Time Travel

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MrE
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Time Travel

Post by MrE » June 13th, 2018, 1:06 pm

Just wanted to start a general discussion on time travel and everyone's theories or opinions on all topics regarding this - including, but not limited to paradoxes, possibilities, application, favorite time travel movies, etc.

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ThomasHobbes
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Re: Time Travel

Post by ThomasHobbes » June 13th, 2018, 7:41 pm

Time travel is unidirectional.
You can change the speed in which you travel forwards in time, but can NEVER go backwards.
The future is not a place you can visit. The future is a thing you move towards continually.

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Present awareness
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Re: Time Travel

Post by Present awareness » June 13th, 2018, 9:32 pm

It seems to me that time travel is not possible, because time does not exist, outside of a concept. All that there was in the past, is right here right now and all that will be, is right here right now. If you could travel at the speed of light and look at the earth, it would have the same effect as a photograph, there would be no movement and the light would appear to be frozen. When we look a light from a distant galaxy, it takes many light years to get here, so it could be said that we are looking into the past, but the reality is, we are seeing the light which is right here right now.
Even though you can see me, I might not be here.

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Halc
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Re: Time Travel

Post by Halc » June 13th, 2018, 10:45 pm

Looper (Bruce Willis)

I also like all the repeat-this-day movies (Groundhog, Edge of Tomorrow, Happy Death Day), but not sure if those count.

It's all a crock of course, so fiction is wide open to it.

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chewybrian
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Re: Time Travel

Post by chewybrian » June 14th, 2018, 7:03 am

Present awareness wrote:
June 13th, 2018, 9:32 pm
It seems to me that time travel is not possible, because time does not exist, outside of a concept. All that there was in the past, is right here right now and all that will be, is right here right now. If you could travel at the speed of light and look at the earth, it would have the same effect as a photograph, there would be no movement and the light would appear to be frozen. When we look a light from a distant galaxy, it takes many light years to get here, so it could be said that we are looking into the past, but the reality is, we are seeing the light which is right here right now.
When you discard time, don't speed and motion fall away as well? How does anything else you said make sense after you give up on time (travel, speed, speed of light, light years)?

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Present awareness
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Re: Time Travel

Post by Present awareness » June 14th, 2018, 7:30 am

chewybrian wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 7:03 am
Present awareness wrote:
June 13th, 2018, 9:32 pm
It seems to me that time travel is not possible, because time does not exist, outside of a concept. All that there was in the past, is right here right now and all that will be, is right here right now. If you could travel at the speed of light and look at the earth, it would have the same effect as a photograph, there would be no movement and the light would appear to be frozen. When we look a light from a distant galaxy, it takes many light years to get here, so it could be said that we are looking into the past, but the reality is, we are seeing the light which is right here right now.
When you discard time, don't speed and motion fall away as well? How does anything else you said make sense after you give up on time (travel, speed, speed of light, light years)?
I would not discard time, it is a very useful concept! I just don’t believe it is possible to travel through a concept.
Even though you can see me, I might not be here.

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chewybrian
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Re: Time Travel

Post by chewybrian » June 14th, 2018, 8:01 am

Present awareness wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 7:30 am
I would not discard time, it is a very useful concept! I just don’t believe it is possible to travel through a concept.
Well, perhaps I took "time does not exist" out of context, but you did say that. Don't you travel distances, and isn't distance just a concept, no more or less real or measurable than time? None of the other concepts you are using seem to be more or less valid than time.

Didn't I just travel through time as I typed this reply?

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Present awareness
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Re: Time Travel

Post by Present awareness » June 14th, 2018, 9:12 am

chewybrian wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 8:01 am
Present awareness wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 7:30 am
I would not discard time, it is a very useful concept! I just don’t believe it is possible to travel through a concept.
Well, perhaps I took "time does not exist" out of context, but you did say that. Don't you travel distances, and isn't distance just a concept, no more or less real or measurable than time? None of the other concepts you are using seem to be more or less valid than time.

Didn't I just travel through time as I typed this reply?
It was the present moment when you read this, it was the present moment when you typed it and it is still the present moment. If you think about it, you will realize that there was never a time in your life when it wasn’t the present moment. When I walk down a road, the path ahead of me is not the future, it is also in the present moment and the path behind me is not the past, it is also still in the present. Looking at where I was or where I’m going may be thought of as past or future, but the reality is, we may never escape this present moment.
Even though you can see me, I might not be here.

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Halc
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Re: Time Travel

Post by Halc » June 14th, 2018, 9:31 am

Present awareness wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 7:30 am
I would not discard time, it is a very useful concept! I just don’t believe it is possible to travel through a concept.
The time in physics is not just a concept. Neither velocity nor the concept of velocity is the amount of distance per a concept.
chewybrian wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 8:01 am
Don't you travel distances, and isn't distance just a concept, no more or less real or measurable than time?

