Who Is God?
- SimpleGuy
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Re: Who Is God?
- SimpleGuy
- Posts: 338
- Joined: September 11th, 2017, 12:28 pm
Re: Who Is God?
- SimpleGuy
- Posts: 338
- Joined: September 11th, 2017, 12:28 pm
Re: Who Is God?
- SimpleGuy
- Posts: 338
- Joined: September 11th, 2017, 12:28 pm
Re: Who Is God?
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Re: Who Is God?
Approximates pretty well to :Perhaps God is just the will to perceive your own environment in a more transcendental way one is used to.
A religion is (1) a system of symbols which acts to (2) establish powerful, pervasive, and long-lasting moods and motivations in men by (3)
formulating conceptions of a general order of existence and (4) clothing these conceptions with such an aura of factuality that ( 5) the moods and motivations seem uniquely realistic.
Clifford Geertz The Interpretation of Cultures page97
My copy enlarges the spaces between his items. I note that while SimpleGuy places the paradigm within psychology Geertz places his as anthropology. Geertz had already specified how human psychology is based in men's biological evolution which is never apart from culture.
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Re: Who Is God?
We are earthly not cosmic entities. My place in the universe has nothing to do with cosmic purposes, God given or otherwise. I make my place, a place that shelters those I love and where my garden grows.
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Re: Who Is God?
We are earthly entities, but we are also cosmic entities. The quantum world is as much in us as we are in the cosmos: at bottom, there is no multiplicity of things and beings. To become mature is to live more intensely in the present, at the same time escaping from the limitations of the present.
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Re: Who Is God?
Spare us the inanities. The risk only exists if one’s head and heart are elsewhere. There is no quantum world in us. The quantum world is merely a colloquialism, a way of referring to natural processes at a certain scale. We do not live “at bottom”. We cannot even say what is “at bottom”. Things and beings do make a world of difference to us, or at least to some of us, specifically earthly things and human beings. There is no escape from our limits, escape exists only in the fantasies of those who cannot abide this world. An escape to an insular world of retreat, cramped and closed off,without fresh air or light, that imagines itself to be without bounds; where all one’s fears and anxieties, all one’s needs and desires, find satisfying answers.Everything has a risk.
We are earthly entities, but we are also cosmic entities. The quantum world is as much in us as we are in the cosmos: at bottom, there is no multiplicity of things and beings. To become mature is to live more intensely in the present, at the same time escaping from the limitations of the present.
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Re: Who Is God?
Fooloso4 wrote: ↑April 2nd, 2018, 10:36 am To ask about one’s place in the universe creates displacement from here and now. By attempting to relate to an unimaginable vastness one risks neglecting relations with one another and our moral responsibility to each other.
We are earthly not cosmic entities. My place in the universe has nothing to do with cosmic purposes, God given or otherwise. I make my place, a place that shelters those I love and where my garden grows.
These posts represent radically different perspectives. I’ll let others decide which one is more conducive to peaceful coexistence and human progress.Dark Matter wrote: ↑April 2nd, 2018, 12:36 pm Everything has a risk.
We are earthly entities, but we are also cosmic entities. The quantum world is as much in us as we are in the cosmos: at bottom, there is no multiplicity of things and beings. To become mature is to live more intensely in the present, at the same time escaping from the limitations of the present.
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Re: Who Is God?
That works well until a life problem overtakes your ability to make sense of it where your garden grows. At such times, e.g. marriage breakdown, bereavement, loss of career, genocide, and so on we most of us look to philosophy, science, or religion to help us to understand what doesn't fit with one's everyday model of reality. It's not asking one's place in the universe that creates the lost feeling it's uncomprehsible disaster.Fooloso4 wrote: ↑April 2nd, 2018, 10:36 am To ask about one’s place in the universe creates displacement from here and now. By attempting to relate to an unimaginable vastness one risks neglecting relations with one another and our moral responsibility to each other.
We are earthly not cosmic entities. My place in the universe has nothing to do with cosmic purposes, God given or otherwise. I make my place, a place that shelters those I love and where my garden grows.
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Re: Who Is God?
Yes, they are radically different. Most of us would simply leave it there, but as your posts have demonstrated since the time you have been here is that you are not satisfied to leave it there. As to which perspective is more conducive to peaceful coexistence and human progress, they should be judged by their fruit, but that is not entirely fair since different people may share the same perspective and act in very different ways. Forum rules forbid me from saying more.These posts represent radically different perspectives. I’ll let others decide which one is more conducive to peaceful coexistence and human progress.
- jerlands
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Re: Who Is God?
I believe this is flat out wrong. The earth was formed from all which gives life and form, that is to say, there are boundaries but no true separation between the earth and the stellar system because it's just one big thing.
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Re: Who Is God?
I agree. I am a big fan of the story of Job and what it says about human things, but I think it is also instructive to those who look to God for what it says about Godly things. We can’t make sense of why things happen as they do, and that inability can increase one’s suffering and despair. But I do not strive to make sense of it. I do not think that this is the only way or the best way, but it is my way.That works well until a life problem overtakes your ability to make sense of it where your garden grows.
I agree that crisis can create the feeling of loss, but it is not the only reason why one may feel lost. Those who are not grounded can get lost. Those who forget the human perspective can get lost. Those who neglect the human things in favor of something higher can get lost. The story of Thales is that he fell in a hole while contemplating the heavens. The story of some people is that they step over or step on human beings in search of meaning elsewhere.It's not asking one's place in the universe that creates the lost feeling it's uncomprehsible disaster.
These are, of course, not mutually exclusive perspectives, and that is why I said it is a risk. I agree with Nietzsche when he says if you desire something higher then learn to elevate yourself. He reminds us that stories of God and the cosmos are human stories, human creations, human all too human. The question is, to what end do we invent them? They can be effective in giving us solace, effective when they tell us to care for ourselves, each other, and the earth, but they can be disastrous if when in looking beyond man one overlooks man.
- Sy Borg
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Re: Who Is God?
Is it possible not to have a place in the universe? My understanding is that the only way to leave this universe is via a black hole.
Why do you think "having a place in the universe" matters? What difference does it make? Why would the act of convincing yourself that the uncertain is true give you place a "place in the universe"?
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Re: Who Is God?
I agree they're not mutually exclusive. I think we invent the myths to explain to us how we ought to feel. I've been reading Clifford Geertz, and he says that religion is for showing us the tone and degree of mood we need and the direction of motivation. Obviously societies vary in the specific moods and motivations that are enjoined. I cannot but agree.These are, of course, not mutually exclusive perspectives, and that is why I said it is a risk. I agree with Nietzsche when he says if you desire something higher then learn to elevate yourself. He reminds us that stories of God and the cosmos are human stories, human creations, human all too human. The question is, to what end do we invent them? They can be effective in giving us solace, effective when they tell us to care for ourselves, each other, and the earth, but they can be disastrous if when in looking beyond man one overlooks man.
By overlooking man do you refer to being too other-worldly like ,as you said, Thales falling into a hole? Or do you mean by overlooking man that man makes gods and religions? Or both? I'd say both.
I find that science and philosophy are more consoling than religion, as science and philosophy demand no suspension of disbelief. However I do long for a reasonable religion and I try to seek for it; now and again something makes sense.
I recall what you and Greta say about peak experiences, and it seemed to me that the effect of these for you was to combine mood and motivation.
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