Common sense versus physics

Use this forum to discuss the philosophy of science. Philosophy of science deals with the assumptions, foundations, and implications of science.
Post Reply
User avatar
jkg20
New Trial Member
Posts: 3
Joined: April 1st, 2018, 11:01 am

Common sense versus physics

Post by jkg20 »

Just come from reading this blog:[link deleted - see policy on links] The guy seems to be saying that we shouldn't be taking modern physics literally, but just as some kind of heuristic device to help us manipulate reality. Sound like a contradiction not to take physics literally to me - can we really avoid doing so?
User avatar
jkg20
New Trial Member
Posts: 3
Joined: April 1st, 2018, 11:01 am

Re: Common sense versus physics

Post by jkg20 »

Apparently I violated the link policy - presumably because I've only just joined. I'm not going to copy paste the entire article here, so I'll give the gist of the argument (as far as I can tell) and then in a few days time I'll try reposting the link so that those who want more details can see the argument in full. The basis idea seems to be that the real world is the perceptible world and that, taken literally, physics does not describe the perceptible world, so taken literally physics does not describe the real world. So, if we assume that truth is correspondence with the real world only, if taken literally, physics cannot be true. So, we have to take physics heuristically not literally. That's my understanding anyway, but as I say, provided it doesn't violate the links policy, I'll repost the link when I've put in enough days as a member.
Fooloso4
Posts: 3601
Joined: February 28th, 2014, 4:50 pm

Re: Common sense versus physics

Post by Fooloso4 »

See the site policy regarding links:
Excessive posting of links to the same website in many different posts will generally cause a blacklist of that site, particularly if the member posting the link is affiliated to that some way …
I do not know if it is your blog or if you have some other affiliation, but you have three posts including this one and two of them linked to this site.

With regard to the argument:

The claim that the real world is the perceptible world is questionable. An idealist might accept it but if one does not accept that claim the argument falls apart. If one does accept that the real world is the perceptible world, the claim that physics does not describe the perceptible world is false, provided one takes perceptible to mean observable with the proper instruments instead of with the senses aided or unaided. Once again the argument falls apart.
User avatar
Luin
New Trial Member
Posts: 9
Joined: April 1st, 2018, 1:07 pm

Re: Common sense versus physics

Post by Luin »

jkg20 wrote: April 2nd, 2018, 5:41 pm The basis idea seems to be that the real world is the perceptible world and that, taken literally, physics does not describe the perceptible world, so taken literally physics does not describe the real world. So, if we assume that truth is correspondence with the real world only, if taken literally, physics cannot be true. So, we have to take physics heuristically not literally.
Perception is isolated and unique per observer, even if some aspects of it can be agreed upon by fellow observers. What needs to be considered is the fact that all physics are focused on the interactions between material structure systems [and what can be presumed of the non-material agencies that create a consistent manner of interaction between material structure systems], and the associated fact that all such interactions are being observed by yet another material structure system [the observer], with that observation constituting an additional interaction. Yes, the observer is a material system, even if the interpretation of what's been observed has been deeply affected by the non-material agency [known as qualia] as well as the product of that qualia [in most cases] which is a combination of established scientific thought [paradigm] and the observation translation mechanisms that have been engineered to serve that specific scientific paradigm. That's a lot of muck to have to "see through" when perceiving with even the best scientific methodology and it's especially difficult if the paradigm being served by that science is based on assertions that have never taken into account just how isolated from each observable interaction all human perception actually is.

Naturally, what is real can only be abstracted by the corporeal human observer, but without a full and comprehensive understanding of all that exists as a filter between the observer and what's being observed, it's pretty unlikely that any amount of abstraction [regardless of its brilliance] will get the observer close to the real that is being observed. The "perceptible world" is translated by the observing system to serve the structural survival of that system. To achieve a factual appreciation of Reality, looking past the way that your own material structure has evolved to best serve its own survival as an integral and functional constituent of the "material realm" is the first hurdle to be overcome.
User avatar
LuckyR
Moderator
Posts: 7935
Joined: January 18th, 2015, 1:16 am

Re: Common sense versus physics

Post by LuckyR »

Well since common sense leads to "conundrums" and "paradoxes", even in simple systems whereas physics predicts very accurately in simple systems, I am going with physics.
"As usual... it depends."
User avatar
Kevin Levites
New Trial Member
Posts: 15
Joined: April 25th, 2019, 11:25 am

Re: Common sense versus physics

Post by Kevin Levites »

I would want clarigication on what the term "real world" means....and I'm not trying to be difficult jyst for the sake of being difficult.