Didn't I just travel through time as I typed this reply?
Depends on definitions, and Present awareness seems to define everything as a concept, seemingly a way to bail out of the question without answering it.

Typically the temporal realists say that the flow of time is real, a subjective view of time. It is a 3D model of space, and things move through it (as you do when you type). You travel more 'with' time than through it, since it is not a substance or dimension through which travel can take place. 'Travel' sort of implies something to which you can opt out. I can choose not to travel to the past, so it would be travel if I had that option. I cannot choose to halt the flow of time, so it isn't really travel when 2017 became 2018.

Physicists need to take more of an objective view of time to keep the mathematics simple. So the model is of 4D spacetime where time is a dimension, not a thing that flows. There now is separation of 2017 from 2018, but nothing at all travels through spacetime. Instead you have a worldline that you trace through it. Velocity becomes the slope of a worldline, not actual movement. So in this sense, asking if time travel is possible is to ask if it is possible for anything to have a discontinuous worldline that is effectively a causal connection from A to B where B is in the past of A.

Quantum experiments have demonstrated the ability to choose to alter experimental results that have been taken in the past, or over faster-than-light conditions, but in no case is information sent to the past or faster than light, and that would be required for time travel.

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chewybrian
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Re: Time Travel

Post by chewybrian » June 14th, 2018, 9:38 am

Present awareness wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 9:12 am
chewybrian wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 8:01 am
Didn't I just travel through time as I typed this reply?
It was the present moment when you read this, it was the present moment when you typed it and it is still the present moment.
By similar logic, I must be in Toledo right now, because I once was there. If I am planning a trip to Paris next year, then I must be there now as well. After all, distance is only a concept, right? Maybe if I make plans to be everywhere, I can become God.

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Halc
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Re: Time Travel

Post by Halc » June 14th, 2018, 9:42 am

Halc wrote:
June 13th, 2018, 10:45 pm
It's all a crock of course, so fiction is wide open to it.
Another one I forgot is Predestination. My favorite part is the song playing on the jukebox in the bar scene.

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Halc
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Re: Time Travel

Post by Halc » June 14th, 2018, 9:45 am

chewybrian wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 9:38 am
Present awareness wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 9:12 am


It was the present moment when you read this, it was the present moment when you typed it and it is still the present moment.
By similar logic, I must be in Toledo right now, because I once was there. If I am planning a trip to Paris next year, then I must be there now as well. After all, distance is only a concept, right? Maybe if I make plans to be everywhere, I can become God.
Yea, I was also playing with similar things.

By this logic, Present-awareness could set his alarm clock to 'the present' since it will be the present when he wants to wake up, and the alarm has no access to his concept of time, so it has nothing else to go on.
Similarly, he has always been 'here', therefore other locations in space are not real since space is only a concept. Complete collapse into solipsism. A bailout position.

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Present awareness
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Re: Time Travel

Post by Present awareness » June 14th, 2018, 9:47 am

chewybrian wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 9:38 am
Present awareness wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 9:12 am


It was the present moment when you read this, it was the present moment when you typed it and it is still the present moment.
By similar logic, I must be in Toledo right now, because I once was there. If I am planning a trip to Paris next year, then I must be there now as well. After all, distance is only a concept, right? Maybe if I make plans to be everywhere, I can become God.
Wherever you go, there you are! Thinking about where you were or where you are going all takes place in your head. The concept of time is very useful for making plans, but an unfortunate and untimely death, would put those plans into a different perspective.
Even though you can see me, I might not be here.

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Halc
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Re: Time Travel

Post by Halc » June 14th, 2018, 10:25 am

Present awareness wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 9:12 am
If you think about it, you will realize that there was never a time in your life when it wasn’t the present moment.
You simply choose to assume this. I claim no proof of such, but I strongly suspect that no moment of my life takes place in the present. One has to beg the answer to assert otherwise. OK, so I am begging a different answer, and thus claim no proof.
Present awareness wrote:
June 14th, 2018, 9:47 am
The concept of time is very useful for making plans, but an unfortunate and untimely death, would put those plans into a different perspective.
My death will not end time or halt my plans. It just halts the making of new plans. The demise of all humanity might end the concept, which ends time only for idealists.

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LuckyR
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Re: Time Travel

Post by LuckyR » June 14th, 2018, 11:05 am

Present awareness wrote:
June 13th, 2018, 9:32 pm
It seems to me that time travel is not possible, because time does not exist, outside of a concept. All that there was in the past, is right here right now and all that will be, is right here right now. If you could travel at the speed of light and look at the earth, it would have the same effect as a photograph, there would be no movement and the light would appear to be frozen. When we look a light from a distant galaxy, it takes many light years to get here, so it could be said that we are looking into the past, but the reality is, we are seeing the light which is right here right now.
Not so much. Folks travel in time not infrequently nowadays.
"As usual... it depends."

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