Thoughts on Time and Space.

Use this forum to discuss the philosophy of science. Philosophy of science deals with the assumptions, foundations, and implications of science.
creation
Posts: 1172
Joined: November 22nd, 2019, 10:39 pm

Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by creation »

Present awareness wrote: December 31st, 2019, 10:02 am Now we are getting somewhere! A brilliant mind that has seen through the clutter and discovered the unlimited truth of Ooowapoo!
And to think, I was just about to pay my electric bill this morning.

I think your next step Steve, is to build a church of Ooowapoo, so your followers will have a place to gather. It may take time, although there isn’t any, but that doesn’t matter, because there isn’t any of that either.
Disregard my last response.

You were not being serious, correct?
gater
Posts: 267
Joined: September 6th, 2019, 12:02 am

Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by gater »

creation wrote: January 1st, 2020, 9:36 am
gater wrote: December 30th, 2019, 4:19 pm There is no time/space. Time is independent of space and matter. Space is independent of time and matter. To understand the Universe you must understand the true nature of Time, Space, and Matter.
Do you understand the true nature of Time, Space, and Matter, and if yes, then you also understand the Universe, so you also could tell us what the true nature of Time, Space, and Matter, to you, is.

If you do not explain to us what the true nature of Time, Space, and Matter is, then why not?
Sure - i'll explain it again. Space is the absence of matter and by definition it continues forever.
Time is a constant - it never slows or stops. There was no beginning of time, and every spot in the Universe experiences the same time.
Matter has been forming stars and planets forever - all galaxies have a life cycle that keeps repeating.
The Universe has always been here, and always will be.
creation
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Joined: November 22nd, 2019, 10:39 pm

Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by creation »

gater wrote: January 1st, 2020, 9:33 pm
creation wrote: January 1st, 2020, 9:36 am

Do you understand the true nature of Time, Space, and Matter, and if yes, then you also understand the Universe, so you also could tell us what the true nature of Time, Space, and Matter, to you, is.

If you do not explain to us what the true nature of Time, Space, and Matter is, then why not?
Sure - i'll explain it again. Space is the absence of matter and by definition it continues forever.
And I will also explain this again, what you mean to say is something different because obviously space cannot continue forever, because obviously there is not a continuation forever of an absence of matter.

So, you if you want to make out you know what you are talking about, then you have to express things as they truly are.

By the way, expressing things as they truly are can be very easily done. But, first, you would actually have to have a true understanding of what the 'true nature' of the Universe is, which from what you have written above, you do not yet have.
gater wrote: January 1st, 2020, 9:33 pmTime is a constant - it never slows or stops.
There is no such thing a time.

Time would have to be something physical to either speed up, to slow, to be constant, or to stop. Time is not a physical thing, nor does none of these.

Change, or motion, however, is what is constant.
gater wrote: January 1st, 2020, 9:33 pmThere was no beginning of time, and every spot in the Universe experiences the same time.
Matter has been forming stars and planets forever - all galaxies have a life cycle that keeps repeating.
The Universe has always been here, and always will be.
All of this you have said before, but none of this still reveals that you actually truly understand the "true nature" of time, space, nor matter.

There is still so much for you to explain to show that you actually do truly understand all of this.
gater
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Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by gater »

I spoke the truth - if you disagree, tell me where im wrong.
creation
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Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by creation »

gater wrote: January 2nd, 2020, 1:33 pm I spoke the truth - if you disagree, tell me where im wrong.
Firstly you did not speak the truth - what you spoke was your truth. This can be two completely very different things. So, you were wrong there.

And, I have already told you were you are wrong before.

1. You wrote: Space is the absence of matter and by definition it continues forever.

This is wrong BECAUSE there cannot be an absence of matter that continues forever, because obviously matter does exist.


2. You wrote: Time is a constant.

This is wrong BECAUSE time would have to be something physical to be constant. Time is not a physical thing. 'Time' just exists in concept and word only, 'time' is just a word used to describe the measurement between the change of events. Change is constant, but time is not. Time is just the measurement taken.
gater
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Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by gater »

I did speak the truth - its not my truth - its a Universal truth. Space - the true meaning of space is the absence of matter that continues forever. - True statement.
Time is absolutely a constant - there was no beginning of time, it doesn't slow or stop, it continues at the same rate everywhere in the Universe, and it always has, and always will - that is the true nature of time.

if I contend 2 plus 2 is 4 - that's a true statement - its not my truth - im just identifying it as true.
The same with time and space, I told you the truth - its not my truth, it not my opinion.
creation
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Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by creation »

gater wrote: January 3rd, 2020, 9:23 pm I did speak the truth - its not my truth - its a Universal truth.
So, from your perspective, 'you', "gator", out of everyone in the Universe, KNOWS the Universal truth, correct?
gater wrote: January 3rd, 2020, 9:23 pmSpace - the true meaning of space is the absence of matter that continues forever. - True statement.
Are you aware that there are particles of matter, and objects made of matter, in the Universe?

If not, then those objects that can be observed and experienced are made of matter. 'Matter' co-exists with 'space', which I agree is the absence of matter, but BOTH form the whole Universe. BOTH space AND matter are what the Universe is comprised of. Therefore, one of them cannot logically continue forever, as you so believe one of them does.

If, as you propose, 'space', which is the absence of matter, continues forever, is a True statement, then how do you explain away those particles and objects of matter in the Universe, which obviously must even exist, to you?

Contrary to your belief, space does NOT continue forever because it is interrupted by matter, in places.

