Sense memory

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BelieveNothing
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Sense memory

Post by BelieveNothing »

If you remember to forget how to forget then you can forget to remind yourself, but if you forget to remember how to remember then you may as well remember to forget about it. Mistakes are meant to be learned from in my opinion, but how is it better to learn from other people's mistakes? How long does it take for a memory to fade away? Im just trying to provoke a little group discussion with my first line and two related questions..
Reality is not all in your mind.
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Hansvro
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Re: Sense memory

Post by Hansvro »

For the first question.
So many of my students give presentations and they are willing to try and err from beginning to end, while so many guidelines are available on how to give a good presentation, often written by people who have a large experience of trial and errors on the topic. I am not sure this answers the question but I think it is an illustration how we can benefit of learning from other people's mistakes, without having to go through the mistakes ourselves and have people listening to our poor presentations because we have not taken the effort to learn from other's mistakes.
For the second question.
I think it really depends on the intensity of the emotion associated with the memory. I think time and reasoning help us to forget the bitter parts of sad memories and everything tends to get some glory in the distant past. We may never forget the facts but the negative emotions associated with them tend to fade sometimes faster than we'd expect.
I am not sure I qualify to answer any of the questions but after reading the post, these were the thoughts provoked by it.
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LuckyR
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Re: Sense memory

Post by LuckyR »

Any parent knows that we try to give our kids a shortcut to success by giving them the answers to life's problems, but try as we might, kids learn lessons better by trying and failing on their own than by being told what the answer is in the absence of personal experience.
"As usual... it depends."
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BelieveNothing
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Re: Sense memory

Post by BelieveNothing »

Thanks.
I guess it's a pity more can't be learned from success stories than from mistakes.. Or am i mistaken?
Does anyone believe that more can be learned from other people's achievements than from personal trial and error?
I would hope that good results as far as learning is concerned could be shared but I personally believe that most people lie or deceive regularly for less altruistic incentives.

Our dreams are strange and re-arrange
the mess inside our minds,
just let me say this if i may?
"the truth is hard to find"
Reality is not all in your mind.
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LuckyR
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Re: Sense memory

Post by LuckyR »

BelieveNothing wrote:Thanks.
I guess it's a pity more can't be learned from success stories than from mistakes.. Or am i mistaken?
Does anyone believe that more can be learned from other people's achievements than from personal trial and error?
I would hope that good results as far as learning is concerned could be shared but I personally believe that most people lie or deceive regularly for less altruistic incentives.

Our dreams are strange and re-arrange
the mess inside our minds,
just let me say this if i may?
"the truth is hard to find"
It is possible to learn from the mistakes of others, but since other's experiences are less emotionally compelling, they are vulnerable to being underappreciated. One can make the conscious effort to overcome this and give these lessons their logical importance, even if there is not the personal connection, but in my experience it requires that specific effort.
"As usual... it depends."
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Sy Borg
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Re: Sense memory

Post by Sy Borg »

LuckyR wrote:
BelieveNothing wrote:Thanks.
I guess it's a pity more can't be learned from success stories than from mistakes.. Or am i mistaken?
Does anyone believe that more can be learned from other people's achievements than from personal trial and error?
I would hope that good results as far as learning is concerned could be shared but I personally believe that most people lie or deceive regularly for less altruistic incentives.

Our dreams are strange and re-arrange
the mess inside our minds,
just let me say this if i may?
"the truth is hard to find"
It is possible to learn from the mistakes of others, but since other's experiences are less emotionally compelling, they are vulnerable to being underappreciated. One can make the conscious effort to overcome this and give these lessons their logical importance, even if there is not the personal connection, but in my experience it requires that specific effort.
Good point. Also note that another's account of an experience, no matter how thorough and detailed, will necessarily be far sketchier than their actual experience. Learning by doing provides information that theory cannot, as per the Mary's Room thought experiment (the details of which are readily Googlable, if need be).

Also note that in nature there's many more ways to fail than to succeed, eg. your body's atoms can be configured in a few ways to create a functional human system but there are countless ways of arranging those same atoms into a non functional mess.
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LuckyR
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Re: Sense memory

Post by LuckyR »

Greta wrote:
LuckyR wrote: (Nested quote removed.)


It is possible to learn from the mistakes of others, but since other's experiences are less emotionally compelling, they are vulnerable to being underappreciated. One can make the conscious effort to overcome this and give these lessons their logical importance, even if there is not the personal connection, but in my experience it requires that specific effort.
Good point. Also note that another's account of an experience, no matter how thorough and detailed, will necessarily be far sketchier than their actual experience. Learning by doing provides information that theory cannot, as per the Mary's Room thought experiment (the details of which are readily Googlable, if need be).

Also note that in nature there's many more ways to fail than to succeed, eg. your body's atoms can be configured in a few ways to create a functional human system but there are countless ways of arranging those same atoms into a non functional mess.
Well, yes and no. The experience itself will be, but the lessons to be learned can be quite similar. I am thinking specifically about my personal experience in training. In my profession, those who are learning do so with little to no legal vulnerability should things go awry. Thus the advice to learn from other people's mistakes when in training so that (hopefully) you don't have to repeat them later when you will be legally liable. This actually works quite well.

Another example is my work on the QA Committee at my former facility. I reviewed or listened to a review of every single mistake or bad outcome for over 10 years and I made an effort to use what I learned to prevent mistakes for myself. Thus I could learn from mistakes, they just didn't have to be my mistakes.
"As usual... it depends."
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