Are we all born an Atheist?

Discuss philosophical questions regarding theism (and atheism), and discuss religion as it relates to philosophy. This includes any philosophical discussions that happen to be about god, gods, or a 'higher power' or the belief of them. This also generally includes philosophical topics about organized or ritualistic mysticism or about organized, common or ritualistic beliefs in the existence of supernatural phenomenon.
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Thinking critical
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

Post by Thinking critical »

Thought_2000: A critical part of Philosophy is the field of epistemology, this refers to how we know what we know and what makes it true and accurate knowledge, this is extremely important when referring to Ontological concepts such as God. What annoys me is the ignorance of creationists who preach the bible as empirical facts while acknowledging that it is purely based on faith. While at the same time simply rejecting objective evidence that has been observed, tested and proven through a rigorous process that makes predictions to prove it's own authenticity. For example your statement "God only created two dogs" Is this an assertion, or you're belief based on the bible? I have never stated humans evolved from apes simply for the fact it's not true, Apes and Humans share a common ancestor they have both evolved from. Pity is best kept for the deserving, I don't need nor require any pity, but thanks anyway.
As you post the questioning of God and the only one deity, the holy ghost notes your posts and makes our creator aware. I would not like to be you....
I never asked you to. Believing that those who insult your concept of God will be punished for eternity or what ever it is you believe, is you, projecting your own ego which has manifested into a spiteful revenge against those who oppose your beliefs, hardly moral now is it?
Do Atheists have a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects? If so by definition, this is is referred to as a religion.
I can't peak on behalf of all atheists, there is no scripture or ideology behind atheism. The only thing they share in common is the absence of belief in God (in my case a God that exists outside of cognition). I belong to no sect I am free to seek and obtain knowledge based on my own reasoning and logic. Personally I think belief in God is fine, but when people start making claims that God created everything yet they fail to back it up with any evidence I will protest.
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Thought_2000
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

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Thanks for your reply Thinking Critical;

You have free will to think as you choose. If it is evidence you desire and require you may not receive. The creator, God may not care to present proof to you or me as it is unnecessary. Why do I say unnecessary? Faith in God does not come from us, it comes from God. God has faith in us to be the best person we can be everyday and God will be with us - good or bad. Why would anyone in our populations turn down or turn away from the faith from God? I am not the wisest in PC but I 'm not going to give away a given - non judgmental...
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Thinking critical
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

Post by Thinking critical »

Thought_2000 wrote:Thanks for your reply Thinking Critical;

You have free will to think as you choose. If it is evidence you desire and require you may not receive. The creator, God may not care to present proof to you or me as it is unnecessary. Why do I say unnecessary? Faith in God does not come from us, it comes from God. God has faith in us to be the best person we can be everyday and God will be with us - good or bad. Why would anyone in our populations turn down or turn away from the faith from God? I am not the wisest in PC but I 'm not going to give away a given - non judgmental...
My concept of God is that he is the Ego of ourselves, I have faith in myself your Ego God has faith in you. The idea that God exists as a metaphysical concept which represents ones personal ideology of perfection, pure love, hope and so fourth is IMHO an honest reflection of what God is. The psychological benefits would be the same wether it be Bible God or Ego God that one placed there faith in. I don't look for evidence for against God, it's of no interest for me as I already know what God is. If belief in any form of God is what it takes to bring hope to the masses and help people lead a moral life , then I'm all for it, I just hope that they would still be the same person if they ever realised there God didn't exist, if they weren't I would be deeply concerned for the future of humanity.
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Thought_2000
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

Post by Thought_2000 »

Thinking critical wrote: (Nested quote removed.)


My concept of God is that he is the Ego of ourselves, I have faith in myself your Ego God has faith in you. The idea that God exists as a metaphysical concept which represents ones personal ideology of perfection, pure love, hope and so fourth is IMHO an honest reflection of what God is. The psychological benefits would be the same wether it be Bible God or Ego God that one placed there faith in. I don't look for evidence for against God, it's of no interest for me as I already know what God is. If belief in any form of God is what it takes to bring hope to the masses and help people lead a moral life , then I'm all for it, I just hope that they would still be the same person if they ever realised there God didn't exist, if they weren't I would be deeply concerned for the future of humanity.
Interesting response. Your comparison of ego and faith it quit a handful.
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Ralfy
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

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Likely we are born agnostic.
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Thinking critical
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

Post by Thinking critical »

Ralfy wrote: August 8th, 2013, 5:20 am Likely we are born agnostic.
The problem that I now see with my OP is that all definitions require knowledge of the idea of god(s) in order for a position to ascertained. I have yet to find a word to define "absence of knowledge in gods" which is most likely the most accurate description.

