No there isn't, because that is a descriptive formulation of an objective fact of reality.Ramin22 wrote: ↑September 10th, 2014, 5:07 am Hi. Some claim that '1+1=2' is true. It seems to me that '1+1 = 2' is like a short movie in our head. 2 dots get toghether or something like that. Now if you say this is wrong in general and point out that sometimes '1 + 1 = 3', by pointing out that if you put a man and a woman together, after 9 months there is 3 of them. Then supporters of '1 + 1 = 2', will claim that it was a wrong application of the theory. So they have a winning strategy. There is no way they can lose. They have a movie script in mind, if you make a movie that doesn't end the way their script does, they say it was not based on that script. Which is true. But then saying that their script is true doesn't make sense. Or does it?
Ramin
Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
- NickGaspar
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
- NickGaspar
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
Mathematical formulations are descriptive. Of course 1+1=2. Its describes a fact of empirical reality. Adding an apple next to an other it will always result having two apples. Now you are confusing the quantification of entities with the quantification of a specific quality of an entity.Sealight wrote: ↑January 4th, 2021, 10:04 pm I think people who argue about the true value of the statement '1+1 = 2' try to look deeper into the matter.
There is no such a thing as '1+1 = 2' in physical world. In physical world one can say '1 apple + 1 apple = 2 apples' which I doubt is true since not all apples are the same.
In Algebra it is true by the way of constructing integer numbers. Still in Math but outside Algebra the statement is not necessarily true. Look at Banach-Tarski paradox that basically states '1+1 = 1' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banach%E2 ... ki_paradox
So, it is a very narrow area where '1+1 = 2' is true and that area is Algebra that doesn't cover the whole Math. And Math is not everything. So I would say that probability that '1+1 = 2' is true is very negligible and almost zero.
That is a category mistake.
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
I agree that inside category theory it is a mistake.NickGaspar wrote: ↑January 27th, 2021, 11:19 am Mathematical formulations are descriptive. Of course 1+1=2. Its describes a fact of empirical reality. Adding an apple next to an other it will always result having two apples. Now you are confusing the quantification of entities with the quantification of a specific quality of an entity.
That is a category mistake.
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
Easy.Ramin22 wrote: ↑September 10th, 2014, 5:07 am Hi. Some claim that '1+1=2' is true. It seems to me that '1+1 = 2' is like a short movie in our head. 2 dots get toghether or something like that. Now if you say this is wrong in general and point out that sometimes '1 + 1 = 3', by pointing out that if you put a man and a woman together, after 9 months there is 3 of them. Then supporters of '1 + 1 = 2', will claim that it was a wrong application of the theory. So they have a winning strategy. There is no way they can lose. They have a movie script in mind, if you make a movie that doesn't end the way their script does, they say it was not based on that script. Which is true. But then saying that their script is true doesn't make sense. Or does it?
Ramin
1 is not equal to 1.
No two things are the same. Even if they are nominally the same, no two things can occupy the same place and time, Take any two real objects. Two apples; two bacteria, name it! Even two 6mm screws of the same length and weight have slight differences in composition or number of atoms. Even if they were to be made so, they could not be the same age or occupy the same space. Everything is unique.
1 can only exist as an idea.
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
Blackadder;" You've got two beans, and you add two more beans. What have you got?"Philosophy Explorer wrote: ↑September 12th, 2014, 12:10 am Try this. One lump of clay combined with one lump of clay is just one lump of clay.
PhilX
Baldrick; "Some Beans!"
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
Of course 1 is a concept and of course 1 is equal to 1 as long as it quantifies the same quality.Sculptor1 wrote: ↑January 27th, 2021, 7:52 pmEasy.Ramin22 wrote: ↑September 10th, 2014, 5:07 am Hi. Some claim that '1+1=2' is true. It seems to me that '1+1 = 2' is like a short movie in our head. 2 dots get toghether or something like that. Now if you say this is wrong in general and point out that sometimes '1 + 1 = 3', by pointing out that if you put a man and a woman together, after 9 months there is 3 of them. Then supporters of '1 + 1 = 2', will claim that it was a wrong application of the theory. So they have a winning strategy. There is no way they can lose. They have a movie script in mind, if you make a movie that doesn't end the way their script does, they say it was not based on that script. Which is true. But then saying that their script is true doesn't make sense. Or does it?
Ramin
1 is not equal to 1.
No two things are the same. Even if they are nominally the same, no two things can occupy the same place and time, Take any two real objects. Two apples; two bacteria, name it! Even two 6mm screws of the same length and weight have slight differences in composition or number of atoms. Even if they were to be made so, they could not be the same age or occupy the same space. Everything is unique.
