What is the root cause of misogyny?

[Pattern-chaser]

In truth, I do answer the questions you have, but you do not like the answer.

No, I'm sorry, that simply isn't so. I have asked you dozens of questions, all of which you have evaded or ignored.

For sure the I think it is caused by rejection and you think rejection has nothing to do with it.

Straw man. I don't think rejection "has nothing to do with it".

But I also don't accept your assertion that "rejection is the direct cause of misogyny". Whatever influence rejection might have, I think it is the misogynist's abnormal reaction to rejection that is the cause of subsequent problems.

My suggestion accounts for the empirically-verifiable fact that most men don't exhibit this reaction, or the misogynistic responses that follow.
Your assertion does not account for this.

There's a counter-suggestion for you. One that I have offered quite a few times. How about a response?

[Pattern-chaser]

Still, put a proportion of misogynists in a happy relationship and their emotions towards women generally will soften.

I'm interested to know how a misogynist - a man who hates women - could enter or maintain a "happy relationship" with an object of his hatred?

The man's bad attitude would be an impediment to a happy relationship but not always an insurmountable one. Misogyny is a label for particular immature attitudes, not a life sentence. Marriage and age tend to dampen a portion of residual childishness in adults.

"Bad attitude"? "Immature attitudes"? "Residual childishness"? I don't think we are talking about the same thing.

I understand misogyny to be hatred for women, not casual distaste. I suggest that punching, kicking or raping a woman are examples of hatred. [There are lots of other examples, of course.] If you think misogyny is such a simple and trivial thing as a poor attitude toward women, I can see why you would think and write as you do.

[Ecurb]

What if someone hates women and men equally? Is he still a misogynist?

Also, I don't get the "rejection" theory. Are some Philosophy Forum members getting rejected by women with alarming frequency? If you don't get accepted by Harvard do you hate Harvard grads? If a woman rejects you, wouldn't it be becoming modesty to admire her good taste, instead of seething about it? As noted sex pervert Woody Allen once said, "I wouldn't want to belong to any club that would admit someone like me as a member."

[AmericanKestrel]

To get some clarity on Karens and men. From what I have seen, this train of thought is new to me because I have seen videos, which is mostly how this meme spread, where their venom was reserved for people of color, both men and women. I dont know if some of you are ignoring the race angle on this issue. I have never seen a Karen directed at a white male.
If there is ample evidence of women hating men, not just the man in her life, but men in general,then that hate has rarely been acted upon with rape and sexual violence. Yes there was the Bobbit case, and the fact we can bring it up is proof how rare that is. The anger women have against men is not sexual rejection, it is the denial of their right to their body, their very personhood, equality in opportunities, and the constant sexism at work and other places. The work they do in raising children is devalued. Those are the issues that makes them mad at men because white men control the power most every where.
This is not the same as the topic which misogyny, hatred of women because they are women.

I don't mean this sarcastically at all. it is a real question.

Should a white man be required to give his wealth to nonwhite men or to any woman even if he earned it himself, or if his father earned it for him, or his grandfather? Should a non-white man or woman be required to do that same, because they are a woman or not a white man the should be allowed to keep what they earn?

Should I teach my son who is a white man, that he is not allowed to work for and have success because he is a man and is white?

Who made these claims? Why are you directing these at me?

[AmericanKestrel]

P-C, I'm largely with Mystery here, although it's hard to say "most cases of misogyny", as that would thorough require surveys that run across various demographics.

Still, put a proportion of misogynists in a happy relationship and their emotions towards women generally will soften. Another proportion will not be able to function in a happy relationship with a woman per se, either due to social or sexuality issues.

Ultimately, people tend to most hate that which they fear. What do men fear of women specifically, that they don't fear of other men?

1) the capacity to induce embarrassment through rejection and ridicule

2) the risk of parenthood

3) the risk of losing half of what they brought into a marriage via divorce settlements.

These are situations women accept as part of life. It doesnt make them go and commit violence on a man.

Yes, they do, they do not rape usually because it is not of interest to them but they do commit social and financial violence on men. Psychological violence is very damaging. Many professional counselors have a full schedule of men that are in emotional chaos due to emotional violence. And then the suicides that are caused from the same.

Men are interested in rape? Is that your point? It is a criminal act of violence for which they go to jail.

[Sy Borg]

Still, put a proportion of misogynists in a happy relationship and their emotions towards women generally will soften.

