Debate : a possible improvement

Official website announcements are posted in this forum.

If you have questions, suggestions, or need support or help with anything, please email [email protected].
Post Reply
User avatar
Valentine-turjery
Posts: 57
Joined: January 13th, 2014, 11:18 am

Debate : a possible improvement

Post by Valentine-turjery »

Practically all of the threads I have read during my brief time with the forum have been bustling with personality and opinion. Often, perhaps, rather more opinion-pushing than philosophy is going on, but I'm impressed by the topical focus and scarcity of trolling. Credit should go to the admin and moderators for creating this environment and looking to improve it further.

Right, the sucking-up over with, here is my criticism (followed hurriedly by my proposal): a popular thread can quickly become a melee. In many ways this is a good thing. Reading a thread from front to back gives a fair idea of the spread of differing positions likely to be held on the topic. However, it is difficult to maintain a close and strict focus on the initial question, and to make incremental progress, with so many tangential discussions going on. A slow (and considered) response will become outdated during composition, so posters scramble to be the first to make a counterpoint without taking time to hone it. Eagerness to be read or responded to - desire to be at the heart of the discussion - drives many to an aggressive tone and a sophistic platitude before a tailored argument, because, after all, the effort of a sculpted response might go completely unacknowledged in the frenzy.

As I said, this approach is mainly fine. It is an energetic forum and a lot of good comes from this frantic interchange of ideas. However, I believe a useful addition to the site would be an area where two people could arrange to begin a one-on-one debate. This is the format I envisage:
  • A person creates a topic (a philosophical question or position), and nominates an antagonist.
  • Their opponent accepts (or declines, but it was probably arranged in one of the other forums first).
  • There could be, say, three/five/whatever rounds of debate constrained by a word limit.
  • Debate goes back and forth between the debaters without anybody else being able to comment.
  • After the closing argument, the thread would become available for all to comment on.
In this way, there is an established stream of argument developed for people to comment on.

I am a PHP developer. I've never worked with BB before, but I assume something like that could be developed as a plugin? If there is enough interest, and nobody with the time to produce it themselves, I'd be willing to have a pop.

What do people think?
User avatar
Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
The admin formerly known as Scott
Posts: 5785
Joined: January 20th, 2007, 6:24 pm
Favorite Philosopher: Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
Contact:

Re: Debate : a possible improvement

Post by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes »

There is a forum already for one-on-one debates. I do agree that it could lead to more productive and interesting discussion. Indeed, the things missing are getting two people to actually want to debate using that forum.

As for your specific suggestions, I'm not so sure about the need to nominate an antagonist. I think what might be nice is if we made a place where proposed debate topics could be created by one person wishing to debate one side, and whoever wishes to take on the other side could accept the challenge. Alternatively, we could rip ideas from the Agree or Disagree game, using the most active or most disagreeing topics as a topic for debate.

-- Updated 16 Jan 2014 12:21 pm to add the following --

What we need is a way to repeatedly find two people to debate a specified topic which also means having a way of determining the topic, and presumably a set of rules to guide the discussion (e.g. the things you suggest like word limits and number of rounds).

If you want to whip up a PHP script to do some of this that would be very generous. I won't stop you from making it into a complicated phpBB plugin, but you could likely save yourself quite a bit of effort by making something that works mostly independent of the board software. I can easily create a page that uses the sessions from the forum and I can pass the username, id, etc. to variables for the script to use as needed. Then we could manually start the debate topic on the forums.
My entire political philosophy summed up in one tweet.

"The mind is a wonderful servant but a terrible master."

I believe spiritual freedom (a.k.a. self-discipline) manifests as bravery, confidence, grace, honesty, love, and inner peace.
User avatar
Valentine-turjery
Posts: 57
Joined: January 13th, 2014, 11:18 am

Re: Debate : a possible improvement

Post by Valentine-turjery »

I had a look at that forum for one-to-one debates before I posted the suggestion, but it seemed to be read-only. What is the procedure for posting to that forum currently?

I agree that a kind of staging area would be good. Debates could be organised, scope agreed, and the format decided, as well as allowing potential opponents to ensure they are well suited in terms of knowledge of the subject.

As for deciding the topic for debate, I like the idea of anyone being able to propose a debate on a topic that interests them, rather than having the issue pressed on them. I like to think that the issues might be explored first in the regular forums, before being taken to the more formal one-to-one debate if enough interest is generated and after the subject has been thoroughly frisked.

