A Machine Of Hapiness

[SeanHasQuestions]

You guys might have heard about this already, but the question is basicly this:
"If there would exist a machine that could simulate (make you experience as if it was real) ultimate hapiness, instantly, after plugging yourself in. Would you plug yourself in?"

I'm not just asking the question myself, cause I've seen the question been asked and I've seen almost everyone respond with no, because of various reasons such as:
- hapiness has to be earned, you can't have hapiness without sadness.
- you want to make other happy as well, not just yourself.
- you care about goals and stuff you still want to in your life.
- if everyone would do it it would stagnate human development (nobody would work, explore, improve, even have kids, humans would basicly seize to exist)
-...

The thing is, I personally don't agree with any of these arguments. I have to give some context for this opinion first. In my opinion, hapiness(,their own hapiness) is the sole thing that drives people to do the things they do,
the total sum of hapiness gained when considering certain actions is what's going to make you decide to do certain things, not do other things, make certain choices.
And no, that doesn't make you selfish, because we are biologically programmed to become happy when we see that others are happy (look into mirror neurons if you don't know what I'm talking about),
so it makes perfect sense that we want to help and make other happy, just to make ourself happy, nothing selfish about that just logical. There is absolutely no way to "experience" the mind of someone else.
The only thing you will ever actually experience is what's going on inside YOUR OWN head, so that's the only motivation that can exist to make you do things.
Reaching certain goals, overcomming difficulties and sadness, reaching milestones in life such as marying, having kids, feeling like you are doing something of significance in this world, it's all stuff you do,
because those things make you happy. Happiness is the end sum, not a factor in it, that's very important.
If you take all these things into consideration, being plugged into such a machine that can make you experience ultimate happiness, it's actually the best possible thing that could ever happen to you.
It doesn't matter that you "didn't deserve" this happiness, or that you're leaving others behind, because those are all factors in a sum, and by plugging yourself into the machine, you're maximising the outcome of the sum,
not a factor of it, so you shouldn't care about these factors.
So my end conclusion to this question is "YES!, I would definetly plug myself in!"

I wanted to ask this question because I found almost nobody on the internet sharing my opinion and I'm really curious as to why that is, I just want to hear what arguments you would have against it.

(this is my first post on this forum and I'm not a native English speaker so excuse me for the mistakes I probably made.)

[LuckyR]

To my mind the reason to not do it would be the risk of becoming addicted to the machine and conversely becoming depressed if you lost access to the machine. This is a valid set of concerns for those vulnerable to such things, such as those with addictive personalities. However, since I am not likely to do either of those things personally, I would have no problem trying Ultimate Happiness.

[Sy Borg]

You guys might have heard about this already, but the question is basically this:
"If there would exist a machine that could simulate (make you experience as if it was real) ultimate happiness, instantly, after plugging yourself in. Would you plug yourself in?"

Sean, I think we already have such a machine - the brain. I experienced an intense bliss state during an involuntary peak experience but I know much much work it would take to control that kind of buzz.

I definitely think it's a good idea to plug in. To experience that level of bliss, to realise that that state is possible and available, is an eye opener. I became happier and more optimistic afterwards. Many who have gained analogous states deliberately via ayahuasca have also reported an increase in optimism.

[Burning ghost]

I have had the luck of something that could be equated to this idea of "ultimate happiness" and I would say "Yes, plug me in!". During my experience a actually found happiness to be almost insignificant ... not really something I can explain nor fully comprehend now being currently outside of that experience. I guess this may be psychological safe guard against slipping into severe depression or madness? Who knows?

Is it dangerous? I think we fear any kind conclusive result, any kind of presupposed ultimate and so fearfully avoid the fall after the rise. I can perfectly understand the hesitation of making such a choice. I honestly think curiosity would get the better of most of us.

Many people who are called bipolar are willing to accept the lows because the highs are so high.

[LuckyR]

You guys might have heard about this already, but the question is basically this:
"If there would exist a machine that could simulate (make you experience as if it was real) ultimate happiness, instantly, after plugging yourself in. Would you plug yourself in?"

Sean, I think we already have such a machine - the brain. I experienced an intense bliss state during an involuntary peak experience but I know much much work it would take to control that kind of buzz.

I definitely think it's a good idea to plug in. To experience that level of bliss, to realise that that state is possible and available, is an eye opener. I became happier and more optimistic afterwards. Many who have gained analogous states deliberately via ayahuasca have also reported an increase in optimism.

Funny, as I started to read your post I thought you were going to say: "I think we already have such a machine - crack cocaine." No, there is a significant risk those unprepared for this sort of thing. It is not to be entered into lightly.

[A_Seagull]

So my end conclusion to this question is "YES!, I would definetly plug myself in!"

I certainly would not and I think you would be foolish to do so. The reason being that it is artificial, and if someone can construct such a machine and allow you to plug yourself in, then just as easily they could switch the machine off; then you would be lost.

[Vijaydevani]

You guys might have heard about this already, but the question is basically this:
"If there would exist a machine that could simulate (make you experience as if it was real) ultimate happiness, instantly, after plugging yourself in. Would you plug yourself in?"

Sean, I think we already have such a machine - the brain. I experienced an intense bliss state during an involuntary peak experience but I know much much work it would take to control that kind of buzz.

