Do animals have imagination?

[Scott]

Although I am still waiting for a response to the link I posted in my previous posts, I have even more evidence that some animals imagine:

Taken together, it seems as if some animals, under some circumstances, do indeed engage in pretend play. They treat some objects as if they were different objects (as with Washoe and her brush), they act is if objects are present where they are not (as with Kanzi and his food), or they use behaviors relevant to one activity (fighting or mating, in dogs) and repurpose them for play. However, animals might not possess the meta-awareness that they are pretending. They might not understand the very concepts of “pretend” or “imagination,” the way we as humans do.

Still, some animals seem able to imagine, even if in a limited way. And that’s pretty cool.

Jensvold, M., & Fouts, R. (1993). Imaginary Play in chimpanzees (Pan troglodytes) Human Evolution, 8 (3), 217-227 DOI: 10.1007/BF02436716

Suddendorf T, & Whiten A (2001). Mental evolution and development: evidence for secondary representation in children, great ages, and other animals. Psychological bulletin, 127 (5), 629-50 PMID: 11548971

Lillard AS (1993). Pretend play skills and the child’s theory of mind. Child development, 64 (2), 348-71 PMID: 8477622

Flavell, J., Flavell, E., Green, F. L., & Korfmacher, J. E. (1990). Do young children think of television images as pictures or real objects?. Journal of Broadcasting & Electronic Media, 34(4), 399-419.

Bekoff, Marc (1997) Playing with Play: What Can We Learn About Cognition, Negotiation, and Evolution? D. Cummins and C. Allen (eds.) The Evolution of Mind. New York. Oxford University Press

DeLoache, J., Pierroutsakos, S., Uttal, D., Rosengren, K., & Gottlieb, A. (1998). Grasping the Nature of Pictures Psychological Science, 9 (3), 205-210 DOI: 10.1111/1467-9280.00039

[full article]

The above article is interesting because it does not even mention the smartest animals such as the very playful dolphins, who presumably are even more imaginative.

[Wolfgang Köhler] observed that it seemed necessary for the toy animals to have some likeness to real animals, "nearness to life," in order to invoke fear. The stuffed animals invoked even stronger responses than did most real animals. He concluded that the stuffed animals, not being fully real, played on the imagination [of chimpanzees] in a way that real animals did not.

Interpreting, or "filling in" what is not there, is one definition of imagination.

[...]

There is evidence that some [individual chimpanzees] do interpret pictures, even abstract ones like cartoons. This not only proves that animals can have some form of imagination. By studying these individuals' histories and compare them with individuals that are less able, we can also learn more about pictorial competence as such.

[full article]

I think of imagination as the ability see things as they are not. On purpose of course. This could even be "outside-the-box" thinking. Having imagination gives conscious beings the ability to use tools, and think about things that don't have to do with survival and procreation.

By the concept of life I was referring to the fact that we from quite an early age are aware that one day it will all end. So we start thinking of what we are going to do with our lives. So we start planning, questioning, what we want to use that life for? and worse, start comparing.

This is an interesting point, however I'm not sure it disproves my statement. First I have to note that the qualities you mentioned are not necessarily unique to a concept of life. For instance planning and questioning may be thought of in terms of an entire life but can also exist outside of that. Therefore I don't think they are results of having a concept of life.

To address the concept of life in itself, there's not any way to prove that animals do. However I think there's a difference between a recognition of the death of another member of the species and mourning one. Gorillas actually go through a mourning period as a family when they lose a child. The trainer at the zoo was telling me that they transfer the younger gorillas to other zoos to mate with other families so as to propagate the zoo populations. The last time one of the daughters got transferred, the entire family sulked around for a few months. They were shown pictures and video of the daughter in the new habitat, but the trainer said she's unsure if they understand that.

To mourn a life over an extended period of time indicates a clear concept of a life as a complete whole. In order to have a mourning period (as opposed to just sniffing a corpse and recognizing death), the animal must be able to comprehend that the other animal was born, lived, and is now dead and not coming back. This does not tell us how they handle the concept of a life on an individual level in their day to day experience, but I think it does tell us that they have a concept of it. Elephants, based on some limited reading, also seem to perform mourning rituals which is even stranger. Anyway I think there are indications that among the more advanced animals certain aspects of understanding (possibly the planning ability that allows one to connect the past and future) do give way to a concept of a life as a whole. I'm sure this requires a high level of advancement in intelligence so most animals wouldn't have it, but I don't think humans are the only ones that do. Like with everything else, we've just taken it to new heights (self-help books, retirement funds, etc).

