Jantelaw

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Angel Trismegistus
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Jantelaw

Post by Angel Trismegistus » September 2nd, 2020, 6:09 am

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What is the Law of Jante?

You’re not to think you are anything special.
You’re not to think you are as good as we are.
You’re not to think you are smarter than we are.
You’re not to convince yourself that you are better than we are.
You’re not to think you know more than we do.
You’re not to think you are more important than we are.
You’re not to think you are good at anything.
You’re not to laugh at us.
You’re not to think anyone cares about you.
You’re not to think you can teach us anything.


Of a general philosophical interest, or so it seems to this philosophile, is the notion of "national character" -- a notion entirely out of step with the times in this muddleheaded 21st century and politically incorrect -- two reasons to revive the notion, or so it seems to this disaffected citizen of a nation once again divided ahainst itself. The Global Village, after all, is the new totalizing political bromide. And narcissism is the passport to happiness. This is the world order according to social media. A lot of hooey, if you ask me.

So if you don't know what the law of Jante, or Jantelaw, is, perhaps you ought to find out. (The links below are provided for your edification.)

The, as it were, 10 Commandments of Jante are listed above. They demand thoughtful consideration from those who, like your disaffected host, are fed up to the gills with Millennial Egoism.

What do you think of Jantelaw as a character model?
What do you think of Jantelaw as an answer to rampant ego-centric individualism?
Would the world be a better place if Jantelaw were the rule rather than the fading oddity it is?
How would you defend Jantelaw philosophical;y?
How would you refute Jantelaw philosophical;y?
Do you think you're something special? Wny?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Jante
https://www.theparisreview.org/blog/201 ... -of-jante/
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Belindi
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Belindi » September 3rd, 2020, 5:28 am

I disapprove of Jantelaw because the theme that runs through all the items is
'You are not to take personal responsibility for making decisions.'

If we don't take personal responsibility for making decisions some power hungry idiots will make them for us.

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Angel Trismegistus
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Angel Trismegistus » September 3rd, 2020, 11:47 am

Belindi wrote:
September 3rd, 2020, 5:28 am
I disapprove of Jantelaw because the theme that runs through all the items is
'You are not to take personal responsibility for making decisions.'

If we don't take personal responsibility for making decisions some power hungry idiots will make them for us.
I don't see the absence of personal responsibility in Jantelaw, Belindi -- but I'm quite open to being made to see it if you care to elaborate on this theme. I do see the absence of personal pride, but I don't see how absence of responsibility follows from that. As for collectivism being more vulnerable to political power than individualism, this too needs at least another explanatory sentence or two as my intuition tells me that suppression of the collective would be a more formidable task than the suppression of individuals. But again I welcome your instruction on these points. Thanks for breaking the ice.
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Marvin_Edwards » September 3rd, 2020, 1:16 pm

Sounds a bit grotesque to me. Reminds me of the early communist parties of the USSR and China.

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Angel Trismegistus
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Angel Trismegistus » September 3rd, 2020, 3:48 pm

Marvin_Edwards wrote:
September 3rd, 2020, 1:16 pm
Sounds a bit grotesque to me. Reminds me of the early communist parties of the USSR and China.
I think you've picked up on the spirit of Jantelaw, Mr Edwards. Why do you find it "grotesque"? This is a question, not a challenge. I'm sincerely interested in your reaction.
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Wossname
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Wossname » September 3rd, 2020, 4:14 pm

Thanks for this. I had never heard of this before your post. I have only had time to look at the Wiki entry.

For what it is worth, I think a healthy society should show a balance between the conformity and mutual respect that makes social cohesion possible and provides a counter the overweening arrogance, greed and selfishness that most of us seem capable of, a balance between that and the personal independence that allows for individual expression, innovation, spontaneity and creativity which is also socially useful and which allows for personal freedoms that we by and large desire. Jante Law is too conformist for my liking, seems stifling in fact, though what I like, is, I recognise, not free from cultural influence.

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hgvafonso
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by hgvafonso » September 3rd, 2020, 4:41 pm

1. The purpose of life is to live, to prosper, eternaly: by passing genes or becoming imortal.
2. Every individual bares the purpose of life
3. The environment dictates, in part, the faith of every living individual
4. The individual understands that the environment influences it´s faith
5. Every individual, as per 1 and 2, puts effort on molding the environment to be favourable
6. There is strength in numbers (ants and all insects)
7. The secret of life is the differences: it tries all, so if the environment changes, chances are that something will endure.
8. The Jantlaw are just another oral construct, to ensure that individuals keep the same
9. The Jantlaw serves people who live in cold places, with long winters and need the advantage of numbers in order to survive
10. I like to enjoy myself

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Terrapin Station
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Terrapin Station » September 3rd, 2020, 5:27 pm

Angel Trismegistus wrote:
September 2nd, 2020, 6:09 am

Do you think you're something special?
Yes.

Why?
Because nominalism has things right.


Aside from that, obviously some people are smarter, more knowledgeable, etc. than others.

