Humanity, Earth, and the End of the World Apocalypse

Discuss philosophical questions regarding theism (and atheism), and discuss religion as it relates to philosophy. This includes any philosophical discussions that happen to be about god, gods, or a 'higher power' or the belief of them. This also generally includes philosophical topics about organized or ritualistic mysticism or about organized, common or ritualistic beliefs in the existence of supernatural phenomenon.
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Pelegrin_1
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Humanity, Earth, and the End of the World Apocalypse

Post by Pelegrin_1 »

I'm posting here a line of reasoning related to the topics in the title. The purpose of course is to read and respond to argumentation related to or expanding upon the points that I have made here...

What essentially is the significance of ‘the End of the World Apocalypse’, which “god” is supposedly to step in and save humanity from? Is it the death of all human beings, living at that time, by our own hands,… self-destruction? Is that what it is? To be honest, I’m not totally sure, and I suppose it could mean somewhat different things to different people based on their own interpretation. But what would make human death so special, since human beings are mortal and we die! In the history of humanity, to date, countless people have already died and for any number of reasons. People have died individually or in large groups or numbers. Both old and young have died or been killed, at the hands of other people or just through decease or natural disasters. So what would make an “end of the world” event any different other than the sheer numbers of people that could die at one relative moment in time? By the standards of religious faith, what happens with all those who have already died? It seems that religion tells us that there are three possibilities: we are taken to heaven, sent to hell, or left to live in purgatory. So what would be the difference with respect to an apocalyptic death of human beings? Wouldn’t there be the same general result? Wouldn’t those who die or are to die at that time either end up in heaven, hell, or purgatory? I mean, perhaps there’s some fourth option that I’m not considering here, such as a re-establishment of humanity on Earth. But for those humans whom “god” has deemed to be good, wouldn’t simply being in heaven, with god, be the best result, which is again “supposedly” what already happens with the faithful good who die whether it be as the result of “the end of the world” or otherwise. So I’m at a loss as to how things would be any different with respect to such an event, other than the same thing happening as is said to happen whenever people die, other than it happening on a much larger scale with respect to the numbers of people involved.

Perhaps, as always, humanity is too focused on itself and not on “the World”, our planet, Earth, the place where we live, this special place where life is able to exist and flourish. Perhaps, if there is a “god”, it’s not humanity that this god will save, but Earth which this god will save from us. It’s really not us that’s special after all; it’s this planet, this place where we live that’s special, because without its existence virtually no life would exist as we know it. But if human beings aren’t at the center of god’s concerns then would humanity even care so much whether there is a god or not?

The universe is incomprehensibly vast to the point of at least seeming infinite, and there may well be other special little corners of it where life, such as on Earth, can exist and flourish. Certainly, from our current ability to observe and explore the universe, it seems as though such places as Earth are not close at hand. As such, there is absolutely no reason not to think that our little corner of the universe is in fact special, though most likely not unique (due to the vastness of the universe). With regards to some “god”, why would it have created such a vast expanse of universe only then to inhabit one little planet of it with life? Seems incredulous to me. Not that life came into existence in one (or various) corners of the universe, because certainly with such infinite vastness almost anything could be possible to exist or happen somewhere within it. But that some god would have created it all only then to put the principle significance (humanity) on one planet in one miniscule corner of that universe does seem nonsensical.

So perhaps we should, as the highest level lifeform on this planet, start to refocus our attention on what’s really important, which is the specialness of this planet with respect to its “just right” position in the universe, in our solar system. It’s not us that some god would come to save from “the end of the world”, because it’s the planet which is more special than we are. And if it’s not humanity that’s special (for anything other than just happening to apparently be the highest evolved species on this planet) then exactly how many people here on Earth would even bother to think there is a god. I mean, most religions have some god faith because people are believed to be at the center of attention or concern for their god. Of course, there have been or still are certain cultures that actually put the natural world more so at the center of their spiritual beliefs, but unfortunately those cultures are not the dominant ones in humanity. But getting back on point,… so if there isn’t anything particularly different that a god would do to save humanity from an end of the world apocalypse; if humanity might not really be god’s central concern, or if in fact a god may well not even exist because why should one necessarily exist if human beings aren’t Its central concern, then just maybe it’s totally in our own hands to make sure that we don’t do serious harm to this special place where we live. “Harm” being things that could threaten the existence of life in general (not only the existence of our own species) on this planet. Sure, perhaps this planet has the capacity to recover, over time, from any damage that we as a species could do to it, but that’s not a reason for us to think that it’s OK if we ourselves eventually cause another mass extinction event to take place here. If we can envision that we could eventually cause such to transpire, then we are 100% guilty of allowing it happen. And finally, sure perhaps humanity can develop the capacity to either go out in the universe to find other such planets as Earth or to create conditions for other places to make them sustain life; however, what’s the sense in that when we already have our special planet right here where we live and all we really need to do is not harm to the point where can no longer sustain life, the natural world, as we know it.
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ThomasHobbes
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Re: Humanity, Earth, and the End of the World Apocalypse

