Where To Begin

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Ashurean
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Where To Begin

Post by Ashurean » January 25th, 2018, 3:09 pm

We live in troubled times, especially here in the US of A. We have a shooting on every day on average, we have a President who uses twitter to threaten other world leaders and sling around petty insults, common sense isn't so common anymore. People are rejecting science based on uninformed opinions. The rule of law is being enforced at the cost of the good of the individual. With so many problems, where does one start when looking for solutions? So many of these issues are equally terrible and deserve attention, but if everything comes first, nothing does. Screaming controversy and making displays of personal bias threaten to damage any chance of meaningful rationalization on important topics in the places they matter, such as in government.
So, where do we begin?

Littlemoon
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Re: Where To Begin

Post by Littlemoon » January 25th, 2018, 7:57 pm

I'd say we begin with education. I think that's whats wrong in USA. People are uneducated and use bits and pieces of knowledge to sustain their opinions.
If we take a look at the countries with high educated indexes, you will see their government also reflects that, meaning, people actually in front of one will have a more educated view over the rest.

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Ashurean
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Re: Where To Begin

Post by Ashurean » January 25th, 2018, 9:19 pm

Littlemoon wrote:
January 25th, 2018, 7:57 pm
I'd say we begin with education. I think that's whats wrong in USA. People are uneducated and use bits and pieces of knowledge to sustain their opinions.
If we take a look at the countries with high educated indexes, you will see their government also reflects that, meaning, people actually in front of one will have a more educated view over the rest.
I like that answer a lot. My only issue with it is, in the face of a changing climate and unstable international politics, do we have the time properly re-educate and instate a new generation in power before SHTF

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Warden Majere
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Re: Where To Begin

Post by Warden Majere » January 27th, 2018, 6:18 am

Perhaps we begin by ending... Hear me out here. In my humble opinion, as a born and raised American, our country cannot be saved. We are torn, divided, angry, and tend towards sensationalism and ignorance. The economy is screwed, our politics are corrupt, and pretty much the entire world sees us as warmongers. Education is rigged, with more graduates finding themselves flipping burgers, and using minimum wage to pay off a mountain of debt for the rest of their lives. White people accuse black people of being too sensitive, while black people throw around the phrase "white privelage". All the while we scream "build that wall". Not too mention the fear that the public holds for our protectors, our civil servants, the police.
As of now, I see no way back, and no way forward for America. The people are too divided, and we kept that way intentionally, as controversy makes good press. We are trillions of dollars in debt to foreign powers, and our leader is incompetent. The end that I see for the American Empire is a fate that it has seen once before, Civil War. The difference is that we don't have a leader capable of holding us all together, as Lincoln did.
Though, this may all just be the poison that flourishes when living without the sight of hope. I may simply look too closely at what is wrong, and ignore what is going well. While this may be so, it is simply what I see. So, let's bail to Canada! :P

Sincerely,
Raistlin

Littlemoon
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Re: Where To Begin

Post by Littlemoon » January 27th, 2018, 5:53 pm

Ashurean wrote:
January 25th, 2018, 9:19 pm
Littlemoon wrote:
January 25th, 2018, 7:57 pm
I'd say we begin with education. I think that's whats wrong in USA. People are uneducated and use bits and pieces of knowledge to sustain their opinions.
If we take a look at the countries with high educated indexes, you will see their government also reflects that, meaning, people actually in front of one will have a more educated view over the rest.
I like that answer a lot. My only issue with it is, in the face of a changing climate and unstable international politics, do we have the time properly re-educate and instate a new generation in power before SHTF
Well climate change is inevitable. There is a projection about the political measures to try and stagnate global warming. For the moment, we are hitting the 2ºC rise which, in inhospitable lands like Siberia its, roughly, an extra 4ºC. Currently we are trying NOT to reach that mark, right? So what was interesting (and sad I might add) in the chart that shows that projection is that, in the most optimistic view, no matter the political measures governments apply, earth will still hit that mark.
What we should be doing, which is the most realistic scenario, is damage control and learn and adapt to these extreme weather patterns we are starting to see. These floods, tornadoes etc should only happen once in 100 years, but we are seeing these extreme weather patterns more frequently. Every year that passes we are breaking records. And it is sad that we have hit a point that the only thing we can do is damage control. If we want to make a change, it won't impact now nor in 50 years. We need to start educating our children now if we want to have a reverse the situation in 100 years.

Here is the chart:

https://www.vox.com/cards/global-warmin ... -continues

That chart was taken from IPCC which is a very credible source. It studies the impact of political measures in the environment and much more. Should you be interested here is the link: http://www.ipcc.ch/

As you can see in that chart from IPCC, no matter what we do, we will have an increase of temperature. Blue is the most optimistic scenario.

What amazes me is these talks about colonizing Mars and attempt of making Mars like earth, which is insane if you really think about it. Not only, if possible of course, we would be transforming Mars into Earth and destroying what is Mars, we would also be destroying this Mars like Earth because we already destroyed our Earth. It's insane.
Unfortunately, I think people will realize and value Earth when its too late. To think we were fortunate enough to have a planet that gathered all the resources and climate for life, only ro destroy it in a matter of years.