I'm interested to know how a misogynist - a man who hates women - could enter or maintain a "happy relationship" with an object of his hatred? 😉

The man's bad attitude would be an impediment to a happy relationship but not always an insurmountable one. Misogyny is a label for particular immature attitudes, not a life sentence. Marriage and age tend to dampen a portion of residual childishness in adults.

"Bad attitude"? "Immature attitudes"? "Residual childishness"? I don't think we are talking about the same thing.

I understand misogyny to be hatred for women, not casual distaste. I suggest that punching, kicking or raping a woman are examples of hatred. [There are lots of other examples, of course.] If you think misogyny is such a simple and trivial thing as a poor attitude toward women, I can see why you would think and write as you do.

Hatred is exactly as I stated - a bad attitude, immature and childish. Do you consider hatred to something that the mature and wise engage in?

The consequences of hatred can be damaging, but the emotion of hate itself is simply the product of an immature mind, an ongoing tantrum.

[mystery]

To get some clarity on Karens and men. From what I have seen, this train of thought is new to me because I have seen videos, which is mostly how this meme spread, where their venom was reserved for people of color, both men and women. I dont know if some of you are ignoring the race angle on this issue. I have never seen a Karen directed at a white male.
If there is ample evidence of women hating men, not just the man in her life, but men in general,then that hate has rarely been acted upon with rape and sexual violence. Yes there was the Bobbit case, and the fact we can bring it up is proof how rare that is. The anger women have against men is not sexual rejection, it is the denial of their right to their body, their very personhood, equality in opportunities, and the constant sexism at work and other places. The work they do in raising children is devalued. Those are the issues that makes them mad at men because white men control the power most every where.
This is not the same as the topic which misogyny, hatred of women because they are women.

I don't mean this sarcastically at all. it is a real question.

Should a white man be required to give his wealth to nonwhite men or to any woman even if he earned it himself, or if his father earned it for him, or his grandfather? Should a non-white man or woman be required to do that same, because they are a woman or not a white man the should be allowed to keep what they earn?

Should I teach my son who is a white man, that he is not allowed to work for and have success because he is a man and is white?

Who made these claims? Why are you directing these at me?

I think you told that part of the reason is that white men control the power almost everywhere and the same devalue women for raising children.

[mystery]

P-C, I'm largely with Mystery here, although it's hard to say "most cases of misogyny", as that would thorough require surveys that run across various demographics.

Still, put a proportion of misogynists in a happy relationship and their emotions towards women generally will soften. Another proportion will not be able to function in a happy relationship with a woman per se, either due to social or sexuality issues.

Ultimately, people tend to most hate that which they fear. What do men fear of women specifically, that they don't fear of other men?

1) the capacity to induce embarrassment through rejection and ridicule

2) the risk of parenthood

3) the risk of losing half of what they brought into a marriage via divorce settlements.

These are situations women accept as part of life. It doesnt make them go and commit violence on a man.

Yes, they do, they do not rape usually because it is not of interest to them but they do commit social and financial violence on men. Psychological violence is very damaging. Many professional counselors have a full schedule of men that are in emotional chaos due to emotional violence. And then the suicides that are caused from the same.

Men are interested in rape? Is that your point? It is a criminal act of violence for which they go to jail.

We agree it is a criminal act and should be punished.

[mystery]

In truth, I do answer the questions you have, but you do not like the answer.

No, I'm sorry, that simply isn't so. I have asked you dozens of questions, all of which you have evaded or ignored.

For sure the I think it is caused by rejection and you think rejection has nothing to do with it.

Straw man. I don't think rejection "has nothing to do with it".

But I also don't accept your assertion that "rejection is the direct cause of misogyny". Whatever influence rejection might have, I think it is the misogynist's abnormal reaction to rejection that is the cause of subsequent problems.

My suggestion accounts for the empirically-verifiable fact that most men don't exhibit this reaction, or the misogynistic responses that follow.
Your assertion does not account for this.

There's a counter-suggestion for you. One that I have offered quite a few times. How about a response?

sure, so is your position then that it is the response to the action of rejection that is the issue? If it is I agree. If the rejection does not happen do we still have the issue?

[Pattern-chaser]

In truth, I do answer the questions you have, but you do not like the answer.

No, I'm sorry, that simply isn't so. I have asked you dozens of questions, all of which you have evaded or ignored.

For sure the I think it is caused by rejection and you think rejection has nothing to do with it.

I don't think rejection "has nothing to do with it".