Post by ThomasHobbes »

Your questions are empty words.
Pelegrin_1
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Re: Humanity, Earth, and the End of the World Apocalypse

Post by Pelegrin_1 »

ThomasHobbes wrote: June 4th, 2018, 1:53 pm Your questions are empty words.
Which questions? I think the principle one may have been about a clarification as to what or whether "the end of the world apocalypse" may mean something different to many people from what I described in the OP. Obviously, the complete OP was relating to a relatively specific interpretation as to what "the end of the world" means in a religious context. Therefore, an immediate argument against anything I elaborated upon in the OP would be to discredit what I interpreted "the end of the world" to mean. Not that that in itself would necessarily end any discussion on the topic, as it would then depend on what alternative interpretation(s) might be offered. But anyway, there's nothing too much more "empty" than your post above.

I suppose you could reply next by saying: 'You can't make something from nothing!' But then I could reply with the universal question: Where did god or the universe come from? :)
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ThomasHobbes
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Re: Humanity, Earth, and the End of the World Apocalypse

Post by ThomasHobbes »

Pelegrin_1 wrote: June 4th, 2018, 2:13 pm
ThomasHobbes wrote: June 4th, 2018, 1:53 pm Your questions are empty words.
Which questions?
All of them
I think the principle one may have been about a clarification as to what or whether "the end of the world apocalypse" may mean something different to many people from what I described in the OP.
It's meaningless.
The future is unknowable, and since ""the end of the world apocalypse" is about the future, it's just a primitive myth.
Obviously, the complete OP was relating to a relatively specific interpretation as to what "the end of the world" means in a religious context. Therefore, an immediate argument against anything I elaborated upon in the OP would be to discredit what I interpreted "the end of the world" to mean.
It's meaningless. Hence empty.
You might as well ask how many eggs dragon lay in a typical clutch.
Not that that in itself would necessarily end any discussion on the topic, as it would then depend on what alternative interpretation(s) might be offered. But anyway, there's nothing too much more "empty" than your post above.

I suppose you could reply next by saying: 'You can't make something from nothing!' But then I could reply with the universal question: Where did god or the universe come from? :)
No I would make no such reply, and your answer would still be empty, like your questions.
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ThomasHobbes
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Re: Humanity, Earth, and the End of the World Apocalypse

Post by ThomasHobbes »

Why don't you ask yourself where you got such a silly idea?
Pelegrin_1
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Re: Humanity, Earth, and the End of the World Apocalypse

Post by Pelegrin_1 »

ThomasHobbes wrote: June 4th, 2018, 2:45 pm Why don't you ask yourself where you got such a silly idea?
Well yes, in fact it may very well be a silly idea, this "end of the world" thinking and that eventually there will be some God that comes to save us. If in fact you think it's a silly futuristic idea then in fact this thread was not intended for you. And, in fact, I think you could very well interpret by the OP that I too think of it as at least a misguided idea. If humanity is or should be worried about such a thing, it's for us to see what if anything we can do to prevent it, if we deem ourselves to be the potential cause of it. But as I just said, it seems obvious that this thread was not directed at anyone who thinks as you do, and I personally have no argument, that I've yet to see, contrary to what appears to be your personal views on the topic.
Pelegrin_1
Posts: 107
Joined: October 11th, 2013, 10:48 am

Re: Humanity, Earth, and the End of the World Apocalypse

Post by Pelegrin_1 »

ThomasHobbes wrote: June 4th, 2018, 2:44 pm
Pelegrin_1 wrote: June 4th, 2018, 2:13 pm Just a reply to that specific comment...

I haven't been hanging around here much lately, and don't have much history of hanging around here in general, but have all the "primitives" either been banned from the site or just don't frequent it any more?
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