Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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Samana Johann
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Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

Post by Samana Johann »

Against the grain of common wrong view to benefical and noble right view (as thesis here): What would/does one hinder to think right instead of in ways of rights? "What to give, instead of demand, at first place", what's to burden here to think in such way?
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JackDaydream
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 5:29 am Against the grain of common wrong view to benefical and noble right view (as thesis here): What would/does one hinder to think right instead of in ways of rights? "What to give, instead of demand, at first place", what's to burden here to think in such way?
The complexity of the relationship between rights and duties may be about what a person deserves or is entitled to. The idea of rights as a construct is based upon this. Some may dispute the idea of rights, although the United Nations has formed basics for understanding the basics of human rights, which may incorporate ideas of how any person should be treated, with reference to ideas of justice and equality. However, the idea of
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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JackDaydream wrote: June 29th, 2022, 2:53 pm
Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 5:29 am Against the grain of common wrong view to benefical and noble right view (as thesis here): What would/does one hinder to think right instead of in ways of rights? "What to give, instead of demand, at first place", what's to burden here to think in such way?
Sorry, my phone sent my reply while I was still writing, probably because I tapped it accidentally.

The complexity of the relationship between rights and duties may be about what a person deserves or is entitled to. The idea of rights as a construct is based upon this. Some may dispute the idea of rights, although the United Nations has formed basics for understanding the basics of human rights, which may incorporate ideas of how any person should be treated, with reference to ideas of justice and equality. However, the idea of human rights does bring back the issue of human beings, entitlement and how these issues are considered philosophically.
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Samana Johann
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

Post by Samana Johann »

JackDaydream wrote: June 29th, 2022, 2:53 pm
Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 5:29 am Against the grain of common wrong view to benefical and noble right view (as thesis here): What would/does one hinder to think right instead of in ways of rights? "What to give, instead of demand, at first place", what's to burden here to think in such way?
The complexity of the relationship between rights and duties may be about what a person deserves or is entitled to. The idea of rights as a construct is based upon this. Some may dispute the idea of rights, although the United Nations has formed basics for understanding the basics of human rights, which may incorporate ideas of how any person should be treated, with reference to ideas of justice and equality. However, the idea of
What a person deserves, is entitled, is a basic error and fiction that leads to ideas of right, good householder. Nobody did good householder to be here, to come here, at fist place. And nobody is equal another, which might disturb fiction ideas of justice.

So this are surly hindrances to think in pattern of duties, of cause.
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 7:09 pm
JackDaydream wrote: June 29th, 2022, 2:53 pm
Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 5:29 am Against the grain of common wrong view to benefical and noble right view (as thesis here): What would/does one hinder to think right instead of in ways of rights? "What to give, instead of demand, at first place", what's to burden here to think in such way?
The complexity of the relationship between rights and duties may be about what a person deserves or is entitled to. The idea of rights as a construct is based upon this. Some may dispute the idea of rights, although the United Nations has formed basics for understanding the basics of human rights, which may incorporate ideas of how any person should be treated, with reference to ideas of justice and equality. However, the idea of
What a person deserves, is entitled, is a basic error and fiction that leads to ideas of right, good householder. Nobody did good householder to be here, to come here, at fist place. And nobody is equal another, which might disturb fiction ideas of justice.

So this are surly hindrances to think in pattern of duties, of cause.
The issue of what a person deserves and is entitled to in relation to fairness, justice and equality may be the flip side of human rights and basic entitlements. This may be tricky, especially when it comes down to the states and official bodies involved in basic welfare and seeing that the needs of human beings are met.
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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JackDaydream wrote: June 29th, 2022, 7:42 pm
Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 7:09 pm
JackDaydream wrote: June 29th, 2022, 2:53 pm
Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 5:29 am Against the grain of common wrong view to benefical and noble right view (as thesis here): What would/does one hinder to think right instead of in ways of rights? "What to give, instead of demand, at first place", what's to burden here to think in such way?
The complexity of the relationship between rights and duties may be about what a person deserves or is entitled to. The idea of rights as a construct is based upon this. Some may dispute the idea of rights, although the United Nations has formed basics for understanding the basics of human rights, which may incorporate ideas of how any person should be treated, with reference to ideas of justice and equality. However, the idea of
What a person deserves, is entitled, is a basic error and fiction that leads to ideas of right, good householder. Nobody did good householder to be here, to come here, at fist place. And nobody is equal another, which might disturb fiction ideas of justice.

