World / human population is 8 billion now. It keeps increasing. It doesn't even matter if I'm gone (or die)

Use this philosophy forum to discuss and debate general philosophy topics that don't fit into one of the other categories.

This forum is NOT for factual, informational or scientific questions about philosophy (e.g. "What year was Socrates born?"). Those kind of questions can be asked in the off-topic section.
Post Reply
Niki
Posts: 20
Joined: May 22nd, 2015, 12:02 pm

World / human population is 8 billion now. It keeps increasing. It doesn't even matter if I'm gone (or die)

Post by Niki »

Most people probably don't think about this. People keep living everyday, thinking that their lives mean something; that their lives have meaning or purpose. Most people are even too busy with each their own survival mode everyday, which in today's world/era, it usually means people are busy making money, whether it's work, or run a business, etc etc etc.

Most people in this world are oblivious or ignorant to this harsh reality, that we are all basically just little speck of dust on this planet, let alone universe. I always use the illustration of ants: Some ants live, some ants die (from getting trampled, crushed by feet, etc etc etc). Nothing special. It's the same with human life.

People of course will always try to rationalize this, all in a hope to convince themselves basically that life, especially their own lives, have meaning & purpose. And that each individual matters; each person matters. But in the grand scheme of things, the harsh truth is nothing really matters (well, perhaps unless if we could somehow defy reality, whether perhaps through space travel, immortality, transhumanism/posthumanism, AI (artificial intelligence), VR (virtual reality), etc etc etc; but nothing is guaranteed for sure, in reality again). Everything we do will eventually just crumbles to the dust. So why bother?

Today there is even now a popular 'hype' philosophy like "optimistic nihilism". But to me personally, it's just the same basically with hedonism, which basically it all sounds the same, eg: "just live in the present moment, enjoy life, since we only live once!". But again, is this all there is to life? existence? It still feels pointless, in the end, in the grand scheme of things.
My name is Niki Wonoto. I'm 41 years old guy from Indonesia. Nihilism, Pessimism, Antinatalism, Promortalism, Efilism.
User avatar
JackDaydream
Posts: 3218
Joined: July 25th, 2021, 5:16 pm

Re: World / human population is 8 billion now. It keeps increasing. It doesn't even matter if I'm gone (or die)

Post by JackDaydream »

Niki wrote: December 20th, 2022, 7:18 am Most people probably don't think about this. People keep living everyday, thinking that their lives mean something; that their lives have meaning or purpose. Most people are even too busy with each their own survival mode everyday, which in today's world/era, it usually means people are busy making money, whether it's work, or run a business, etc etc etc.

Most people in this world are oblivious or ignorant to this harsh reality, that we are all basically just little speck of dust on this planet, let alone universe. I always use the illustration of ants: Some ants live, some ants die (from getting trampled, crushed by feet, etc etc etc). Nothing special. It's the same with human life.

People of course will always try to rationalize this, all in a hope to convince themselves basically that life, especially their own lives, have meaning & purpose. And that each individual matters; each person matters. But in the grand scheme of things, the harsh truth is nothing really matters (well, perhaps unless if we could somehow defy reality, whether perhaps through space travel, immortality, transhumanism/posthumanism, AI (artificial intelligence), VR (virtual reality), etc etc etc; but nothing is guaranteed for sure, in reality again). Everything we do will eventually just crumbles to the dust. So why bother?

Today there is even now a popular 'hype' philosophy like "optimistic nihilism". But to me personally, it's just the same basically with hedonism, which basically it all sounds the same, eg: "just live in the present moment, enjoy life, since we only live once!". But again, is this all there is to life? existence? It still feels pointless, in the end, in the grand scheme of things.
I find that the philosophy of nihilism leads to an unhelpful dead end. I have come across optimistic nihilism and, even then, it may be this is a way of people, often in comfortable situations becoming armchair miseries. At times, I get depressed about my own life and about the state of the world, and I consider such times as being my 'black hole' days.

I try not to see life as pointless, and I don't think that it is because it is possible to find the creative even amidst the darkness of despair. Of course, there are so many people in the world and it may be this which makes people be seen as mere numbers. Seeing people in this way may be a recipe for dehumanization and totalitarianism, as opposed to appreciating each unique person, finding aesthetics and ethics. Surely, it may be braver to stand up and make the best of life rather than sink into the quagmire of defeated states of negativity.

Some people become antinatalist because they believe that it is a horrible world to bring children into the world. I once worked with a woman who had taken this view until her husband wanted children desperately. Her daughter found out her mother's wish to not have children at some point and was really angry. This was because the daughter was happy and the idea that the world was a horrible place to come into seemed ridiculous to her.

