Stoicism

[Gee]

This appears to be a good lesson in Stoicism. Let's analyze:

The typical American these days is literally, offended, at, EVERYTHINGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG.
Up to and including the air and are also offended at, and with, themselves... somehow.

So, as Stoic teachings have taught us (if we read them) is that the "offensive comment" (lol) is nothing more than an external. So, we have the control of how to reach to such commentary. Let's take a few words from Epictetus:

"Men are disturbed not by things, but by the view which they take of them."

This is interesting. I once knew a man who explained to me that he used to have a terrible temper. His anger had caused problems with friends, in his family, and even at work, then one day when he was getting very angry at work, his boss looked him in the eye and stated that this man's temper was a habit. His boss further explained that it was a bad habit that could damage his life and lose him his job, but because it was a habit, it could be changed.

My friend thought about it, saw the truth in it, and worked to change his reactions to things that used to make him angry. He stated that his life improved -- he was often happy. He did not really deny his emotions, nor did he control his emotions, it was more like he guided his emotions, and from what I have read here, that is a lot of what Stoicism is about. IMO

Gee

[Belindi]

This appears to be a good lesson in Stoicism. Let's analyze:

The typical American these days is literally, offended, at, EVERYTHINGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG.
Up to and including the air and are also offended at, and with, themselves... somehow.

So, as Stoic teachings have taught us (if we read them) is that the "offensive comment" (lol) is nothing more than an external. So, we have the control of how to reach to such commentary. Let's take a few words from Epictetus:

"Men are disturbed not by things, but by the view which they take of them."

This is interesting. I once knew a man who explained to me that he used to have a terrible temper. His anger had caused problems with friends, in his family, and even at work, then one day when he was getting very angry at work, his boss looked him in the eye and stated that this man's temper was a habit. His boss further explained that it was a bad habit that could damage his life and lose him his job, but because it was a habit, it could be changed.

My friend thought about it, saw the truth in it, and worked to change his reactions to things that used to make him angry. He stated that his life improved -- he was often happy. He did not really deny his emotions, nor did he control his emotions, it was more like he guided his emotions, and from what I have read here, that is a lot of what Stoicism is about. IMO

Gee

Indeed yes. Stoicism is the basis of cognitive behavioural therapy, CBT.

[Sculptor1]

This appears to be a good lesson in Stoicism. Let's analyze:

The typical American these days is literally, offended, at, EVERYTHINGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG.
Up to and including the air and are also offended at, and with, themselves... somehow.

So, as Stoic teachings have taught us (if we read them) is that the "offensive comment" (lol) is nothing more than an external. So, we have the control of how to reach to such commentary. Let's take a few words from Epictetus:

"Men are disturbed not by things, but by the view which they take of them."

This is interesting. I once knew a man who explained to me that he used to have a terrible temper. His anger had caused problems with friends, in his family, and even at work, then one day when he was getting very angry at work, his boss looked him in the eye and stated that this man's temper was a habit. His boss further explained that it was a bad habit that could damage his life and lose him his job, but because it was a habit, it could be changed.

My friend thought about it, saw the truth in it, and worked to change his reactions to things that used to make him angry. He stated that his life improved -- he was often happy. He did not really deny his emotions, nor did he control his emotions, it was more like he guided his emotions, and from what I have read here, that is a lot of what Stoicism is about. IMO

Gee

Indeed yes. Stoicism is the basis of cognitive behavioural therapy, CBT.

And it's "opposite" Epicureanism.
https://pcc-mentalhealth.com/2018/09/04 ... -epicurus/

[Pattern-chaser]

He did not really deny his emotions, nor did he control his emotions, it was more like he guided his emotions...

Yes, I am always doubtful when people suggest that others should deny (suppress) or control their emotions; I don't think it's possible. Emotions are so much a fundamental part of a human being that (IME) it isn't possible to control them; they control me (in part, at least). But "guiding", yes, that seems possible, and maybe even practical.

[JDBowden]

This appears to be a good lesson in Stoicism. Let's analyze:

The typical American these days is literally, offended, at, EVERYTHINGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG.
Up to and including the air and are also offended at, and with, themselves... somehow.

So, as Stoic teachings have taught us (if we read them) is that the "offensive comment" (lol) is nothing more than an external. So, we have the control of how to reach to such commentary. Let's take a few words from Epictetus:

"Men are disturbed not by things, but by the view which they take of them."

This is interesting. I once knew a man who explained to me that he used to have a terrible temper. His anger had caused problems with friends, in his family, and even at work, then one day when he was getting very angry at work, his boss looked him in the eye and stated that this man's temper was a habit. His boss further explained that it was a bad habit that could damage his life and lose him his job, but because it was a habit, it could be changed.

My friend thought about it, saw the truth in it, and worked to change his reactions to things that used to make him angry. He stated that his life improved -- he was often happy. He did not really deny his emotions, nor did he control his emotions, it was more like he guided his emotions, and from what I have read here, that is a lot of what Stoicism is about. IMO

Gee

Well said. It sounds like this individual used the "view from above" Stoic exercise; to look at things from a higher perspective on the whole, big picture. Seems like it worked well for them.

[JDBowden]

He did not really deny his emotions, nor did he control his emotions, it was more like he guided his emotions...

Yes, I am always doubtful when people suggest that others should deny (suppress) or control their emotions; I don't think it's possible. Emotions are so much a fundamental part of a human being that (IME) it isn't possible to control them; they control me (in part, at least). But "guiding", yes, that seems possible, and maybe even practical.

To have emotion means to be human. Otherwise, we would not have them. I agree with you 100% that it is a fundamental part of being human... To deny (suppress) these natural feelings would (IMO) be detrimental to one's being. They must be let out/expressed. I suppose for the guiding emotions would be Stoicism. If I am angry, it is better to take a breath and step back vs. go on an awesome rampage of sort; which would be the Stoic opposite.

