The only true cause of death is birth.

[Belindi]

The entire premise is incorrect. Seven percent of humans born never died.

That was probably once the case with trilobites too.

Do you mean that all entities that ever existed exist eternally, or do you mean that fossils have life of a sort?

[Pattern-chaser]

The entire premise is incorrect. Seven percent of humans born never died.

OK, I'll bite. How can that be?

[Belindi]

The entire premise is incorrect. Seven percent of humans born never died.

OK, I'll bite. How can that be?

Trilo-bite

[Pattern-chaser]

The entire premise is incorrect. Seven percent of humans born never died.

OK, I'll bite. How can that be?

Trilo-bite

Sorry, I'm still baffled....

[LuckyR]

The entire premise is incorrect. Seven percent of humans born never died.

OK, I'll bite. How can that be?

Trilo-bite

Sorry, I'm still baffled....

Sy Borg gets it. Quite simple, really, 7 percent of the humans ever born are alive, ie have not died.

[Pattern-chaser]

7 percent of the humans ever born are still alive, ie have not (yet!) died.

[My additions] Ah. Sorry.

[LuckyR]

7 percent of the humans ever born are still alive, ie have not (yet!) died.

[My additions] Ah. Sorry.

Reasonable additions, though both are correct.

[Sy Borg]

The entire premise is incorrect. Seven percent of humans born never died.

That was probably once the case with trilobites too.

Do you mean that all entities that ever existed exist eternally, or do you mean that fossils have life of a sort?

More that the living seven percent referred to by Lucky will be accounted for in time.

[LuckyR]

The entire premise is incorrect. Seven percent of humans born never died.

That was probably once the case with trilobites too.

Do you mean that all entities that ever existed exist eternally, or do you mean that fossils have life of a sort?

More that the living seven percent referred to by Lucky will be accounted for in time.

True as individuals, but there will still be a 7% cohort.

[Belindi]

That was probably once the case with trilobites too.

Do you mean that all entities that ever existed exist eternally, or do you mean that fossils have life of a sort?

More that the living seven percent referred to by Lucky will be accounted for in time.

True as individuals, but there will still be a 7% cohort.

I understand now. 7% of people now alive have not yet died and in time they will die. That is consistent with a law of nature. However "The only true cause of death is birth" is not true because birth and death are parts of the definition of life, neither birth nor death is the cause of the other. Life and its transient quality are defined by birth and death.

Life itself is caused by the advent and evolution of RNA I think. As far as I know, it's unknown what causes living individuals to age and be transient more so than inorganic forms.

[popeye1945]

Hi all,
Sex is the cause of some organisms not possessing relative immortality, organisms who clone them themselves are relatively immortal. Sex was a latecomer on the scene, organisms who clone themselves over great expanses of time, accumulate enough mutant tash to do in the species. Sex is a more practical system, always refreshing through the process of unrelated couples giving greater variety, and so more for natural selection to work with. This is not necesserily good news for the individual but then nature cares not for individual but for species. Life I do not think is the direct result of evolution, the first instance or instances of life were the first replicators, natural selection gave us variety. The reason, the major one a least, for ageing and death is the lack of the repair of physical damage, life could be lengthened if our biology could be fooled into not spending so much energy on the sexual germ plasma, which it continues repairing while repair of other repairs would extend our lives.

[LuckyR]

Do you mean that all entities that ever existed exist eternally, or do you mean that fossils have life of a sort?

More that the living seven percent referred to by Lucky will be accounted for in time.

True as individuals, but there will still be a 7% cohort.

I understand now. 7% of people now alive have not yet died and in time they will die. That is consistent with a law of nature. However "The only true cause of death is birth" is not true because birth and death are parts of the definition of life, neither birth nor death is the cause of the other. Life and its transient quality are defined by birth and death.

Life itself is caused by the advent and evolution of RNA I think. As far as I know, it's unknown what causes living individuals to age and be transient more so than inorganic forms.

Almost. All of the people alive are 7% of all the people who have ever lived.

[Belindi]

More that the living seven percent referred to by Lucky will be accounted for in time.

True as individuals, but there will still be a 7% cohort.

I understand now. 7% of people now alive have not yet died and in time they will die. That is consistent with a law of nature. However "The only true cause of death is birth" is not true because birth and death are parts of the definition of life, neither birth nor death is the cause of the other. Life and its transient quality are defined by birth and death.

Life itself is caused by the advent and evolution of RNA I think. As far as I know, it's unknown what causes living individuals to age and be transient more so than inorganic forms.

Almost. All of the people alive are 7% of all the people who have ever lived.

Yes, but let's attend to the false attribution of causation in the title of the thread.

[LuckyR]

True as individuals, but there will still be a 7% cohort.

I understand now. 7% of people now alive have not yet died and in time they will die. That is consistent with a law of nature. However "The only true cause of death is birth" is not true because birth and death are parts of the definition of life, neither birth nor death is the cause of the other. Life and its transient quality are defined by birth and death.

Life itself is caused by the advent and evolution of RNA I think. As far as I know, it's unknown what causes living individuals to age and be transient more so than inorganic forms.

Almost. All of the people alive are 7% of all the people who have ever lived.

Yes, but let's attend to the false attribution of causation in the title of the thread.

Sure, it is a great example of the confusion between causation and association. It is true that every single person who dies has also been born. That is association. Death is a change from the alive state to a second state called death. The cause of this change is never one's own birth. That is a lack of causation.

[Sy Borg]

True as individuals, but there will still be a 7% cohort.

I understand now. 7% of people now alive have not yet died and in time they will die. That is consistent with a law of nature. However "The only true cause of death is birth" is not true because birth and death are parts of the definition of life, neither birth nor death is the cause of the other. Life and its transient quality are defined by birth and death.

Life itself is caused by the advent and evolution of RNA I think. As far as I know, it's unknown what causes living individuals to age and be transient more so than inorganic forms.

Almost. All of the people alive are 7% of all the people who have ever lived.

Yes, but let's attend to the false attribution of causation in the title of the thread.

I'm not sure that causation was the point. I think Scott was advocating that we think differently about death. To not see it as a bogey, but a simple and inevitable consequence of birth. Ray Kurtzweil may not agree, though, but I do. Eternity does not appeal to many.

With the kinds of minds we have, it's hard to imagine a hypothetical "eternal" digitally-preserved consciousness not eventually losing a taste for existence and sense of meaning, and ultimately simply seeking peace.

To cope with living forever, one would need to be much less emotional than most people are today.