All Fear Is The Fear Of Death

[Sy Borg]

Mystery,
One must ask what is the object of the fear, what will happen as a result of serious injury, in nature it often means death.
Shame, again what might happen if one is rejected, again in nature the result is often death to social or pack animals.

But rejection and humiliation do not necessarily lead to death. Certainly they may reduce one’s chances of mating with the best genetic choices.

Fear of the future.

Fear of change.

Fear of failure.

Fear of criticism.

Fear of embarrassment.

Fear of escalators.

Rejection and humiliation very often lead to death. It may be by suicide, or it may connected to resultant poverty. If our direction in life is backwards then we know where that can lead if the slide is not arrested. The subconscious often sees such a backwards slide as a potential catastrophe, especially in modern societies, just as fundamentalists claimed that giving gays the right to marry would soon and inevitably lead to the legalisation of marriage to animals. A fearful mind tends not to be logical.

Hi Borge, I can understand your viewpoint and mostly agree. Perhaps the difference of opinion is that I do not consciously view death as the worst outcome. Any that accepts suicide also would have the same view. I also do not accept suicide as the proper solution because it is a submission, although I have pity for those that do instead of the disgust that some tell of.

For all fear to be tied to death would mean that death is the worst condition. Often those that truly shine, advance, and affect positive change have made some inner peace, and the goals they have to exceed the fear of death.

I would agree that ppl that are stuck, may tie all fear to death.

Fair point. Extended torture is the worst possibility to most of us, whether cruel or well-intended. Fear of suffering is almost universal and, it should be said that, as animals, our fear of suffering stems from fear of damage that may lead to death.

As for suicide, it depends on whether it leaves emotional carnage behind or not. For a person without connections, or one that has lived a full, rich life and is checking out for understandable reasons (eg. cancer). then suicide seems a reasonable option. But, usually, there are friends and families left in distress, so ideally the nobler path is to try to work through the problems and see what surprises life has in store.

[subatomic]

Consider: suicidal people who actively want and seek for death, and don't care about whether or not they're rejected by society or what happens to them.

[Steve3007]

Pain, embarrassment and unrealised potential. Death comes fourth.

[AmericanKestrel]

All fear is the fear of death.
Fear too performs a great service, it keeps one from doing many risky stupid things, listen to your fears they only sometimes lie. Paranoia, paranoia is defined as irrational fear, this is when the object of one's fears cannot be identified or if identified consider utterly harmless, not warranting such fear. When your fear does lie to you often it is a mistake in perception and/or judgement those from another point of view might consider it irrational paranoia. So give me some examples where this is not the case and we'll see if it isn't possible to see where the fear is linked back to the fear of death.

Your premise is wrong.
Fear arises from uncertainty. Nothing is more certain than death, so that is not what causes fear. If you know for sure you are getting fired today, there is nothing else to fear, you can move on, plan the next step. It is the uncertainty of finding another job that causes fear and anxiety. People who face fatal illness and been given their time here, may have other feelings but it is not fear. I don't have data for this but I am sure there are studies out there.
Fear lies all the time actually. Fear masks all your power of rational thinking, and that is what leads you to do stupid things. It always fails you.
Fear actually arises from guilt. And guilt can lead to thoughts of hell if you are indoctrinated enough, which of course will cause fear of death.

[popeye1945]

Hi AmericanKestrel--and welcome aboard!

Where there is hope there is fear, where there is fear there is hope. You forgot taxes--lol!! The fear of death is the most common fear of all as certain as it is. In my town, there are so many churches that I wonder sometimes how they fill them but they do, all because they are fearful of that certainty of death, and they're looking for loopholes. People fear loosing their jobs because they need to eat to live and money to pay the mortgage. I am afraid you not standing on firm ground here. People fear loosing their jobs, and then hope to find another, again where there is hope there is fear. It is true that people facing terminal illnesses appear after time to overcome their fear of death, but if there was nothing fearful about it there would be no need to overcome it.

[popeye1945]

Consider: suicidal people who actively want and seek for death, and don't care about whether or not they're rejected by society or what happens to them.