In a way, antinatilism and transhumanism are opposites with the transhumanists wishing to extend life almost indefinitely. However, there may be politics involved, with the possibility of such extended life being for the privileged few. The possibilities beyond the extremes of antinatalism and transhumanism may be about humanism as creating the best possibilities for ourselves and other people and lifeforms. It may involve a sense of stewardship, with a sense of reverence for the person and nature as opposed to a sense of exploitation and trying to see ourselves and others as objects, or as toys.
User avatar
Baby Augustine
Posts: 31
Joined: November 24th, 2022, 10:30 am

Re: World / human population is 8 billion now. It keeps increasing. It doesn't even matter if I'm gone (or die)

Post by Baby Augustine »

This too seems pure bosh to me.

If we use your data we can more easily come to a truly horrible end that you don't even contemplate. Most US welfare schemes were supported by up to 5 workers at the bottom of the pyramid. It is not approaching less than 2. IT is a mathematical certainty that, without a real upswing in population, Social Security and almost all of the Great Society and New Deal programs will just collapse.

By 2050, the OECD projects, nearly 40 percent of Japan's population will be elderly.

This is very, very bad: Countries need new people to support the older ones who can't work and to generate economic growth. If Japan doesn't turn its birthrate problem around, or somehow make each of its workers a hell of a lot more productive, it's in for a disaster.
Alan Masterman
Posts: 219
Joined: March 27th, 2011, 8:03 am

Re: World / human population is 8 billion now. It keeps increasing. It doesn't even matter if I'm gone (or die)

Post by Alan Masterman »

I think that, like Karl Marx, you underestimate the capacity of capitalism to re-invent itself at every crisis. If the present system of social welfare (in any nation) collapses due to ageing of the population, I assume that welfare expenditure will be cut back and dependents will be forced to fall back on the support of their families (as they naturally did up until the 20th C).
Post Reply

Return to “General Philosophy”

2023/2024 Philosophy Books of the Month

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise
by John K Danenbarger
January 2023

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul
by Mitzi Perdue
February 2023

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness
by Chet Shupe
March 2023

The Unfakeable Code®

The Unfakeable Code®
by Tony Jeton Selimi
April 2023

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are
by Alan Watts
May 2023

Killing Abel

Killing Abel
by Michael Tieman
June 2023

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead
by E. Alan Fleischauer
July 2023

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough
by Mark Unger
August 2023

Predictably Irrational

Predictably Irrational
by Dan Ariely
September 2023

Artwords

Artwords
by Beatriz M. Robles
November 2023

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope
by Dr. Randy Ross
December 2023

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes
by Ali Master
February 2024

2022 Philosophy Books of the Month

Emotional Intelligence At Work

Emotional Intelligence At Work
by Richard M Contino & Penelope J Holt
January 2022

Free Will, Do You Have It?

Free Will, Do You Have It?
by Albertus Kral
February 2022

My Enemy in Vietnam

My Enemy in Vietnam
by Billy Springer
March 2022

2X2 on the Ark

2X2 on the Ark
by Mary J Giuffra, PhD
April 2022

The Maestro Monologue

The Maestro Monologue
by Rob White
May 2022

What Makes America Great

What Makes America Great
by Bob Dowell
June 2022

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!
by Jerry Durr
July 2022

Living in Color

Living in Color
by Mike Murphy
August 2022 (tentative)

The Not So Great American Novel

The Not So Great American Novel
by James E Doucette
September 2022

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches
by John N. (Jake) Ferris
October 2022

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All
by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
November 2022

The Smartest Person in the Room: The Root Cause and New Solution for Cybersecurity

The Smartest Person in the Room
by Christian Espinosa
December 2022

2021 Philosophy Books of the Month

The Biblical Clock: The Untold Secrets Linking the Universe and Humanity with God's Plan

The Biblical Clock
by Daniel Friedmann
March 2021

Wilderness Cry: A Scientific and Philosophical Approach to Understanding God and the Universe

Wilderness Cry
by Dr. Hilary L Hunt M.D.
April 2021

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute: Tools To Spark Your Dream And Ignite Your Follow-Through

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute
by Jeff Meyer
May 2021

Surviving the Business of Healthcare: Knowledge is Power

Surviving the Business of Healthcare
by Barbara Galutia Regis M.S. PA-C
June 2021

Winning the War on Cancer: The Epic Journey Towards a Natural Cure

Winning the War on Cancer
by Sylvie Beljanski
July 2021

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream
by Dr Frank L Douglas
August 2021

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts
by Mark L. Wdowiak
September 2021

The Preppers Medical Handbook

The Preppers Medical Handbook
by Dr. William W Forgey M.D.
October 2021

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress: A Practical Guide

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress
by Dr. Gustavo Kinrys, MD
November 2021

Dream For Peace: An Ambassador Memoir

Dream For Peace
by Dr. Ghoulem Berrah
December 2021