1 can only exist as an idea.
You are confusing two different qualities, the number of screws with different physical qualities of a screw that can be described by numbers
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
Exactly.NickGaspar wrote: ↑January 28th, 2021, 12:54 amOf course 1 is a concept and of course 1 is equal to 1 as long as it quantifies the same quality.Sculptor1 wrote: ↑January 27th, 2021, 7:52 pmEasy.Ramin22 wrote: ↑September 10th, 2014, 5:07 am Hi. Some claim that '1+1=2' is true. It seems to me that '1+1 = 2' is like a short movie in our head. 2 dots get toghether or something like that. Now if you say this is wrong in general and point out that sometimes '1 + 1 = 3', by pointing out that if you put a man and a woman together, after 9 months there is 3 of them. Then supporters of '1 + 1 = 2', will claim that it was a wrong application of the theory. So they have a winning strategy. There is no way they can lose. They have a movie script in mind, if you make a movie that doesn't end the way their script does, they say it was not based on that script. Which is true. But then saying that their script is true doesn't make sense. Or does it?
Ramin
1 is not equal to 1.
No two things are the same. Even if they are nominally the same, no two things can occupy the same place and time, Take any two real objects. Two apples; two bacteria, name it! Even two 6mm screws of the same length and weight have slight differences in composition or number of atoms. Even if they were to be made so, they could not be the same age or occupy the same space. Everything is unique.
1 can only exist as an idea.
You are confusing two different qualities, the number of screws with different physical qualities of a screw that can be described by numbers
- Sculptor1
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
I was asked to refute the statement.NickGaspar wrote: ↑January 28th, 2021, 12:54 amOf course 1 is a concept and of course 1 is equal to 1 as long as it quantifies the same quality.Sculptor1 wrote: ↑January 27th, 2021, 7:52 pmEasy.Ramin22 wrote: ↑September 10th, 2014, 5:07 am Hi. Some claim that '1+1=2' is true. It seems to me that '1+1 = 2' is like a short movie in our head. 2 dots get toghether or something like that. Now if you say this is wrong in general and point out that sometimes '1 + 1 = 3', by pointing out that if you put a man and a woman together, after 9 months there is 3 of them. Then supporters of '1 + 1 = 2', will claim that it was a wrong application of the theory. So they have a winning strategy. There is no way they can lose. They have a movie script in mind, if you make a movie that doesn't end the way their script does, they say it was not based on that script. Which is true. But then saying that their script is true doesn't make sense. Or does it?
Ramin
1 is not equal to 1.
No two things are the same. Even if they are nominally the same, no two things can occupy the same place and time, Take any two real objects. Two apples; two bacteria, name it! Even two 6mm screws of the same length and weight have slight differences in composition or number of atoms. Even if they were to be made so, they could not be the same age or occupy the same space. Everything is unique.
1 can only exist as an idea.
You are confusing two different qualities, the number of screws with different physical qualities of a screw that can be described by numbers
I did not empirically.
Take it or leave it.
Since the conceptual route is completely circular, you have to look elsewhere for a refutation.
- Sculptor1
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
For this
I did not empirically.
Read THis
I DID SO EMPIRICALLY
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
You basically saying that one quality is not the same as different from it but one quality. Looks like you have just said that '1 is not equal to 1' and hence supported Sculptor1's statement.NickGaspar wrote: ↑January 28th, 2021, 12:54 amOf course 1 is a concept and of course 1 is equal to 1 as long as it quantifies the same quality.Sculptor1 wrote: ↑January 27th, 2021, 7:52 pmEasy.Ramin22 wrote: ↑September 10th, 2014, 5:07 am Hi. Some claim that '1+1=2' is true. It seems to me that '1+1 = 2' is like a short movie in our head. 2 dots get toghether or something like that. Now if you say this is wrong in general and point out that sometimes '1 + 1 = 3', by pointing out that if you put a man and a woman together, after 9 months there is 3 of them. Then supporters of '1 + 1 = 2', will claim that it was a wrong application of the theory. So they have a winning strategy. There is no way they can lose. They have a movie script in mind, if you make a movie that doesn't end the way their script does, they say it was not based on that script. Which is true. But then saying that their script is true doesn't make sense. Or does it?
Ramin
1 is not equal to 1.
No two things are the same. Even if they are nominally the same, no two things can occupy the same place and time, Take any two real objects. Two apples; two bacteria, name it! Even two 6mm screws of the same length and weight have slight differences in composition or number of atoms. Even if they were to be made so, they could not be the same age or occupy the same space. Everything is unique.
1 can only exist as an idea.