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Ashurean
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Re: Where To Begin

Post by Ashurean » January 28th, 2018, 11:05 pm

Littlemoon wrote:
January 27th, 2018, 5:53 pm


What amazes me is these talks about colonizing Mars and attempt of making Mars like earth, which is insane if you really think about it. Not only, if possible of course, we would be transforming Mars into Earth and destroying what is Mars, we would also be destroying this Mars like Earth because we already destroyed our Earth. It's insane.
Unfortunately, I think people will realize and value Earth when its too late. To think we were fortunate enough to have a planet that gathered all the resources and climate for life, only ro destroy it in a matter of years.
While the Mars idea is viable, the technologies needed have not yet been developed to either terraform or build a long-standing colony on another planet. The aspect of time in problems such as these seem to be things most people tend to ignore for one reason or another. I agree with you entirely, that people take our little biosphere for granted and regard it as something that will always be and as something that cannot be harmed or changed by them personally. People now are realizing and valuing Earth, however, it may already be too late to avoid major shifts already set into motion by two centuries of activity. Although, I disagree with you saying that we're "destroying it", because we aren't. We're merely forcing the system to change and adapt to our presence, it's rebalancing. The only thing we have a chance of destroying is ourselves and any other species too slow to adapt, the world will go on, with or without us.

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LuckyR
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Re: Where To Begin

Post by LuckyR » January 31st, 2018, 5:15 pm

Ashurean wrote:
January 25th, 2018, 3:09 pm
We live in troubled times, especially here in the US of A. We have a shooting on every day on average, we have a President who uses twitter to threaten other world leaders and sling around petty insults, common sense isn't so common anymore. People are rejecting science based on uninformed opinions. The rule of law is being enforced at the cost of the good of the individual. With so many problems, where does one start when looking for solutions? So many of these issues are equally terrible and deserve attention, but if everything comes first, nothing does. Screaming controversy and making displays of personal bias threaten to damage any chance of meaningful rationalization on important topics in the places they matter, such as in government.
So, where do we begin?
If I were you I would start by dropping cable TV news and picking up a history book. Violence is at a historical low, there are examples of significantly worse presidents, understanding of science and cause and effect is much higher than previous eras etc.

To a significant minority of folks, the sky is always falling, which they are only too happy to tell you repetitively.
"As usual... it depends."

milvalos
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Re: Where To Begin

Post by milvalos » February 11th, 2018, 8:03 am

On one hand, the picture of the States sketched above is realistic in general, what makes Mankind virtually unified in the search for a way out of the plight. On the other, millions and millions of human beings own much more than they abundantly need, and they are the kernel of the social machine that brings forth richness while makes the vast majority poorer and poorer.

Where is this powerful minority from ?

Self made women and men were able, through the ages, to climb to the top of society but to no general avail because the past of Mankind was and still is exacting its toll.

The past of Mankind, as I see it, is the ineludible dependance of quasi humans, beings naively immersed in the flow of change, from informations indispensable to the start-up of the process of homination, like farming, melting ... sacrificing ...

The informations are there, in the all, regardless of local conditions, but intermediaries are needed to make them available to the quasi men; and intermediaries there are, of every kind and size, of course including the non-human, anthropomorphic beings divinised or demonised by the ancient human traditions.

If what I just wrote makes sense, it ensues that the sacerdotal classes, visible or disguised, were and still are in charge while unable or unwilling to share the benefits of knowledge.

The military and the professional classes, as I see it, in various ways follow in priests' footsteps cause their feelings and their ideas were priest-made at a paramount extent, just like people's.

All in all, recognising that the majority is defeated and broken, and that it should try and grow in the shadow of the few for a very long time (if available), if not forever, is a realistic start-up when contrasted with the naive, moralistic cries for rights and democracy.

[mlv11fe18 13a03]

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SirBruce
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Re: Where To Begin

Post by SirBruce » August 24th, 2018, 2:39 pm

Where do I begin?
First off, I agree with all previous opinions on this subject except for one little thing: you are all looking the wrong way for answers. Inwards is where the answers lay. The past shows us that humans learn from mistakes. Whether from personal experiences or from other's experiences. Basically, we fail in the present to succeed in the future because we learn from the past. This is the simplest way I can explain what I think. Based on what we experienced, we've changed or evolved our way of thinking and acting consciously or unconsciously (threw teachings and DNA).
With that said, I'm a strong believer of the mojo "Be the change you want to see in the world". By being what you think is the best version of a citizen in your respective community, you will project that image of you onto others. Others will then learn from you and the rest will follow. It's a slow process but as you probably noticed threw our history that humans are pretty slow learners by nature. A quick example of my last assumptions is purely based on the fact that men just started to realize and approve that women are equally different yet so similar to them. Even as I say this, many people still believe otherwise... Anyhow, that's a different subject, just used it as a example.

Second, EDUCATION is the key! But it seems to be corrupted to the core also. Like "milvalos" above points out, the goal for many generations has been to keep people in the dark, in ignorance and numb to the reality they've created for us: Humans are born to work for other humans. They are very good at it also and kept us hooked on this system for ages... While doing so, you can teach and promote any ideas beliefs you desire to someone and future generations...Alternately, I am probably the worst fan of religions (institutional) ( even though I respect individual beliefs whatever they are), but at least education was aiming towards knowledge and enlightenment of children. Maybe they did not do it the right way or even teach the right stuff, but it wasn't a political party that decided what they would learn. What I mean is maybe they weren't doing such a bad job if we compared haha. Jokes aside, nowadays, what kids learn all depends on who's in power. What beliefs they have will be the ones taught.

Finally, because I could go on for hours on the subject, start by opening your friend's eyes, your neighbors' eyes and your familly's eyes to what is really happening around them. The more people know, the less ignorant people will be.

We are learning creatures and will always be. Learn from the past, from others and from yourself but don't be selfish, share your thoughts and make this world a better future for all.
(Sorry for any spelling mistakes, English is not my native language)

A few words from Lennon to give a bit of light to your days :)

"Imagine there's no heaven...
Imagine there's no countries...
And no religion, too...
Imagine no possessions...

Imagine all the people,
Living life in peace
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will live as one

A few words from the song "Imagine" by John Lennon

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