Gorillas actually go through a mourning period as a family when they lose a child. The trainer at the zoo was telling me that they transfer the younger gorillas to other zoos to mate with other families so as to propagate the zoo populations. The last time one of the daughters got transferred, the entire family sulked around for a few months. They were shown pictures and video of the daughter in the new habitat, but the trainer said she's unsure if they understand that.

This happens with bulls. When they are separated they spend weeks searching for each other and it is a constant bellowing. Whether the ones left behind were aware that the others had been taken to slaughter, it is impossible to tell.

To mourn a life over an extended period of time indicates a clear concept of a life as a complete whole. In order to have a mourning period (as opposed to just sniffing a corpse and recognizing death), the animal must be able to comprehend that the other animal was born, lived, and is now dead and not coming back.
This does not tell us how they handle the concept of a life on an individual level in their day to day experience, but I think it does tell us that they have a concept of it.

I agree on a very basic understanding. The fact that they are aware that this happens to others of their same species in no way does it make them think that one day it will happen to them.

Like with everything else, we've just taken it to new heights (self-help books, retirement funds, etc).

To me it causes us a great deal of difficulties.

I agree on a very basic understanding. The fact that they are aware that this happens to others of their same species in no way does it make them think that one day it will happen to them.

Unfortunately there is no way I can think of to confirm or deny this. I would still argue that the mourning period indicates something. You mentioned bulls searching for each other, but gorillas don't. They understand that the other gorilla died. It's gone, and it's not coming back. They go through an actual mourning period of the death of the family member not just a traumatic searching loss that you're describing in the bull. To me, this makes it likely that they do have a concept of death. I don't think your example indicates that the bull does. It simply recognizes the familiar animal is not there. For an animal to have an actual concept of death, I would argue that they may be aware that they will die as well. In humans, based exclusively on our behavior (no language), I don't know if there's anything that clearly indicates we know we're going to die either. Again, I think the most indicative human behavior of our knowledge of death is the ritualized mourning of the dead. That is a behavior we seem to see somewhat replicated in gorillas and elephants.

Unfortunately there is no way I can think of to confirm or deny this. I would still argue that the mourning period indicates something.

I agree

You mentioned bulls searching for each other, but gorillas don't.

No as I mentioned I spent 8 years working in a farm with these domesticated animals. I have never worked with gorillas.

They understand that the other gorilla died. It's gone, and it's not coming back. They go through an actual mourning period of the death of the family member not just a traumatic searching loss that you're describing in the bull. To me, this makes it likely that they do have a concept of death. I don't think your example indicates that the bull does. It simply recognizes the familiar animal is not there. For an animal to have an actual concept of death, I would argue that they may be aware that they will die as well. In humans, based exclusively on our behavior (no language), I don't know if there's anything that clearly indicates we know we're going to die either. Again, I think the most indicative human behavior of our knowledge of death is the ritualized mourning of the dead. That is a behavior we seem to see somewhat replicated in gorillas and elephants.

One of my grandmothers died when I was about 4-5. I have faint memories of people gathering round, but that did not make me aware that one day it would happen to me.

This is a good question. I feel all animals that have emotions or desires can think. But the question may be this: How clearly can we think. Humans are just animals. And I feel all animals that can feel are able to think. Even when we are a baby, we can think. I feel even a retarded can think. But the question is: Can we think more clearly??? I feel this may be the question. And I often feel that we are unable to think clear, maybe because we always feel uncertain about what we think. And if we can drop out thoughts; if we can delete our own ideas, then, we can be more creative. This is what I feel. Philosophy is interesting to me. And I often feel the people who love philosophy are artists or scientists. Artists or scientists require imagination. And I feel if we can think less, then, we can be more creative. To me, science is the same as art. As a scientist, I told others that I feel time can travel back to the past. I feel time can travel backward in certain condition.