The reason I suggested nominating (or at least agreeing or accepting) an opponent, is so that the system itself can prevent unruly commenters interrupting the debate too early, rather than moderators having to constantly remove them. But I like the idea that people could comment or appraise the arguments used once the debate is concluded.

As for the rules, I'd like to hear what others thought about that. My instinct is to suggest three or five rounds, with a modest word limit of perhaps 1000 words per round (or a total word count spread over the whole debate per user). In this way we can expect fairly concise and tight answers, and little straying from the question. But then, sometimes there needs to be a bit of back and forth in order to settle matters of definition or understanding. Perhaps that could be done in the main forums or through PM? The important thing would be that the arguments followed and related to the other.

What do people think?

P.S. I'll download phpbb and take a look at possible implementations.
User avatar
Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
The admin formerly known as Scott
Posts: 5785
Joined: January 20th, 2007, 6:24 pm
Favorite Philosopher: Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
Contact:

Re: Debate : a possible improvement

Post by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes »

Valentine-turjery wrote:I had a look at that forum for one-to-one debates before I posted the suggestion, but it seemed to be read-only. What is the procedure for posting to that forum currently?
If two members are looking to have a one-on-one discussion or debate, I create a topic and manually give both users posting privileges in that forum.
My entire political philosophy summed up in one tweet.

"The mind is a wonderful servant but a terrible master."

I believe spiritual freedom (a.k.a. self-discipline) manifests as bravery, confidence, grace, honesty, love, and inner peace.
Post Reply

Return to “Forum Announcements”

2023/2024 Philosophy Books of the Month

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise
by John K Danenbarger
January 2023

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul
by Mitzi Perdue
February 2023

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness
by Chet Shupe
March 2023

The Unfakeable Code®

The Unfakeable Code®
by Tony Jeton Selimi
April 2023

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are
by Alan Watts
May 2023

Killing Abel

Killing Abel
by Michael Tieman
June 2023

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead
by E. Alan Fleischauer
July 2023

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough
by Mark Unger
August 2023

Predictably Irrational

Predictably Irrational
by Dan Ariely
September 2023

Artwords

Artwords
by Beatriz M. Robles
November 2023

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope
by Dr. Randy Ross
December 2023

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes
by Ali Master
February 2024

2022 Philosophy Books of the Month

Emotional Intelligence At Work

Emotional Intelligence At Work
by Richard M Contino & Penelope J Holt
January 2022

Free Will, Do You Have It?

Free Will, Do You Have It?
by Albertus Kral
February 2022

My Enemy in Vietnam

My Enemy in Vietnam
by Billy Springer
March 2022

2X2 on the Ark

2X2 on the Ark
by Mary J Giuffra, PhD
April 2022

The Maestro Monologue

The Maestro Monologue
by Rob White
May 2022

What Makes America Great

What Makes America Great
by Bob Dowell
June 2022

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!
by Jerry Durr
July 2022

Living in Color

Living in Color
by Mike Murphy
August 2022 (tentative)

The Not So Great American Novel

The Not So Great American Novel
by James E Doucette
September 2022

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches
by John N. (Jake) Ferris
October 2022

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All
by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
November 2022

The Smartest Person in the Room: The Root Cause and New Solution for Cybersecurity

The Smartest Person in the Room
by Christian Espinosa
December 2022

2021 Philosophy Books of the Month

The Biblical Clock: The Untold Secrets Linking the Universe and Humanity with God's Plan

The Biblical Clock
by Daniel Friedmann
March 2021

Wilderness Cry: A Scientific and Philosophical Approach to Understanding God and the Universe

Wilderness Cry
by Dr. Hilary L Hunt M.D.
April 2021

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute: Tools To Spark Your Dream And Ignite Your Follow-Through

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute
by Jeff Meyer
May 2021

Surviving the Business of Healthcare: Knowledge is Power

Surviving the Business of Healthcare
by Barbara Galutia Regis M.S. PA-C
June 2021

Winning the War on Cancer: The Epic Journey Towards a Natural Cure

Winning the War on Cancer
by Sylvie Beljanski
July 2021

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream
by Dr Frank L Douglas
August 2021

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts
by Mark L. Wdowiak
September 2021

The Preppers Medical Handbook

The Preppers Medical Handbook
by Dr. William W Forgey M.D.
October 2021

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress: A Practical Guide

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress
by Dr. Gustavo Kinrys, MD
November 2021

Dream For Peace: An Ambassador Memoir

Dream For Peace
by Dr. Ghoulem Berrah
December 2021