But I also don't accept your assertion that "rejection is the direct cause of misogyny". Whatever influence rejection might have, I think it is the misogynist's abnormal reaction to rejection that is the cause of subsequent problems.

My suggestion accounts for the empirically-verifiable fact that most men don't exhibit this reaction, or the misogynistic responses that follow.
Your assertion does not account for this.

There's a counter-suggestion for you. One that I have offered quite a few times. How about a response?

sure, so is your position then that it is the response to the action of rejection that is the issue? If it is I agree. If the rejection does not happen do we still have the issue?

I will re-quote this, to remind you:

In truth, I do answer the questions you have, but you do not like the answer.

Answering a question with two different questions is not an answer. Especially when the two questions have been asked and answered before. Are you able to respond to my question, or are you trying to avoid seeing problems with your own perspective on these issues? I ask you again:

I don't accept your assertion that "rejection is the direct cause of misogyny". Whatever influence rejection might have, I think it is the misogynist's abnormal reaction to rejection that is the cause of subsequent problems.

My suggestion accounts for the empirically-verifiable fact that most men don't exhibit this reaction, or the misogynistic responses that follow.
Your assertion does not account for this.

There's a counter-suggestion for you. One that I have offered quite a few times. How about a response?

[AmericanKestrel]

These are situations women accept as part of life. It doesnt make them go and commit violence on a man.

Yes, they do, they do not rape usually because it is not of interest to them but they do commit social and financial violence on men. Psychological violence is very damaging. Many professional counselors have a full schedule of men that are in emotional chaos due to emotional violence. And then the suicides that are caused from the same.

Men are interested in rape? Is that your point? It is a criminal act of violence for which they go to jail.

We agree it is a criminal act and should be punished.

Your statements indicates “all” men are interested in rape. Is that what you mean?

[Pattern-chaser]

Hatred is exactly as I stated - a bad attitude, immature and childish. ...the emotion of hate itself is simply the product of an immature mind, an ongoing tantrum.

Then I withdraw my comments and my position. They apply to something rather more than you describe.

[mystery]

Chaser, do you believe that the entire issue or most of it is due to the response of the man to the rejection? Can you respond yes or no to this?

I don't accept your assertion that "rejection is the direct cause of misogyny". Whatever influence rejection might have, I think it is the misogynist's abnormal reaction to rejection that is the cause of subsequent problems.

My suggestion accounts for the empirically-verifiable fact that most men don't exhibit this reaction, or the misogynistic responses that follow.
Your assertion does not account for this.

There's a counter-suggestion for you. One that I have offered quite a few times. How about a response?

[mystery]

Yes, they do, they do not rape usually because it is not of interest to them but they do commit social and financial violence on men. Psychological violence is very damaging. Many professional counselors have a full schedule of men that are in emotional chaos due to emotional violence. And then the suicides that are caused from the same.

Men are interested in rape? Is that your point? It is a criminal act of violence for which they go to jail.

We agree it is a criminal act and should be punished.

Your statements indicates “all” men are interested in rape. Is that what you mean?

Men prefer to be in a position of power sexually, some exceptions exist. We have therapists, coaches, and counselors full of men and partners of the men trying to figure out why the man will go limp or has other sexual dysfunctions. At the same time, the woman will go dry with that guy, but not with ones she feels are strong. More than half of the issues turn out to be mental due to a woman getting into a dominant situation mentally with her partner. One of the fastest ways to kill the bedroom time in a marriage or relationship is for the female to bully the male. The opposite usually works pretty well but can lead to abuse and other bad things.

I will not say all, but many(very moral) men have such a fantasy but do not act on it due to self-control and masculinity. Let's see how many white nights and hypocrites jump on that statement. With these topics getting to the real solutions includes getting to the truth of things outside of social shaming.

[Pattern-chaser]

Chaser, do you believe that the entire issue or most of it is due to the response of the man to the rejection? Can you respond yes or no to this?

I don't accept your assertion that "rejection is the direct cause of misogyny". Whatever influence rejection might have, I think it is the misogynist's abnormal reaction to rejection that is the cause of subsequent problems.

My suggestion accounts for the empirically-verifiable fact that most men don't exhibit this reaction, or the misogynistic responses that follow.
Your assertion does not account for this.

There's a counter-suggestion for you. One that I have offered quite a few times. How about a response?

Once again you refuse to address my question, and instead ask another question that has been asked and answered several times.

I acknowledge and accept your unwillingness to engage in this discussion.