‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Use this philosophy forum to discuss and debate general philosophy topics that don't fit into one of the other categories.

This forum is NOT for factual, informational or scientific questions about philosophy (e.g. "What year was Socrates born?"). Those kind of questions can be asked in the off-topic section.
Post Reply
devans99
Posts: 341
Joined: June 17th, 2018, 8:24 pm

‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Post by devans99 »

- This saying is often used in connection with infinite time but:
- Things that are possible can become impossible
- Things that are impossible can’t become possible
- So the probability space shrinks with time
- So infinite time does not make everything possible
- But Infinite space makes everything possible but at such as distance to never effect us.
- This is enough to rule out local Boltzmann Brains.
User avatar
Burning ghost
Posts: 3065
Joined: February 27th, 2016, 3:10 am

Re: ‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Post by Burning ghost »

Mods? What’s this gibberish here for?
AKA badgerjelly
User avatar
Thinking critical
Posts: 1793
Joined: November 7th, 2011, 7:29 pm
Favorite Philosopher: A.C Grayling
Location: Perth, Australia (originally New Zealand)

Re: ‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Post by Thinking critical »

I agree ghost, it's a non sequitur.
The saying is a mathematical claim "everything that can happen, will happen" (given enough time). It is simply a statistical probability.
This cocky little cognitive contortionist will straighten you right out
User avatar
ThomasHobbes
Posts: 1122
Joined: May 5th, 2018, 5:53 pm

Re: ‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Post by ThomasHobbes »

devans99 wrote: June 24th, 2018, 4:59 pm - This saying is often used in connection with infinite time but:
- Things that are possible can become impossible
- Things that are impossible can’t become possible ...
Here's is where your brain leaves to stage.
Since impossible things CANnot happen. this sentence is not relevant to the thread title.
devans99
Posts: 341
Joined: June 17th, 2018, 8:24 pm

Re: ‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Post by devans99 »

Ok perhaps my initial estimate explanation was not too clear:

In a closed system, at time t+1 the set of all possible future events is smaller or equal to the set of all possible future events at time t.

Because:

- Things that are possible can become impossible
- Things that are impossible can’t become possible
- So the probability space shrinks with time
User avatar
ThomasHobbes
Posts: 1122
Joined: May 5th, 2018, 5:53 pm

Re: ‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Post by ThomasHobbes »

devans99 wrote: June 25th, 2018, 5:21 pm - Things that are possible can become impossible
NO.
- Things that are impossible can’t become possible
SO WHAT?
- So the probability space shrinks with time
NO.
[/quote]
devans99
Posts: 341
Joined: June 17th, 2018, 8:24 pm

Re: ‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Post by devans99 »

- Things that are possible can become impossible
You need to think in terms of the 2nd law of thermodynamics; systems start dynamic and full of energy and then become still with time. Things that were once possible in the system are no longer. Or a person as they age - less becomes possible for them. Or in a horse race, horses drop out so less winners become possible...

- Things that are impossible can’t become possible
It means when combined with the first predicate that the probability space must shrink with time .
User avatar
Burning ghost
Posts: 3065
Joined: February 27th, 2016, 3:10 am

Re: ‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Post by Burning ghost »

So what? Go to a physics forum. You’re conflating ideas here. It’s pointless.

We all know (I hope) that the term “impossible” in physics refers to something being so improbably that it may as well be said that it will never happen - such as, as you point out (entropy), a sand castle simply won’t appear on a beach spontaneously. You may as well say everything is impossible because it only happens once and that everything is meaningless for this reason because everything is impossible to varify with any absolutism. Herein may lie the issue with the OP. Physics practices a “loose absolutism” (forgive the hastily cobbled together term!), meaning physics operates within the limits of measurement.

To attempt to conflate semantics from one field to another is going to get you nowhere fast.

I hope you can see now that taking a generic saying and trying to splice it into physics and philosophy is little more than a poorman’s mysticism.
AKA badgerjelly
Steve3007
Posts: 10339
Joined: June 15th, 2011, 5:53 pm

Re: ‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Post by Steve3007 »

"Everything that can happen will happen" or to put it another way "everything that is not forbidden is compulsory" is just a statement about determinism. Sherlock Holmes put it as "once you have eliminated the impossible then everything that is left, however improbable, must be true." I guess that fits well with the Victorian pre Quantum Mechanical triumphantly Newtonian/Maxwellian mindset.