Gallileo built a telescope based on reports from the Netherlands, and seems to be the first person who used it to study the sky.

He discovered stars invisible to the naked eye, and the clergy of his time denounced his discoveries and his telescope as an artifact of Satan....because if God wanted us to see those stars, then they would be visible to the naked eye.

This discussion about the differences between the real world (ie: "common sense") and physics seems similar...at least to me.
Post Reply

Return to “Philosophy of Science”

2023/2024 Philosophy Books of the Month

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise
by John K Danenbarger
January 2023

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul
by Mitzi Perdue
February 2023

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness
by Chet Shupe
March 2023

The Unfakeable Code®

The Unfakeable Code®
by Tony Jeton Selimi
April 2023

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are
by Alan Watts
May 2023

Killing Abel

Killing Abel
by Michael Tieman
June 2023

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead
by E. Alan Fleischauer
July 2023

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough
by Mark Unger
August 2023

Predictably Irrational

Predictably Irrational
by Dan Ariely
September 2023

Artwords

Artwords
by Beatriz M. Robles
November 2023

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope
by Dr. Randy Ross
December 2023

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes
by Ali Master
February 2024

2022 Philosophy Books of the Month

Emotional Intelligence At Work

Emotional Intelligence At Work
by Richard M Contino & Penelope J Holt
January 2022

Free Will, Do You Have It?

Free Will, Do You Have It?
by Albertus Kral
February 2022

My Enemy in Vietnam

My Enemy in Vietnam
by Billy Springer
March 2022

2X2 on the Ark

2X2 on the Ark
by Mary J Giuffra, PhD
April 2022

The Maestro Monologue

The Maestro Monologue
by Rob White
May 2022

What Makes America Great

What Makes America Great
by Bob Dowell
June 2022

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!
by Jerry Durr
July 2022

Living in Color

Living in Color
by Mike Murphy
August 2022 (tentative)

The Not So Great American Novel

The Not So Great American Novel
by James E Doucette
September 2022

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches
by John N. (Jake) Ferris
October 2022

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All
by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
November 2022

The Smartest Person in the Room: The Root Cause and New Solution for Cybersecurity

The Smartest Person in the Room
by Christian Espinosa
December 2022

2021 Philosophy Books of the Month

The Biblical Clock: The Untold Secrets Linking the Universe and Humanity with God's Plan

The Biblical Clock
by Daniel Friedmann
March 2021

Wilderness Cry: A Scientific and Philosophical Approach to Understanding God and the Universe

Wilderness Cry
by Dr. Hilary L Hunt M.D.
April 2021

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute: Tools To Spark Your Dream And Ignite Your Follow-Through

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute
by Jeff Meyer
May 2021

Surviving the Business of Healthcare: Knowledge is Power

Surviving the Business of Healthcare
by Barbara Galutia Regis M.S. PA-C
June 2021

Winning the War on Cancer: The Epic Journey Towards a Natural Cure

Winning the War on Cancer
by Sylvie Beljanski
July 2021

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream
by Dr Frank L Douglas
August 2021

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts
by Mark L. Wdowiak
September 2021

The Preppers Medical Handbook

The Preppers Medical Handbook
by Dr. William W Forgey M.D.
October 2021

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress: A Practical Guide

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress
by Dr. Gustavo Kinrys, MD
November 2021

Dream For Peace: An Ambassador Memoir

Dream For Peace
by Dr. Ghoulem Berrah
December 2021