I definitely think it's a good idea to plug in. To experience that level of bliss, to realise that that state is possible and available, is an eye opener. I became happier and more optimistic afterwards. Many who have gained analogous states deliberately via ayahuasca have also reported an increase in optimism.

Greta, I too have had a similar experience but I differ with you in that I would not plug myself in simply because the withdrawal might be debilitating. Till my mind can take itself to such a state and keep it there, I think it is a bad idea to use artificial means to get there because if your mind is not ready for it, the consequences might not be worth the risk.

[Burning ghost]

(Nested quote removed.)

Sean, I think we already have such a machine - the brain. I experienced an intense bliss state during an involuntary peak experience but I know much much work it would take to control that kind of buzz.

I definitely think it's a good idea to plug in. To experience that level of bliss, to realise that that state is possible and available, is an eye opener. I became happier and more optimistic afterwards. Many who have gained analogous states deliberately via ayahuasca have also reported an increase in optimism.

Funny, as I started to read your post I thought you were going to say: "I think we already have such a machine - crack cocaine." No, there is a significant risk those unprepared for this sort of thing. It is not to be entered into lightly.

I concur. There is a significant risk.

[Sy Borg]

Sean, I think we already have such a machine - the brain. I experienced an intense bliss state during an involuntary peak experience but I know how much work it would take to control that kind of buzz.

I definitely think it's a good idea to plug in. To experience that level of bliss, to realise that that state is possible and available, is an eye opener. I became happier and more optimistic afterwards. Many who have gained analogous states deliberately via ayahuasca have also reported an increase in optimism.

Greta, I too have had a similar experience but I differ with you in that I would not plug myself in simply because the withdrawal might be debilitating. Till my mind can take itself to such a state and keep it there, I think it is a bad idea to use artificial means to get there because if your mind is not ready for it, the consequences might not be worth the risk.

Heh, I doubt my mind was ready for the peak experiences. I doubt it's possible to ready your mind for such an experience. Each experience rocked my world, took away the foundations, so I had to spend some time afterwards reflecting to make sense of them. We are no so weak that we break every time something weird happens.

Besides, bliss tempered by fear of its loss is not bliss. That's just feeling pretty good :). That is actually the point - a blissful egoless state is highly trusting. No defences, no worries, no fears. Letting it all hang out, so to speak. You need to feel safe enough to let any and all of your guards down and open yourself up to, well, whatever.

So I don't think such a machine would pose issues to those of reasonably sound mind who can simply be grateful for good experiences without always expecting or craving repetition.

[TSBU]

I'd like more a question about being plugged in that machine, with the machine "feeded" with human blood.
Would you unplug yourself?
I don't know, I'm not plugged.

About this thread, I don't think this have a simple answer, it depends in yourlife when you have that option, in the state of Universe. Nobody can put that in the question.

For example, if I have cancer, the doctor said that I'm going to live for 3 days, and I can't get up or make proper thoughts... the answer would probably be "yes". If find that machine, but there are people who want to kill me on the other side of the door. I won't use the machine, cause that means death in a few minutes. Maybe that's a point for this question: survival. You can't know it all, you can only fight for your life forever, you can't do that in a machine cutting your mind. It would be good as a suicide option though, if you surrender in this world, that machine is probably better than a gun XD.

[LuckyR]

(Nested quote removed.)

Greta, I too have had a similar experience but I differ with you in that I would not plug myself in simply because the withdrawal might be debilitating. Till my mind can take itself to such a state and keep it there, I think it is a bad idea to use artificial means to get there because if your mind is not ready for it, the consequences might not be worth the risk.

Heh, I doubt my mind was ready for the peak experiences. I doubt it's possible to ready your mind for such an experience. Each experience rocked my world, took away the foundations, so I had to spend some time afterwards reflecting to make sense of them. We are no so weak that we break every time something weird happens.

Besides, bliss tempered by fear of its loss is not bliss. That's just feeling pretty good . That is actually the point - a blissful egoless state is highly trusting. No defences, no worries, no fears. Letting it all hang out, so to speak. You need to feel safe enough to let any and all of your guards down and open yourself up to, well, whatever.

So I don't think such a machine would pose issues to those of reasonably sound mind who can simply be grateful for good experiences without always expecting or craving repetition.

Those without an addictive personality do not understand those with one.

[Felix]

Artificial heavens just become a bore after a while.... nowhere man, please listen, you don't know, what you're missing.

[Sy Borg]

... I don't think such a machine would pose issues to those of reasonably sound mind who can simply be grateful for good experiences without always expecting or craving repetition.

Those without an addictive personality do not understand those with one.

I'd dispute any claim that I don't have an addictive personality but I agree that it depends on the individual. Some people need to know what's out there, others are probably better off not knowing although it feels a tad patronising to say so.

[Present awareness]

Happiness, means different things to different people. Each person would have to be analyzed by the machine first, in order to see what makes that person happy. By stimulating the pleasure centers in the brain, most people would be happy that they are experiencing pleasure, but some would not consider that to be "ultimate happiness".
The problem with trying to maintain just one side of the emotional spectrum, without it's opposite, is that it would soon lose it's context with sadness and would become very stale.

[Rasher Null]

I "believe" that no-change is equivalent to no-thing. In other words if something exists then something has to be changing. Therefore if happiness exists, then something somewhere must be changing. Therefore it is tempting to think that bliss cannot be permanent because a change will take you away from a (temporarily) maximal state.