Einstein's terrible letter to the US President

Have philosophical discussions about politics, law, and government.
Featured Article: Definition of Freedom - What Freedom Means to Me
Post Reply
User avatar
Empiricist-Bruno
Moderator
Posts: 582
Joined: July 15th, 2014, 1:52 pm
Favorite Philosopher: Berkeley
Location: Toronto
Contact:

Einstein's terrible letter to the US President

Post by Empiricist-Bruno »

Instead of launching us in a new arms race, by trying to build the bomb before the Germans had theirs why didn't he simply argued that it was urgent to win the war because possible new german bombs might obliterate the Allies? Why didn't Einstein realise that nukes are not weapons but rather they are civilization destroying things, the kind of things that only a morally bankrupt person would think of using? In this respect hasn't Hitler won the war and now with Trump, the nukes are on his side?
Watch out for the hidden paradoxes around you!
User avatar
Albert Tatlock
Posts: 183
Joined: October 15th, 2017, 3:23 pm

Re: Einstein's terrible letter to the US President

Post by Albert Tatlock »

I can't think of any way in which Hitler could be said to have won the war.
User avatar
Empiricist-Bruno
Moderator
Posts: 582
Joined: July 15th, 2014, 1:52 pm
Favorite Philosopher: Berkeley
Location: Toronto
Contact:

Re: Einstein's terrible letter to the US President

Post by Empiricist-Bruno »

I'm sorry to hear that.

Hitler is two things, a human being (I presume) and he also was the head of fascim in his time. As the head of fascism, he is resurected in Trump. It's now Hitler's team acting up in the USA. Just like nobody killed and defeated Jesus by killing him, Hitler lives on as his views are being adopted by the very nation that helped to wipe him out.

Now, can't you still think of Hitler as victorious today Tatlock?

Hitler failed because he didn't have nuclear weapons. The USA is now planning to win for him. I have read reports that after Hitler survived his assassination attempt in his bunker, he claimed to be immortal, just like Jesus had before him. If what he stood for had died with him then yes, I could imagine that WW2 is now over but I really don't think it is over.

As long as the world isn't completely destroyed by war or nuclear bombs, or that one great race or nation isn't dominating all the others by violence and violent means, then the fight against Hitler still rages on.

So if Hitler is now taking commend of the greatest military in the world, the organization that forced him to disappear for a while, then you can say that people were wrong to think that the war ended with the apparent defeat of his groups. He tricked them and now he is on top. He may still not win the war, but he sure seems to have a powerful way to impose his vision at the moment.

But it's okay, you can think he lost the war then and not see him lurking behind you. Many people are that way, to my regret.
Watch out for the hidden paradoxes around you!
User avatar
Albert Tatlock
Posts: 183
Joined: October 15th, 2017, 3:23 pm

Re: Einstein's terrible letter to the US President

Post by Albert Tatlock »

Empiricist-Bruno wrote: Hitler is two things,
Only two? I think Hitler may have been more complex than you imagine, Bruno.
As the head of fascism, he is resurected in Trump.
I'm sure there are many characters from history that resemble Trump more closely than Hitler.
Hitler lives on as his views are being adopted by the very nation that helped to wipe him out.
I remember Trump talking about building a wall and draining the swamp but I must have missed the bit about breeding a racially pure population and building death camps to dispose of the rest.
Now, can't you still think of Hitler as victorious today Tatlock?
No, I can't, Bruno. Hitler wasn't the only person to hold the views he did. He wasn't the first person either and the fact that there are still people with similar views doesn't amount to them being reincarnations of him.
I have read reports that after Hitler survived his assassination attempt in his bunker, he claimed to be immortal, just like Jesus had before him.
Well they both turned out to be wrong, didn't they?
If what he stood for had died with him then yes, I could imagine that WW2 is now over but I really don't think it is over.
And what did he stand for that is being perpetuated to such an extent as to cause you such concerns?
So if Hitler is now taking commend of the greatest military in the world,
Hitler is dead, Bruno. The World is full of tyrants and always has been. The only thing different about Hitler is that he managed to get himself into a position that made it possible for him to have a significant impact on the rest of the World. I don't know what Trump would do if he had complete and unrestrained power but I don't see what reason there is to think he would try to emulate Hitler. Trump will come and go like all the rest.
Alias
Posts: 3119
Joined: November 26th, 2011, 8:10 pm
Favorite Philosopher: Terry Pratchett

Re: Einstein's terrible letter to the US President

Post by Alias »

Empiricist-Bruno wrote:Instead of launching us in a new arms race, by trying to build the bomb before the Germans had theirs why didn't he simply argued that it was urgent to win the war because possible new german bombs might obliterate the Allies?
Because he didn't know. He and his fellow scientists, mainly Szilard, who was closer to the research, were merely speculating about Hitler's plans and what his scientists might be capable of producing and delivering.
One crucial issue was access to the ore, which the German command seemed about to corner - and they thought the US should deny them a monopoly, while securing its own sources. Given their excellent reasons to fear the Reich, this argument must have seemed persuasive to European-born and educated men. BTW - it's not Einstein's letter.