[GrayArea]

Stoicism.

Appears to be more of a way of life than a specific school of philosophy.
Some say it is a practice of suppressing emotions. Others, like myself, view it as more controlled emotions vs. suppression.

What are your thoughts on it? There also seems to be a small come-back in popularity. I think this would be beneficial, seeing how our world is these days.

Thoughts, ideas, observations, etc.? Let's talk about it.

jdb

From my very limited knowledge of Stoicism, it seems to be something like looking at one's own life and circumstances from the outside of one's self by abandoning self-oriented perspectives, because emotions only spring from self-oriented perspectives.

When we see a flower for example, we may think it's beautiful. To us, the flower is something that's beautiful. But these are merely secondary reactions created from our self-oriented perspectives. It does not represent the actual flower.

So if we throw away our self-oriented perspective and see things from the perspective of the outside world, of the Universe(Though the Universe is not sentient), the flower is literally just a flower. I think that Stoicism utilizes that kind of perspective. While it is impossible to completely master that perspective due to the limitations of the self, it's always nice to try our best.

[GrayArea]

Stoicism.

Appears to be more of a way of life than a specific school of philosophy.
Some say it is a practice of suppressing emotions. Others, like myself, view it as more controlled emotions vs. suppression.

What are your thoughts on it? There also seems to be a small come-back in popularity. I think this would be beneficial, seeing how our world is these days.

Thoughts, ideas, observations, etc.? Let's talk about it.

jdb

From my very limited knowledge of Stoicism, it seems to be something like looking at one's own life and circumstances from the outside of one's self by abandoning self-oriented perspectives, because emotions only spring from self-oriented perspectives.

When we see a flower for example, we may think it's beautiful. To us, the flower is something that's beautiful. But these are merely secondary reactions created from our self-oriented perspectives. It does not represent the actual flower.

So if we throw away our self-oriented perspective and see things from the perspective of the outside world, of the Universe(Though the Universe is not sentient), the flower is literally just a flower. I think that Stoicism utilizes that kind of perspective. While it is impossible to completely master that perspective due to the limitations of the self, it's always nice to try our best.

Perhaps one way of seeing things from this "outside perspective" is to simply know that it exists outside of us, and we do not have to do anything in order for it to exist—making the "self-oriented perspective" unneeded since we are already aware of the former perspective.

We simply know that the outside perspective exists because we know that the outside world/universe exists.

[GrayArea]

Stoicism.

Appears to be more of a way of life than a specific school of philosophy.
Some say it is a practice of suppressing emotions. Others, like myself, view it as more controlled emotions vs. suppression.

What are your thoughts on it? There also seems to be a small come-back in popularity. I think this would be beneficial, seeing how our world is these days.

Thoughts, ideas, observations, etc.? Let's talk about it.

jdb

From my very limited knowledge of Stoicism, it seems to be something like looking at one's own life and circumstances from the outside of one's self by abandoning self-oriented perspectives, because emotions only spring from self-oriented perspectives.

When we see a flower for example, we may think it's beautiful. To us, the flower is something that's beautiful. But these are merely secondary reactions created from our self-oriented perspectives. It does not represent the actual flower.

So if we throw away our self-oriented perspective and see things from the perspective of the outside world, of the Universe(Though the Universe is not sentient), the flower is literally just a flower. I think that Stoicism utilizes that kind of perspective. While it is impossible to completely master that perspective due to the limitations of the self, it's always nice to try our best.

And perhaps a part of Stoicism is also looking at our existing emotions from the perspective of outside the self, like one may do with the flower.

It could help one guide one's emotions better by allowing one to accept them with ease.

[JDBowden]

Stoicism has exercises to follow, 30-Day Challenges, etc. to put this into objective practice.

Do any other schools/styles of philosophy contain items such as this? I have not seen any to date.

[JackDaydream]

Stoicism has exercises to follow, 30-Day Challenges, etc. to put this into objective practice.

Do any other schools/styles of philosophy contain items such as this? I have not seen any to date.

Having read in this thread about the comparison between Stoicism, which I was aware even though I am more familiar with CBT, it is worth noting that in CBT people are given exercises. I haven't had CBT personally, but when I have read books they often give exercises. Also, I have nursed people who were having CBT, mainly for obsessive--compulsive disorder and they were frequently given homework exercise during each session. It does go along with the genre of self-help and personal growth books, which often include many exercises.

[JDBowden]

Stoicism has exercises to follow, 30-Day Challenges, etc. to put this into objective practice.

Do any other schools/styles of philosophy contain items such as this? I have not seen any to date.

Having read in this thread about the comparison between Stoicism, which I was aware even though I am more familiar with CBT, it is worth noting that in CBT people are given exercises. I haven't had CBT personally, but when I have read books they often give exercises. Also, I have nursed people who were having CBT, mainly for obsessive--compulsive disorder and they were frequently given homework exercise during each session. It does go along with the genre of self-help and personal growth books, which often include many exercises.

You are right. I have never studied nor no nothing about CBT. I found this in my extensive internet research (as in, my 5 seconds of Google):

https://positivepsychology.com/cbt-cogn ... worksheets

[Pattern-chaser]

This topic has been dormant for a few weeks, but here's an article I came across today, that might be of interest:

The 16 Greatest Lessons From 16 Years With Marcus Aurelius

[JDBowden]

I agree it has been too dormant, and I am the one that started this thread, lol. It is hard to keep it going. I see a lot of different philosophical schools with their own permanent links; is there a way to add Stoicism as well, or no?

This is a good page of 16 Great Lessons.