a hypochondriac if you like) but I recently decided to start taking soluble vitamin D tablets. I'll let you know how it goes.

-- Updated Mon Nov 27, 2017 7:49 pm to add the following --
I have to stay away from cheese to assure proper intestinal flow.
This is a strong candidate for my favourite philosophical statement of the year.
Jan Sand
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Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Jan Sand »

As a retired industrial designer I have been quite concerned with the nature of perceptual pattern making and the processes within the neurological system to formulate the abstract templates we use to construct pseudo reality which most people presume is the real thing.The theoretics of Korzybski have been most helpful in this area inspite of the rather disappointing lecture he gave in the Cooper Union auditorium back in 1948 which I witnessed with great expectation but was frustrated by his heavy Polish accent.
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Albert Tatlock
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Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Albert Tatlock »

Steve3007 wrote:I live in southern England and (call me a hypochondriac if you like)
Well it can't be pleasant but it's not exactly an illness. :wink:
Chili
Posts: 392
Joined: September 29th, 2017, 4:59 pm

Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Chili »

Jan Sand wrote:As a retired industrial designer I have been quite concerned with the nature of perceptual pattern making and the processes within the neurological system to formulate the abstract templates we use to construct pseudo reality which most people presume is the real thing.The theoretics of Korzybski have been most helpful in this area inspite of the rather disappointing lecture he gave in the Cooper Union auditorium back in 1948 which I witnessed with great expectation but was frustrated by his heavy Polish accent.
I noticed you used the phrase "... we use ..." - are you comfortable with the implied dualism, or is it simply a figure of speech?

As you consider your neighbor from a reductionist perspective, do you ever find yourself wondering if he/she is conscious in the first place?
Jan Sand
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Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Jan Sand »

The "we" is a common generality which is accepted in most speech by humans and cockatoos. Finns are rather reticent so aside from hyvää huomenta which may be an automatic speech expression its difficult to discover if they are conscious. They seem to manage stairs quite well and rarely bump into walls so I give them some credit for being aware. I am much better at conversations with dogs, muskrats and sparrows since neither I nor they are fluent in Finnish but we are rather clever with gestures so communication is rather clear. They are evidently quite conscious.
Chili
Posts: 392
Joined: September 29th, 2017, 4:59 pm

Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Chili »

Jan Sand wrote:The "we" is a common generality which is accepted in most speech by humans and cockatoos. Finns are rather reticent so aside from hyvää huomenta which may be an automatic speech expression its difficult to discover if they are conscious. They seem to manage stairs quite well and rarely bump into walls so I give them some credit for being aware. I am much better at conversations with dogs, muskrats and sparrows since neither I nor they are fluent in Finnish but we are rather clever with gestures so communication is rather clear. They are evidently quite conscious.
What with these newer robots that can walk, avoid obstacles and climb stairs while keeping their balance - shall we pop some corks that machines have become self aware ?
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Stellan Hoekfelt
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Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Stellan Hoekfelt »

Are we that sure that we exist, life comes from nothing as I see it, and letting the world come out from nothing is reasonably impossible and that makes us the same, impossible to exist or impossible to understand why we exist and then the reason to exist falls with that, as reachable knowledge. And if we exist so is that because we can do the impossible, and that is s a believe it a meaning in it self, if I can do the impossible then everything is possible when nothing is impossible instead of nothing is possible. And that may be the meaning of all, everything is possible!
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Sy Borg
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Re: Why do we exist?

Post by Sy Borg »

Wishful thinking, I'm afraid, Stellan. As always, only some things are realistically possible.

Also, I don't see anything popping out of nothing as being impossible. Isn't it just pieces of reality being assembled in different ways over time? Over deep time these assemblages inevitably become more complex and responsive to their environment - either that or the process is reset (restructured) by a natural cataclysm.
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