This leading to another question....is it ethical for parents to give there children a religion before the child can even contemplate what religion or gods are?
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Dark Matter
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

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Posting links like that is a sure-fired way of becoming disliked, KT, as they slam the door shut in the face of topics like this.
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

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Was I born as an atheist? Heck, no.

I was born as a devout born-again Baptist Christian, a humble and devout servant of god. Right from birth. Delivered my first sermon in the next minute to the obstetrician team, to whom my mother and father are deeply indebted(*): Dr. Jones, anesthesiologist, Dr. Ratky, obstetrician, Mrs. Kupfermeier, nurse, and the other three hangers-on in the delivery room.

(*) Daddy is still making monthly payments for the procedure.
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

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Thinking critical wrote: June 18th, 2018, 7:54 am
Ralfy wrote: August 8th, 2013, 5:20 am Likely we are born agnostic.
The problem that I now see with my OP is that all definitions require knowledge of the idea of god(s) in order for a position to ascertained. I have yet to find a word to define "absence of knowledge in gods" which is most likely the most accurate description.

This leading to another question....is it ethical for parents to give there children a religion before the child can even contemplate what religion or gods are?
IN the same vein, you could ask, is it ethical to give the child a name he or she did not ask for?

Is it ethical to tell him or her not to push over other kids in the playground?

Is it ethical to tell him or her that s/he ought not to play doctor with kids of the opposite sex?

Is it ethical to force him or her into 12 boring years of near-death numbness and slavery, called "school"?

Is it ethical to call him or her American and instill in him or her patriotic values, the importance of hard work, and the worship of the almighty buck?

These are cultural hang-ons that if you don't, then someone else will. Same with the religion. The poor, hapless kid won't know what hit him, but it does not matter, as one religion is the same as the next: they teach segregation, how to hate those who are different from you, and to be alert and on the lookout for atheists.
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Eduk
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

Post by Eduk »

TC I agree the definition of God/s is the key to answering your question.
My personal take is that religion isn't a simple thing to neatly define. Indeed much like pretty much all categorisation, that I can think of, the tighter you try to define terms the more slippery they get.
Many people demand that religious beliefs be treated specially. That they aren't the same as other unreasonable beliefs. Personally I find the claim unreasonable.
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Dark Matter
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

Post by Dark Matter »

Thinking critical wrote: August 4th, 2013, 9:15 pm I can't peak on behalf of all atheists, there is no scripture or ideology behind atheism. The only thing they share in common is the absence of belief in God (in my case a God that exists outside of cognition). I belong to no sect I am free to seek and obtain knowledge based on my own reasoning and logic. Personally I think belief in God is fine, but when people start making claims that God created everything yet they fail to back it up with any evidence I will protest.
While I appreciate the sentiment, I don't think this is a fair assessment when the whole situation is taken into account. Study after study has shown that it more likely than not that the tendency toward religion, while optional, is hard-wired. Agnosticism with a tendency toward religion, not atheism, is the default position.

As we purse the question as to why there is something rather than nothing to its ultimate conclusion, we are left with two possibilities: unstable nothingness or the presence of will. Here, we encounter the dilemma of Buridan's Ass: which bale of hay do we choose? Both require a leap of faith because, logically, one doesn't make any more sense than the other. Yet, nothing is more more consequential.
Eduk
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

Post by Eduk »

We are left with more possibilities than you can imagine, literally.
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Dark Matter
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

Post by Dark Matter »

Eduk wrote: June 19th, 2018, 3:20 pm We are left with more possibilities than you can imagine, literally.
I run into that kind of comment all the time, but never saw anyone suggest an alternative that does not fall into one category or the other.
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Re: Are we all born an Atheist?

Post by Eduk »

DM if I could think of something unimaginable then it wouldn't be.
Besides your will hypothesis doesn't explain itself. So as far as I can see you have only posited one category.
Unknown means unknown.
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