I'm also not at all a fan of humor taboos.

That sounds like a prescription for participation trophy culture, with a side dish of being easily offendable due to insecurities.

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Angel Trismegistus
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Angel Trismegistus » September 4th, 2020, 2:59 am

hgvafonso wrote:
September 3rd, 2020, 4:41 pm
1. The purpose of life is to live, to prosper, eternaly: by passing genes or becoming imortal.
2. Every individual bares the purpose of life
3. The environment dictates, in part, the faith of every living individual
4. The individual understands that the environment influences it´s faith
5. Every individual, as per 1 and 2, puts effort on molding the environment to be favourable
6. There is strength in numbers (ants and all insects)
7. The secret of life is the differences: it tries all, so if the environment changes, chances are that something will endure.
8. The Jantlaw are just another oral construct, to ensure that individuals keep the same
9. The Jantlaw serves people who live in cold places, with long winters and need the advantage of numbers in order to survive
10. I like to enjoy myself
Welcome aboard, 'fonso!
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Angel Trismegistus
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Angel Trismegistus » September 4th, 2020, 4:06 am

Terrapin Station wrote:
September 3rd, 2020, 5:27 pm
Angel Trismegistus wrote:
September 2nd, 2020, 6:09 am

Do you think you're something special?
Yes.

Why?
Because nominalism has things right.
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Image

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Angel Trismegistus
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Angel Trismegistus » September 4th, 2020, 5:43 am

Wossname wrote:
September 3rd, 2020, 4:14 pm
Thanks for this. I had never heard of this before your post. I have only had time to look at the Wiki entry.

For what it is worth, I think a healthy society should show a balance between the conformity and mutual respect that makes social cohesion possible and provides a counter the overweening arrogance, greed and selfishness that most of us seem capable of, a balance between that and the personal independence that allows for individual expression, innovation, spontaneity and creativity which is also socially useful and which allows for personal freedoms that we by and large desire. Jante Law is too conformist for my liking, seems stifling in fact, though what I like, is, I recognise, not free from cultural influence.
Would you say your balance is achieved in any contemporary instance?
What connection do you see, if any, between "personal independence" and "overweening arrogance, greed and selfishness"?
What don't you like about conformity?
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Belindi
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Belindi » September 4th, 2020, 5:57 am

Angel Trismegistus wrote:
September 3rd, 2020, 11:47 am
Belindi wrote:
September 3rd, 2020, 5:28 am
I disapprove of Jantelaw because the theme that runs through all the items is
'You are not to take personal responsibility for making decisions.'

If we don't take personal responsibility for making decisions some power hungry idiots will make them for us.
I don't see the absence of personal responsibility in Jantelaw, Belindi -- but I'm quite open to being made to see it if you care to elaborate on this theme. I do see the absence of personal pride, but I don't see how absence of responsibility follows from that. As for collectivism being more vulnerable to political power than individualism, this too needs at least another explanatory sentence or two as my intuition tells me that suppression of the collective would be a more formidable task than the suppression of individuals. But again I welcome your instruction on these points. Thanks for breaking the ice.
Because each and every item tends to disempower the individual. Pride in oneself is empowering for good and for evil. Either I decide for myself (as well as I can) what is good and what is evil, or some bigwig will decide for me.

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Sculptor1
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Sculptor1 » September 4th, 2020, 7:55 am

Scandinavia has done well from it.

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Sculptor1
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Sculptor1 » September 4th, 2020, 7:57 am

“When you call yourself an Indian or a Muslim or a Christian or a European, or anything else, you are being violent. Do you see why it is violent? Because you are separating yourself from the rest of mankind. When you separate yourself by belief, by nationality, by tradition, it breeds violence. So a man who is seeking to understand violence does not belong to any country, to any religion, to any political party or partial system; he is concerned with the total understanding of mankind.”
― Jiddu Krishnamurti

Were people to embrace this the world would be a better place.

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Sculptor1
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Re: Jantelaw

Post by Sculptor1 » September 4th, 2020, 8:03 am

hgvafonso wrote:
September 3rd, 2020, 4:41 pm
1. The purpose of life is to live, to prosper, eternaly: by passing genes or becoming imortal.
Like the Riech.
2. Every individual bares the purpose of life
Each has his own though.
3. The environment dictates, in part, the faith of every living individual.
Really?
4. The individual understands that the environment influences it´s faith
Faith is the the result of a dead, closed mind.
5. Every individual, as per 1 and 2, puts effort on molding the environment to be favourable.
Jawohl
6. There is strength in numbers (ants and all insects)
jawohl.
Ein Reich, Ein Volk, Ein Führer
7. The secret of life is the differences: it tries all, so if the environment changes, chances are that something will endure.
Ya, for a THOUSAND YEARS!
8. The Jantlaw are just another oral construct, to ensure that individuals keep the same
Same.... (what?)
9. The Jantlaw serves people who live in cold places, with long winters and need the advantage of numbers in order to survive
10. I like to enjoy myself
... And crush your enemies before you, relishing the lamentation of their women?

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