If there is a God, why is there evil?

[Dark Matter]

True, and they do that even though there is absolutely no reason to believe that matter is all there is or at least the bottom line.

[Anthony Edgar]

Meanwhile embracing ancient superstitions is hardly sign of good mental health, and is often indicated in psychopathology.

Let me guess, these psychopathologists consider to the Bible to be "ancient superstition", right? In that case, the matter is settled; the psychopathologists have spoken! All hail the Psychopathologists, Omniscient Masters of the Universe!

[Wurkinitout]

This question depends on the definition of God.

If God (with a capital letter) is seen as a conscious being then the question is valid (and difficult to answer).

If god is not a being or an entity, but instead is a concept (such as science, nature, destiny etc) then there is no need to ask the question. For example, you might say that all creation follows the laws of science, but you wouldn't ask why science allows evil to occur.

Most original religious text allows for god to be a concept rather than an entity, (try reading the Old Testament replacing each instance of the word 'God' with the word 'nature' , you'll find it makes at least if not more sense) but populist interpretation has assumed that God is a being hence the difficult questions such as this one.

[Renee]

Let me guess, these psychopathologists consider to the Bible to be "ancient superstition", right?

Well, Anthony Edgar, what else can YOU consider the Bible to be?

An eyewitness deposition?

The Word of God?

The Divine Revelation?

-------------

I don't think it's an eyewitness deposition, as the earliest surviving copy of the document is not written by the eyewitnesses. Maybe there had been legends; but the eyewitnesses have not left any record of the events. And certainly not sworn-in records.

I don't think it's a word of god. God's English (even in translation) must be way better than the language and content of the book. The book contains contradictions, and nonsensical elements. God would not make such mistakes, an omniscient god, at least.

Divine revelation? I don' think so. It tells us how to live our lives to make ourselves a spot in the afterlife; but unless you believe it, you can't believe it. There is competition for the same eventuality by other authors, and frankly speaking, I don't think anyone has the right to choose for someone else which one to believe. One thing one should expect of god, is to be CONSISTENT in his revelations. But he is not. A divine revelation that tells you one thing on one hand, and its opposite on the other hand, loses its status as a revelation, as nothing is revealed if opposing instructions are given for the same scenario.

[Anthony Edgar]

Let me guess, these psychopathologists consider to the Bible to be "ancient superstition", right?

Well, Anthony Edgar, what else can YOU consider the Bible to be?

An eyewitness deposition?

The Word of God?

The Divine Revelation?

Well, I used to consider the Bible to be the Word of God and divine revealation.  But the Psychopathologists have spoken, and now I have to accept that the Bible is superstition and that I was mentality ill for believing in it (if I stop believing in it, will I still be mentally ill?). The Pyschopathologists know EVERYTHING!  In short, they are the Masters of the Universe.  I must obey them.

-- Updated December 2nd, 2016, 4:43 pm to add the following --

Let me guess, these psychopathologists consider to the Bible to be "ancient superstition", right?

Well, Anthony Edgar, what else can YOU consider the Bible to be?

... not "mentality ill" ... or even metallically ill - I mean, mentally ill.

[Lifeisbutadream]

This question depends on the definition of God.

Partly, yes. Maybe the creator is more than one metaphysical being. Christians count three divine persons, which I equate with three gods. Perhaps there are millions, or billions, of metaphysical beings who worked together to create this universe, which might be compared to the holodeck on the Enterprise (remember Star Trek?). And perhaps these beings voluntarily enter this life through birth, knowing that they will encounter multiple hazards (evils) until they return home after death.

I guess this sounds a little (a lot?) farfetched, but the problem of evil is mitigated if we all entered this life as volunteers and if we consider that, time being relative, our life on earth is but momentary.

Of course, none of this is in the Bible. But then, the Bible writers never claimed that they were writing down the Word of God. But that is another discussion.

[Allopoietic]

Consider that God may not have an agreement with human beings. God may have created a living thoughtless reproducing cell automaton roughly four billion years ago, and watched the living cell pattern evolve descendants that gain the skills needed to build enormous cell colonies in the shapes of thoughtful people. Evolution is a learning process that involves functions rather than abstractions. The cell automatons that self-assemble into human people have know idea that they have enabled a being able to think abstractly, know pain, and joy, and beauty, and fear. If God made cells, and cells built us due to the way evolution happened to go, then God is not responsible for human actions. God may have compassion for people, but meddling makes God responsible for the changes made. If I were God and wanted to remain good, I think I would advise rather than do miracles.

[Qualiam]

There is definitely a God for the simple reason that God is an idea and all ideas exist. However, for any idea to have "reality" to a mind, it must be "activated" by that mind, and find agreement in the minds it perceives around it.

There is evil only because evil is an idea, but it must also be activated to have reality.

If a mind activates only the pure idea of God and does not activate the idea of evil at all, that mind will perceive a world without evil.

[Socrates Tea]

someone told me that God is bound by logic, and so only nearly omnipotent, and that, while this idea is not satisfying, he said that God allows evil in order to make a greater good possible, because he can't bring it about with direct power, but only through the appliacation of power under logic.

The key to getting at least some satisfaction out of this argument is to understand why God's omnipotence would be hindered by logic...I can kind of see it...anyway...it's all perfectly logical anyway, but like most things that at perfectly logical - not very consoling...

[Qualiam]

If we have it given that there is a God, and we still perceive evil, perhaps we need to reconsider some assumptions we have about God and about ourselves.