You are confusing two different qualities, the number of screws with different physical qualities of a screw that can be described by numbers
- NickGaspar
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
No it doesn't. In logic we should ALWAYS address one question/ at a time.Sealight wrote: ↑January 28th, 2021, 6:59 pmYou basically saying that one quality is not the same as different from it but one quality. Looks like you have just said that '1 is not equal to 1' and hence supported Sculptor1's statement.NickGaspar wrote: ↑January 28th, 2021, 12:54 amOf course 1 is a concept and of course 1 is equal to 1 as long as it quantifies the same quality.Sculptor1 wrote: ↑January 27th, 2021, 7:52 pmEasy.Ramin22 wrote: ↑September 10th, 2014, 5:07 am Hi. Some claim that '1+1=2' is true. It seems to me that '1+1 = 2' is like a short movie in our head. 2 dots get toghether or something like that. Now if you say this is wrong in general and point out that sometimes '1 + 1 = 3', by pointing out that if you put a man and a woman together, after 9 months there is 3 of them. Then supporters of '1 + 1 = 2', will claim that it was a wrong application of the theory. So they have a winning strategy. There is no way they can lose. They have a movie script in mind, if you make a movie that doesn't end the way their script does, they say it was not based on that script. Which is true. But then saying that their script is true doesn't make sense. Or does it?
Ramin
1 is not equal to 1.
No two things are the same. Even if they are nominally the same, no two things can occupy the same place and time, Take any two real objects. Two apples; two bacteria, name it! Even two 6mm screws of the same length and weight have slight differences in composition or number of atoms. Even if they were to be made so, they could not be the same age or occupy the same space. Everything is unique.
1 can only exist as an idea.
You are confusing two different qualities, the number of screws with different physical qualities of a screw that can be described by numbers
Not doing so it will force our reason to false conclusions
The question is : does 1+1 equals 2(.i.e. is 1 small apple and 1 big apple two apples? The answer is always yes).
The question isn't i.e.: does 1 apple plus 1 apple equals 2 apples of the same variety, size and ripeness.
You are providing a perfect example on a common problem in logic. People tend to address two or more different questions with one answer.....
This is why mathematics is a far superior language to reason with....and this is why human languages mesh up really bad even when dealing with simple equations like 1+1=2!
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
Numbers, I'm told, are defined set theoretically. Last I checked, a 0 is represented by the null set { }, a 1 by {{ }}, a 2 by {{ }, { }}, and so on.
What, if instead of using the null set, we use an infinite set. So, a 1 would be {x: x is a natural number}. Now, 1 + 1 = N + N = N = 1.
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
1+1=infinite or 1+1=1
For two people after love:
1+1=0
For two gauge condensates:
1+1=1
1+1=2 doesn't hold! As for most examples.
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Re: Is there a way to refute '1+1 = 2'?
Hi NickGaspar! Good point about addressing two or more different questions with one answer. But still why the answer to the question "Does 1+1 equals 2?" is always yes? For example, the Banach–Tarski paradox shows that 1 = 1 + 1 can happen.NickGaspar wrote: ↑February 9th, 2021, 1:36 amNo it doesn't. In logic we should ALWAYS address one question/ at a time.Sealight wrote: ↑January 28th, 2021, 6:59 pmYou basically saying that one quality is not the same as different from it but one quality. Looks like you have just said that '1 is not equal to 1' and hence supported Sculptor1's statement.NickGaspar wrote: ↑January 28th, 2021, 12:54 amOf course 1 is a concept and of course 1 is equal to 1 as long as it quantifies the same quality.Sculptor1 wrote: ↑January 27th, 2021, 7:52 pm
Easy.
1 is not equal to 1.
No two things are the same. Even if they are nominally the same, no two things can occupy the same place and time, Take any two real objects. Two apples; two bacteria, name it! Even two 6mm screws of the same length and weight have slight differences in composition or number of atoms. Even if they were to be made so, they could not be the same age or occupy the same space. Everything is unique.
1 can only exist as an idea.
You are confusing two different qualities, the number of screws with different physical qualities of a screw that can be described by numbers
Not doing so it will force our reason to false conclusions
The question is : does 1+1 equals 2(.i.e. is 1 small apple and 1 big apple two apples? The answer is always yes).
The question isn't i.e.: does 1 apple plus 1 apple equals 2 apples of the same variety, size and ripeness.
You are providing a perfect example on a common problem in logic. People tend to address two or more different questions with one answer.....
This is why mathematics is a far superior language to reason with....and this is why human languages mesh up really bad even when dealing with simple equations like 1+1=2!
How about "1 + 1 = 2" is true in Arithmetic or Number Theory but not necessarily true in some other theories?
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