OP:
- This saying is often used in connection with infinite time but:
- Things that are possible can become impossible
- Things that are impossible can’t become possible
- So the probability space shrinks with time
- So infinite time does not make everything possible
- But Infinite space makes everything possible but at such as distance to never effect us.
- This is enough to rule out local Boltzmann Brains.
The first two bullet points seem reasonable. But the probability space only shrinks with time if there is a finite amount of time available. The reason why bullet point 1 is true is that we can't go back in time so an event that was possible at time 't' might no longer be possible at time 't+1' (as you point out later). But if there was an infinite amount of future time available then the shrinking pool of possible future events would always be infinitely large. So I disagree with bullet point 4.
devans99
Posts: 341
Joined: June 17th, 2018, 8:24 pm

Re: ‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Post by devans99 »

“But if there was an infinite amount of future time available then the shrinking pool of possible future events would always be infinitely large”

- The set of possibilities in a closed system shrinks with time and tends to zero. For example the way systems start dynamic and reach equilibrium after a time. Sturing a coffie cup is an example; lots of stuff going on to start with followed by stillness.
User avatar
Thinking critical
Posts: 1793
Joined: November 7th, 2011, 7:29 pm
Favorite Philosopher: A.C Grayling
Location: Perth, Australia (originally New Zealand)

Re: ‘Everything can happen, will happen’ is wrong...

Post by Thinking critical »

devans99 wrote: June 25th, 2018, 5:52 pm - Things that are possible can become impossible
You need to think in terms of the 2nd law of thermodynamics; systems start dynamic and full of energy and then become still with time. Things that were once possible in the system are no longer. Or a person as they age - less becomes possible for them. Or in a horse race, horses drop out so less winners become possible...
The increase of entropy within a system only reduces probability it does not make something impossible. Attempting to apply an entropic principal to explain the lack of ability due to age in humans and horses is nonsense, this not a valid comparison to prove your premise.

As for your coclusion, as stated earlier this is a non sequitur.
This cocky little cognitive contortionist will straighten you right out
Post Reply

Return to “General Philosophy”

2023/2024 Philosophy Books of the Month

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise
by John K Danenbarger
January 2023

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul
by Mitzi Perdue
February 2023

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness
by Chet Shupe
March 2023

The Unfakeable Code®

The Unfakeable Code®
by Tony Jeton Selimi
April 2023

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are
by Alan Watts
May 2023

Killing Abel

Killing Abel
by Michael Tieman
June 2023

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead
by E. Alan Fleischauer
July 2023

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough
by Mark Unger
August 2023

Predictably Irrational

Predictably Irrational
by Dan Ariely
September 2023

Artwords

Artwords
by Beatriz M. Robles
November 2023

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope
by Dr. Randy Ross
December 2023

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes
by Ali Master
February 2024

2022 Philosophy Books of the Month

Emotional Intelligence At Work

Emotional Intelligence At Work
by Richard M Contino & Penelope J Holt
January 2022

Free Will, Do You Have It?

Free Will, Do You Have It?
by Albertus Kral
February 2022

My Enemy in Vietnam

My Enemy in Vietnam
by Billy Springer
March 2022

2X2 on the Ark

2X2 on the Ark
by Mary J Giuffra, PhD
April 2022

The Maestro Monologue

The Maestro Monologue
by Rob White
May 2022

What Makes America Great

What Makes America Great
by Bob Dowell
June 2022

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!
by Jerry Durr
July 2022

Living in Color

Living in Color
by Mike Murphy
August 2022 (tentative)

The Not So Great American Novel

The Not So Great American Novel
by James E Doucette
September 2022

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches
by John N. (Jake) Ferris
October 2022

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All
by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
November 2022

The Smartest Person in the Room: The Root Cause and New Solution for Cybersecurity

The Smartest Person in the Room
by Christian Espinosa
December 2022

2021 Philosophy Books of the Month

The Biblical Clock: The Untold Secrets Linking the Universe and Humanity with God's Plan

The Biblical Clock
by Daniel Friedmann
March 2021

Wilderness Cry: A Scientific and Philosophical Approach to Understanding God and the Universe

Wilderness Cry
by Dr. Hilary L Hunt M.D.
April 2021

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute: Tools To Spark Your Dream And Ignite Your Follow-Through

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute
by Jeff Meyer
May 2021

Surviving the Business of Healthcare: Knowledge is Power

Surviving the Business of Healthcare
by Barbara Galutia Regis M.S. PA-C
June 2021

Winning the War on Cancer: The Epic Journey Towards a Natural Cure

Winning the War on Cancer
by Sylvie Beljanski
July 2021

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream
by Dr Frank L Douglas
August 2021

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts
by Mark L. Wdowiak
September 2021

The Preppers Medical Handbook

The Preppers Medical Handbook
by Dr. William W Forgey M.D.
October 2021

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress: A Practical Guide

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress
by Dr. Gustavo Kinrys, MD
November 2021

Dream For Peace: An Ambassador Memoir

Dream For Peace
by Dr. Ghoulem Berrah
December 2021