Let's also have it given that God is a perfect being, able to create anything at all. Would He not create perfect beings who were also able to create anything at all?

And would these perfect beings that He created be limited physical beings, subject to suffering, sickness and death? I don't think so.

The beings that God might create would be immortal beings like Himself, non-physical, invulnerable and creative, joyful and unlimited.

They might think of creating a limited world where they could pretend to be limited, physical beings, susceptible to suffering, sickness, conflict and death. They might imagine there was such a thing as evil, just for the entertainment value of it.

Is that not exactly what we humans do, within our limited abilities? We watch a sci-fi movie about evil aliens invading Earth, while at some level, we realize there was a whole team of creators -- actors, directors, producers -- having great fun imagining that there really were such evil aliens. Screen-writers rack their brains to come up with new evils.

Perhaps there really is no such thing as evil. Maybe it is only a concept that unlimited, immortal, invincible beings made up just to amuse themselves. Sure, it does not seem amusing when it is happening to an individual down here on the game board of the Earth. But then why do we have individuals who voluntarily seek out and play video games where evil is abundant and blood is free to spill? Why do murder mystery novels fill the shelves of libraries, and movies about crime and evil continue to be made and well received? Humans enjoy evil. But only because at the deepest level, they know it is not true and does not exist at all.

[Allopoietic]

Good and evil are social terms. Robinson Crusoe alone on his island could act out his inclinations without being good or evil. When the man, Friday, came on the scene, good and evil become possible as the two accept an unwritten social contract. Good and evil require intellectual awareness of choices. Living things that form societies without intellect i.e.: cells, ants, and termites, do neither good nor evil because they only express what they are as automatons. They cannot modify their behavior by what they know. If God creates life as a three-dimensional cell automaton over three billion years ago, God is responsible for that first cell. If God does not interfere and allows the first cell to express one of many possible happenstance patterns as she begins bio-tessellation of the Earth, then good and evil do not become possible until her living pattern produces intellectual beings. By that time God has minuscule responsibility for creatures that have through happenstance evolved intellect. God can communicate with some individuals and make recommendation as to how to get along with other people, but God is only distantly responsible for the drives that cause their behaviors. People create a god that is like us, but God may be entirely different if life has been here a long, long time.

[-0+]

If there is a God, why is there evil?

Good depends on evil for its existence. How can anything be "good" without "evil" things to compare?

We can turn the opening question around: If there is no God, why is there evil? What sense does evil make without God (or godliness) to accompany this?

What do questions of God's existence have to do with questions of evil?

We can simply ask: Why is there evil? What is evil? Does evil really exist? Can evil be objectively measured or does evil only exist in the imaginations of people?

Why do bad things happen to good people?

Do bad things really happen to good people? Why do people think bad things happen to them? Why do people think they are good?

Why is there so much needless suffering in the world, from natural disasters and such?

Suffering drives change and development. If there was no suffering and everyone was totally comfortable with their life as it is, what would motivate people to try different ways of living, explore new territory, invent new things?

There may so much needless suffering in the world because people prefer to suffer (or indulge in sources of suffering) than end their suffering.

[Iapetus]

Reply to Anthony Edgar:

(To Renee)
Well, I used to consider the Bible to be the Word of God and divine revealation. But the Psychopathologists have spoken, and now I have to accept that the Bible is superstition and that I was mentality ill for believing in it (if I stop believing in it, will I still be mentally ill?). The Pyschopathologists know EVERYTHING! In short, they are the Masters of the Universe. I must obey them.

You have already told me, with no prompting, that God may or may not be a fantasy. You have refused, on four separate occasions, to tell me if your duty is to do what you are told according to Catholic doctrine. You have refused, on four separate occasions, to tell me whether or not you consider it reasonable to think for yourself. Yet you have also provided me with an example where you appear to disagree with Catholic dogma; you criticised ‘atheist mirages’ regarding morality when – according to you – Catholic dogma teaches that you should accept other sources of morality. You declined to address this contradiction.

Now you have decided to play up psychopathologists and Masters of the Universe. Your sarcasm does not serve you well. It is another evasion.

[Ace9]

All things are possible in all possible worlds,...so the existence of god as described in the bible is possible. Is it likely? Without any means to quantify the probability of such a thing, we would need to relegate the question to a belief for the time being.

...as for evil, this is a word we use to describe the actions and behaviors of our fellow humans that our brains recognize as detrimental to individual survival. The brain is always on guard. Maybe the belief in God is our conscious awareness, with denial in full bloom, to assuage the nature of our being for doing bad things. A source of comfort in the struggle for existence.

[Qualiam]

God is real. But evil is not.

I believe the human mind has created this universe based upon the ideas of separation and conflict. We perceive evil because we are attracted to conflict. Just try to publish a novel or make a movie with no conflict in it. Just try turning off the TV when a tragedy is reported, before they get to the details.

I am not cynical, but just the opposite. I believe this world must be a construct of the human mind, and not of God. So the evil perceived here is of our own choice. Essentially, we are dreaming, which is a view of some eastern philosophies. So the evil perceived is not real.

Eventually, I believe, we will become aware that we are dreaming and become lucid in the dream. We will realize that we are not victims of an uncaring universe, nor at the mercy of evil people. We will remember that we cannot really be hurt. We will recognize our true nature, which I call a pure idea, and some would call spirit. Timeless, unchangeable and innocent of all harm.