Are anger, discompassion and hatred symptoms of weakness?

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Woodart
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Re: Are anger, discompassion and hatred symptoms of weakness

Post by Woodart » May 14th, 2017, 8:53 pm

Lucylu wrote: But the cynic in me says that the first use will probably be to create the perfect soldier or the perfect worker drone!
Well - I am more of a cynic than you - we will create the perfect soldier, worker drone and sex worker - all in one!

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Vishnu
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Re: Are anger, discompassion and hatred symptoms of weakness

Post by Vishnu » July 5th, 2017, 6:21 am

In a very general sense - yes anger, discompassion (or lack of compassion) and hatred can be categorized as weak (atleast "morally" we wish to say so)

But if we deep dive into those emotions, then the question that arises is "weak" in what sense? Those feelings or emotions do not exist in vacuum right? Those emotions exist in the mind of a human being ( I am not getting ethology to discuss these emotions in context of other animals). Now whom are you assigning the adjective "weak" to? The body of the person in whose mind those feelings are present ? Mind in which those feelings are present? or the intensity of the feeling itself? Or the consequences arising due to presence of those emotions in the mind of a person? Or the "soul" influenced by those emotions?

Body: Physical strength of a body may not have strong correlation to those emotions (anger, discompassion or hatred)

Mind: Would we rate Hitler's mind as a weak mind, despite all his anger, lack of compassion and hatred towards Jews? We may say that Hitler's brain functioning is weak in dealing with neurotransmitters involved in joy, compassion and love. But we can definitely not say that his "thinking" ability is weak.

Consequences: Taking a utilitarian view we can rate the effect of those emotions as weak or strong based on net negative utility generated as outcome of those emotions : If anger, hatred and lack of compassion (as in case of Hitler) cause large net negative utility for the society then the effect of those emotions need to categorized as strong

Intensity of the Emotion: Intensity of the emotion can be measured using fMRI. Robert Plutchik's "Wheel of Emotions" also comes handy in describing the type and intensity of emotions.

Soul: Coming back to where we started. When we generally refer to anger, hatred and lack of compassion as signs of weakness, we are referring to the "soul" influenced by such emotions. While the "soul" itself is a debatable term, I am using this term as reference to the immaterial part of human being as defined in Bhagavad Geeta. We would like to categorize such souls as weak souls (again not weak minds or bodies). Again it is not very straight forward to categorize a soul influenced by such emotions as weak souls. What if someone has hatred towards terrorists who were involved in 9/11? Those terrorists created large negative utility for society. So can we categorize the souls that hate such terrorists as weak? If we see this in the light of "Doctrine of Double Effect" of St. Thomas Aquinas, then the intent of the hatred in such case is not immoral, such hatred is not creating bad consequences, the negative effects of such hatred aren't outweighing the positive effects. So then we may not categorize such soul as weak soul.

In summary, philosophically it is too simplistic to say "hatred, lack of compassion and anger are symptoms of weakness". It depends on the dimension from which you are looking at these (or any other) emotions.

But yes as a human tribe, we would want to call them as symptoms of weakness so as to inculcate better utilitarian morals in the society.

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Taschenrechner
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Re: Are anger, discompassion and hatred symptoms of weakness

Post by Taschenrechner » August 2nd, 2017, 8:07 am

In response to Scott, I think his points are valid and support the question regarding weakness.

What about parenting? If you are angry at a child for a mistake, is it because of weakness? If you are discompassionate, such as making your new-grad pay for their rent to stay in your home, is that because of weakness?

You want them to succeed and learn. But is that qualified as a weakness? Intuitiv3infid3l touches on it here:
Intuitiv3infid3l wrote:If anything, compassion is actually a weakness because it is conforming to other people for the sake of being accepted and to get a temporary 'feel good' rush instead of fighting for morality (making the system into a justice-providing one).

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Jan Pahl
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Re: Are anger, discompassion and hatred symptoms of weakness

Post by Jan Pahl » September 7th, 2017, 12:34 pm

anger, discompassion, hate and many others are natural human responses, if they are with our emotional "tool box", had to be a useful by definition.

Like all emotions, motivations and drives the act of split them by dichotomic positive or negative valence is evidence of not have a complete view of being human in all its aspects.

The problem is how to sublime and use in a proper way not only what here is considered with negative valence, but also what is considered with positive valence according to the circumstance.

All ethical systems even if they in fact dichotomise human behavioural, cognitive and emotional reality by valence, can be subject to be corrected without losing the main core of that system

Dlaw
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Re: Are anger, discompassion and hatred symptoms of weakness

Post by Dlaw » January 11th, 2018, 1:06 pm

Jan Pahl wrote:
September 7th, 2017, 12:34 pm
anger, discompassion, hate and many others are natural human responses, if they are with our emotional "tool box", had to be a useful by definition.
Actually, they had to be useful *at some time to some ancestor*. We evolve traits discreetly, over time.

[quote}
Like all emotions, motivations and drives the act of split them by dichotomic positive or negative valence is evidence of not have a complete view of being human in all its aspects.

The problem is how to sublime and use in a proper way not only what here is considered with negative valence, but also what is considered with positive valence according to the circumstance.

All ethical systems even if they in fact dichotomise human behavioural, cognitive and emotional reality by valence, can be subject to be corrected without losing the main core of that system
[/quote]

I think I follow your argument about valence, but I'm not sure. I would think, that the question would first be what kind of "weakness" we're talking about here. Is it a weakness of fatigue - like a person might get when subjected to stress over time? Is it an inherent weakness caused by disease organic or acquired? Is it a weakness born of ignorance, where the person is shocked to find their preconceived solutions don't work?

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