One of my grandmothers died when I was about 4-5. I have faint memories of people gathering round, but that did not make me aware that one day it would happen to me.

That raises the question of whether animal intelligence progresses on a scale of human child up to human adult or on a scale of adult intelligence with various absences and limitations the farther down you go. I'm more inclined to think it's the latter. As a 4 or 5 year old, you had a lack of development within your own species. What causes a human to understand that they are going to die? My argument was not that they understand it because they attend a ritual. It was that they understand it because they conduct rituals and go through mourning. Would you have conducted the ritual, and did you go through a mourning period? I know this is getting personal now, but I have to use the example you brought up. Feel free to just take note of these questions and not answer them if this is uncomfortable. Did you actually have an understanding that she had died or did people just seem sad that she wasn't there?

I think it's likely that a very young gorilla might also not understand the death as well as the adults do. The same is probably true of any animal. So the real question is what causes an animal (including humans) to be aware of their own mortality, and what behaviors demonstrate that awareness? I don't have an answer to the first question, but I think that conducting a ritual and a prolonged mourning period are likely candidates for the second.

Did you actually have an understanding that she had died or did people just seem sad that she wasn't there?

No I had no understanding she had died.

I think it's likely that a very young gorilla might also not understand the death as well as the adults do. The same is probably true of any animal.

So the real question is what causes an animal (including humans) to be aware of their own mortality, and what behaviors demonstrate that awareness? I don't have an answer to the first question, but I think that conducting a ritual and a prolonged mourning period are likely candidates for the second.

It seems a bit of inductive process would answer the first question

Our current understanding of biology, particularly its evolutionary aspects, lead us to the inevitable conclusion that all animals must have imagination. It corresponds to the navigational feature which enables an organism to optimize its interaction with the prevailing environment. The difference between species is quantitative, not qualitative. For a bacterium it minuscule. For a snail it is tiny.

For the human species, whose level of interaction with its environment is extraordinarily high, it is immense. Importantly, human imagination is not limited to the individual, as is largely the case in other creatures.

Human imagination is greatly amplified by virtue of the fact that it is exported and imported between individuals. It is also stored externally on such media as paper and, more recently, magnetic, optical and electronic devices.

This collective sharing and storing of imagination is what we call "language".

Forget the vague and silly word "intelligence". Imagination, essentially a navigational feature, says it all.

This is examined further (very informally) in "The Goldilocks Effect: What Has Serendipity Ever Done For Us?" , a free download in e-book formats from the "Unusual Perspectives" website

Forget the vague and silly word "intelligence".

Most words are vague and silly. Some argue that intelligence means to know yourself.

You are of course right in your underlying assumption that few, if any, words can be precisely defined, even within a specified context.

Nevertheless, some are much better than others. Imagination, in the present context, can be quite well defined as the capacity to create, store and morph representations of the "external" world within the neural structures of our central nervous system. This is also, in essence, very close to its everyday context.

Intelligence, on the other hand, has such a wide set of meanings (of which your example of self-awareness is but one), that its use in serious discussion is responsible for much of the woolly-mindedness that plagues such dialogues.

For this reason its use is best avoided.

When we are not an animal how can we found their essence and nature. As an empiricism I can not talk about what I never was or see or believe. You may say we are animal but i believe we are not animal and if I accept myself as an animal also there are lot of differences between me and a giraffe.
A philosopher in early Greece said "If horses could paint, they painted god like horses!"
Now we are thinking like that! Even if they have imagination their imagination is completely different from our imagination! As far as we may call it something else!

Picturing something in your head an imagination are not the same thing. Imagination is creating something in your head picturing is remembering something you have seen. Can animals create things in their mind that they have never encountered?

Thanks for your reply's so far everyone.

Is this imagination, or intelligence?

I and a friend want to separate the horse and the mare. Finally we managed to temporarily do this and we are in the way of them.

barn and house


The mare is here. we are here. the horse is here.

fence----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He tries to get back to her slightly going round us to either side, but we move across and block his way.

He stops "thinks?" The light bulb switches on.

Then shoots off all the way running behind the house and the barn and getting behind us to where the mare is.