Hi Subatomic,

This truly is a tragedy, this is a unique example, for in order to ponder suicide one must be more fearful of life, beaten down by what was and fearful of what might be.

[AmericanKestrel]

Hi AmericanKestrel--and welcome aboard!

Where there is hope there is fear, where there is fear there is hope. You forgot taxes--lol!! The fear of death is the most common fear of all as certain as it is. In my town, there are so many churches that I wonder sometimes how they fill them but they do, all because they are fearful of that certainty of death, and they're looking for loopholes. People fear loosing their jobs because they need to eat to live and money to pay the mortgage. I am afraid you not standing on firm ground here. People fear loosing their jobs, and then hope to find another, again where there is hope there is fear. It is true that people facing terminal illnesses appear after time to overcome their fear of death, but if there was nothing fearful about it there would be no need to overcome it.

I don't see how fear and hope coexist, usually it is the opposite. Hope gives rise to confidence. You are merely restating your false premise. As I stated before, it is not fear of death but what comes after, the fear of hell that make people fear death. Not everyone suffers from church indoctrination of heaven and hell. Nobody escapes death and so it is useless to live in fear of it. As for taxes, not everyone pays taxes.

[popeye1945]

[quote=AmericanKestrel
I don't see how fear and hope coexist, usually it is the opposite. Hope gives rise to confidence. You are merely restating your false premise. As I stated before, it is not fear of death but what comes after, the fear of hell that make people fear death. Not everyone suffers from church indoctrination of heaven and hell. Nobody escapes death and so it is useless to live in fear of it. As for taxes, not everyone pays taxes.
[/quote]


Fear and hope are anticipations, if one is fearful one hopes their fears are not realized. If one is hopeful there is fear that the hopefulness is not in vain. You have an unusual slant on these concepts. Yes, death is certain but that doesn't keep the majority of the population from fearing it. Fear is built into the organism and keeps us from engaging in many foolish enterprises. The taxes was meant as humor.

[Consul]

As I stated before, it is not fear of death but what comes after, the fear of hell that make people fear death.

In 1908 William Harris wrote a book titled "Hell before Death". Many people experience hell in their lives, not in their (nonexistent) afterlives.

(Harris is talking about the victims of capitalist economy, "the miseries of the grovelling poor", "the vast army of workers grinding their lives away at hard toil and ever getting the deepest cut from the competitive whip, and suffering from a fiendish partiality at the hands of the lawmakers".)

[Consul]

"[L]et me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is fear itself—nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance."
—Franklin D. Roosevelt (First Inaugural Address, March 4, 1933)

[AmericanKestrel]

Fear and hope are anticipations, if one is fearful one hopes their fears are not realized. If one is hopeful there is fear that the hopefulness is not in vain. You have an unusual slant on these concepts. Yes, death is certain but that doesn't keep the majority of the population from fearing it. Fear is built into the organism and keeps us from engaging in many foolish enterprises. The taxes was meant as humor.

You think it is humor but the reason you believe what you believe, and think it is what everyone does, is because of that quote about death and taxes. It has nothing to do with truth, never did. It is politics.
Fear is real, hope is anticipation. One stops you from action, the other impels you to act. If both are present one may need help.

[popeye1945]

AmericanKestrel,

No one said fear is not real. Fear is anticipation in the sense of that which is feared is not yet realized and as long as the subject of fear is not realized there is hope that it will not come to a realization.

[AmericanKestrel]

AmericanKestrel,

No one said fear is not real. Fear is anticipation in the sense of that which is feared is not yet realized and as long as the subject of fear is not realized there is hope that it will not come to a realization.

Fear is simply fear. Maybe you mean anxiety, but it is the same thing. Fear and hope are mutually exclusive.

[popeye1945]

If you have a fear of something happening are you not hopeful it does not?

[AmericanKestrel]

If you have a fear of something happening are you not hopeful it does not?

No, fear masks the facts on the ground, there is no room for hope. It is a delusion, an irrational belief. It is the milder form of paranoia. If you have all your facts, if you know what is certain, there is nothing to fear. You may not like it, it could be disastrous, but it is no longer fear. You have to overcome fear before you can hope, plan.