This is August 1939; the war hasn't begun yet; it scope and progress complete unknowns; the USA has no intention of getting involved and won't even declare war for over two years.
They recommend vigilance, preparedness and research, nothing more.
upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/ ... letter.png
Why didn't Einstein realise that nukes are not weapons but rather they are civilization destroying things, the kind of things that only a morally bankrupt person would think of using?
He did. Once the bomb existed. By 1945, the project was so surrounded by official secrecy that he wouldn't even know what they were doing, how successfully, or what he ought to warn the president about. Nobody knew their eventual destructive power.
At the time of the first letter to Roosevelt, nobody had made one yet or was even sure whether they could.

Why do you demand clairvoyance from physicists - when statesmen, prelates, generals and even philosophers show so little foresight?

In this respect hasn't Hitler won the war and now with Trump, the nukes are on his side?
This has nothing to do with the period or the subject. America created Trump and Americans - free, successful, prosperous Americans with no coercive pressures whatever - created the political climate wherein an elderly spoiled toddler could turn into an unchecked, unbalanced president.
Projecting the present state of affairs that far back; trying to attribute causes and apportion blame two or three generations ago, without reference to a thousand unrelated factors, events and personalities between then and now, is at best uninformative. It's far too easy to second-guess history.
User avatar
Burning ghost
Posts: 3065
Joined: February 27th, 2016, 3:10 am

Re: Einstein's terrible letter to the US President

Post by Burning ghost »

Bruno -

I imagine Einstein understood the use of 'speaking softly whilst wielding a big stick'? We could just as easily put all our eggs in one basket and pray to some figment of our imaginations (I gather you'd go for the later Bruno?)

Is there a point to this thread? Don't beat around the bush with a rather tenuous comparison of Hitler and Trump. Simply say what's on your mind and get to the point.
AKA badgerjelly
Post Reply

Return to “Philosophy of Politics”

2023/2024 Philosophy Books of the Month

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise
by John K Danenbarger
January 2023

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul
by Mitzi Perdue
February 2023

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness
by Chet Shupe
March 2023

The Unfakeable Code®

The Unfakeable Code®
by Tony Jeton Selimi
April 2023

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are
by Alan Watts
May 2023

Killing Abel

Killing Abel
by Michael Tieman
June 2023

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead
by E. Alan Fleischauer
July 2023

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough
by Mark Unger
August 2023

Predictably Irrational

Predictably Irrational
by Dan Ariely
September 2023

Artwords

Artwords
by Beatriz M. Robles
November 2023

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope
by Dr. Randy Ross
December 2023

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes
by Ali Master
February 2024

2022 Philosophy Books of the Month

Emotional Intelligence At Work

Emotional Intelligence At Work
by Richard M Contino & Penelope J Holt
January 2022

Free Will, Do You Have It?

Free Will, Do You Have It?
by Albertus Kral
February 2022

My Enemy in Vietnam

My Enemy in Vietnam
by Billy Springer
March 2022

2X2 on the Ark

2X2 on the Ark
by Mary J Giuffra, PhD
April 2022

The Maestro Monologue

The Maestro Monologue
by Rob White
May 2022

What Makes America Great

What Makes America Great
by Bob Dowell
June 2022

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!
by Jerry Durr
July 2022

Living in Color

Living in Color
by Mike Murphy
August 2022 (tentative)

The Not So Great American Novel

The Not So Great American Novel
by James E Doucette
September 2022

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches
by John N. (Jake) Ferris
October 2022

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All
by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
November 2022

The Smartest Person in the Room: The Root Cause and New Solution for Cybersecurity

The Smartest Person in the Room
by Christian Espinosa
December 2022

2021 Philosophy Books of the Month

The Biblical Clock: The Untold Secrets Linking the Universe and Humanity with God's Plan

The Biblical Clock
by Daniel Friedmann
March 2021

Wilderness Cry: A Scientific and Philosophical Approach to Understanding God and the Universe

Wilderness Cry
by Dr. Hilary L Hunt M.D.
April 2021

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute: Tools To Spark Your Dream And Ignite Your Follow-Through

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute
by Jeff Meyer
May 2021

Surviving the Business of Healthcare: Knowledge is Power

Surviving the Business of Healthcare
by Barbara Galutia Regis M.S. PA-C
June 2021

Winning the War on Cancer: The Epic Journey Towards a Natural Cure

Winning the War on Cancer
by Sylvie Beljanski
July 2021

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream
by Dr Frank L Douglas
August 2021

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts
by Mark L. Wdowiak
September 2021

The Preppers Medical Handbook

The Preppers Medical Handbook
by Dr. William W Forgey M.D.
October 2021

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress: A Practical Guide

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress
by Dr. Gustavo Kinrys, MD
November 2021

Dream For Peace: An Ambassador Memoir

Dream For Peace
by Dr. Ghoulem Berrah
December 2021