So this are surly hindrances to think in pattern of duties, of cause.
The issue of what a person deserves and is entitled to in relation to fairness, justice and equality may be the flip side of human rights and basic entitlements. This may be tricky, especially when it comes down to the states and official bodies involved in basic welfare and seeing that the needs of human beings are met.
The pattern seems to have cemented by steady teaching such that even short thoughts outside of this fiction and invalid ideas are hard to be done, right?
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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JackDaydream wrote: June 29th, 2022, 7:42 pm
Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 7:09 pm
JackDaydream wrote: June 29th, 2022, 2:53 pm
Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 5:29 am Against the grain of common wrong view to benefical and noble right view (as thesis here): What would/does one hinder to think right instead of in ways of rights? "What to give, instead of demand, at first place", what's to burden here to think in such way?
The complexity of the relationship between rights and duties may be about what a person deserves or is entitled to. The idea of rights as a construct is based upon this. Some may dispute the idea of rights, although the United Nations has formed basics for understanding the basics of human rights, which may incorporate ideas of how any person should be treated, with reference to ideas of justice and equality. However, the idea of
What a person deserves, is entitled, is a basic error and fiction that leads to ideas of right, good householder. Nobody did good householder to be here, to come here, at fist place. And nobody is equal another, which might disturb fiction ideas of justice.

So this are surly hindrances to think in pattern of duties, of cause.

Do you think that a person deserves anything in life at all, including the basics needs? Does being a human being, (or a sentient being) have any value and imply they deserve any respect at all? How is this worked out in terms of values, ethics, or should it be a complete war of the jungle of human egos? Some may argue that there is no such thing as natural human rights, but such a view would be connected to a particular view of human beings and their significance, or probably their insignificance.
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 5:29 am Against the grain of common wrong view to benefical and noble right view (as thesis here): What would/does one hinder to think right instead of in ways of rights? "What to give, instead of demand, at first place", what's to burden here to think in such way?
Rights are as much a matter of practicality as morals. When people have no rights they have nothing to lose. When enough people have nothing to lose, it can bring down a society. To combat this, societies whose leadership operate like the Mafia, based on cronyism and "loyalty" such as NK, China and Russia, become ever more authoritarian to ensure that they maintain control. The leaders are becoming ever less caring about how many of their citizens die by their orders or policies - as long as the "important people" are okay.
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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Sy Borg wrote: June 29th, 2022, 8:46 pm
Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 5:29 am Against the grain of common wrong view to benefical and noble right view (as thesis here): What would/does one hinder to think right instead of in ways of rights? "What to give, instead of demand, at first place", what's to burden here to think in such way?
Rights are as much a matter of practicality as morals. When people have no rights they have nothing to lose. When enough people have nothing to lose, it can bring down a society. To combat this, societies whose leadership operate like the Mafia, based on cronyism and "loyalty" such as NK, China and Russia, become ever more authoritarian to ensure that they maintain control. The leaders are becoming ever less caring about how many of their citizens die by their orders or policies - as long as the "important people" are okay.
Strange that those selling such utopia ideas seldom have any thing of there ideas in their own TOS... so merely useless to talk on if lacking basic self-reflection and honesty.
Those pseudo-liberal folk is actually first in executing and a wise avoids hypocritical and blind people who do nothing but demand, yet hardly would give or care about their duties first.

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Sy Borg
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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I think the next great leader will be a machine. The process required for people to reach leadership positions ensures that they are ruthless and have done things of questionable morality, at best. At worst, the process encourages the corrupt, narcissists and psychopaths.

Duties may become redundant as machines take over ever more work, although who knows what unexpected turns of events occur?
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Samana Johann
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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My person doesn't think that the point (causes of effects) could be comprehend, good householder, nevertheless appreciate certain patient.
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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Samana Johann wrote: June 29th, 2022, 5:29 am Against the grain of common wrong view to beneficial and noble right view (as thesis here): What would/does one hinder to think right instead of in ways of rights? "What to give, instead of demand, at first place", what's to burden here to think in such way?
I think it is worthwhile to consider how much we demand our 'rights', and how rarely we refer to the duties and responsibilities that come with those rights. TANSTAAFL.
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

Post by chewybrian »

JackDaydream wrote: June 29th, 2022, 7:42 pm The issue of what a person deserves and is entitled to in relation to fairness, justice and equality may be the flip side of human rights and basic entitlements. This may be tricky, especially when it comes down to the states and official bodies involved in basic welfare and seeing that the needs of human beings are met.
I don't think these issues are all that tricky, if we could observe them without prejudice, desires, fears and such clouding our vision. It only becomes difficult when people use tortured logic to try to make their selfish desires into 'virtues'. If they didn't want something for themselves, then they would have little trouble seeing what really constitutes justice. If we were making rules to live by for an alien society, and we would never gain or 'suffer' due to the rules, then it would be easy.
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

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I think JFK was on the right track - “Ask not what your country can do for you - ask what you can do for your country”
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Re: Turning from 'rights' to 'duties': What hinders to think so?

Post by GE Morton »

Pattern-chaser wrote: June 30th, 2022, 8:23 am
I think it is worthwhile to consider how much we demand our 'rights', and how rarely we refer to the duties and responsibilities that come with those rights. TANSTAAFL.
Yikes, you assume duties and responsibilities come with rights, and in the same paragraph quote Heinlein?

No; rights entail no duties whatsoever. In a social setting you may have various duties, but they don't derive from your rights, are not entailed by them.
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