Obviously the Universe continues forever, but just as obvious is an absence of matter cannot continue forever, literally, because there IS matter.
gater wrote: January 3rd, 2020, 9:23 pmTime is absolutely a constant - there was no beginning of time, it doesn't slow or stop, it continues at the same rate everywhere in the Universe, and it always has, and always will - that is the true nature of time.
But 'time' is NOT an actual physical thing. So, there is NO 'rate' to time. Therefore, 'time' cannot continue at the same rate everywhere in the Universe.

Unless of course you can be the first human being to actual prove how 'time' exists physically.

Will you be the first human being to be able to explain what 'time' IS, in the physical sense?

If you do, then you might also be able to show how there is an actual rate of change of 'time', itself. But until it can be shown and proven that 'time' is some actual physical thing, then how could it even be explained that 'time' has any rate of change, which could either remain the same, or accelerates or decelerates depending on the speed at which an object is moving.
gater wrote: January 3rd, 2020, 9:23 pmif I contend 2 plus 2 is 4 - that's a true statement - its not my truth - im just identifying it as true.
Maybe so, and what is also a True statement is maths, or 2 plus 2 is 4, is NOT what is in discussion here. Mathematical equations do not have much to do with the size of space, nor if 'time' is an actual physical thing or not, which is what we were just discussing.

Bringing in an actual True statement, and then inferring because I just said this one, then that means my other statements are True ones also, is beyond absurd, and stupid, to me.

If you want to show that your other (said "True") statements are in fact True statements, then you just have to prove this, and not just say they are.
gater wrote: January 3rd, 2020, 9:23 pmThe same with time and space, I told you the truth - its not my truth, it not my opinion.
LOL Okay.

So, the one known as "gator" has and knows the Universal Truth of things, but, unfortunately, and also coincidentally, is not able to back this up with any actual True empirical evidence nor proof, nor with any actual logical and reasonable explanations, nor, with even any sound nor valid arguments.

But, as can be observed, "gator" has BELIEF, which, to them, is obviously is all that is needed, as well as being irrefutable, itself, that belief is all that is appeared to be needed to KNOW the Truth of things.
gater
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Joined: September 6th, 2019, 12:02 am

Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by gater »

You can lead a horse to water - but you cant make him drink.
I can tell you the truth - but I cant make you understand it.
Atla
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Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by Atla »

Mirror matchup :)
True philosophy points to the Moon
gater
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Joined: September 6th, 2019, 12:02 am

Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by gater »

What I am telling you is that the Scientific Community is clueless when it come to understanding time and space. They think gravity effects Time - it doesn't, that space can "bend" - wrong too. They think the Universe had a start - it didn't.
They are teaching this false information on the Science Channel right now.
Maybe it doesn't matter if the world is fed false info, its irrelevant to their daily lives I suppose.

If you ever learn to use your own mind, you might discover that what ive been telling you is true. The Universe is not that complicated - its 3 things, Time, Space, and Matter. But you need to relearn those topics because todays "science" is full of false theories.
creation
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Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by creation »

gater wrote: January 7th, 2020, 10:29 pm What I am telling you is that the Scientific Community is clueless when it come to understanding time and space. They think gravity effects Time - it doesn't, that space can "bend" - wrong too. They think the Universe had a start - it didn't.
They are teaching this false information on the Science Channel right now.
Maybe it doesn't matter if the world is fed false info, its irrelevant to their daily lives I suppose.

If you ever learn to use your own mind, you might discover that what ive been telling you is true.
But all I get from you is what things are not.

You do not tell us what things are.
gater wrote: January 7th, 2020, 10:29 pm The Universe is not that complicated - its 3 things, Time, Space, and Matter.
But the Universe is only made up of two things, space and matter. The Universe is even far more basic, and far more simple and and far easier to understand, and explain, than you realize yet.
gater wrote: January 7th, 2020, 10:29 pm But you need to relearn those topics because todays "science" is full of false theories.
And, you need to tell us what those things are EXACTLY, and stop telling us what they are not.

For example; If you continue to tell us that the scientific community is clueless when it comes to understanding time and space, then clue them up on what needs to be understood on time and space.

Tell us what is false and what is true.

Also, if gravity does not effect time, space does not bend, and the Universe did not start, then explain exactly what actually happens ,and how the Universe could not have a beginning.

By the way these things are extremely very basic things to understand, and so they are also very easy and very simple to explain to others, so that they to can understand.

Instead of telling us that you know what you are talking about. Just do it.
gater
Posts: 267
Joined: September 6th, 2019, 12:02 am

Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by gater »

What makes you think that the Universe had a beginning?
There is no evidence that anything effects time - only people that don't understand time cite "time dilation" - Einstein didn't understand time, and many follow his beliefs without understanding what he was thinking.
Everything I wrote about the true nature of time and space is true - is factual.
creation
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Joined: November 22nd, 2019, 10:39 pm

Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by creation »

gater wrote: January 11th, 2020, 4:05 pm What makes you think that the Universe had a beginning?

Who is this question posed to?

If it was for me, then I do not think that the Universe had a beginning?

What made you make such an absurd assumption?


There is no evidence that anything effects time - only people that don't understand time cite "time dilation" - Einstein didn't understand time, and many follow his beliefs without understanding what he was thinking.

I "cite" "time dilation" because to explain how and why something is wrong, then 'it' needs to be cited. Otherwise no one would know what 'it' is that I am saying is wrong and false.

From my perspective you also do not yet understand 'time' either.

Everything I wrote about the true nature of time and space is true - is factual.
LOL

Just adding the word 'true' does not make it true.

What you have written, like einstein, and like scientific writings, can be proven to be false, wrong, and/or incorrect.

But you, like the scientific community, are STUCK in your own beliefs of what is true, right, and correct, and therefore are not open to seeing what is actually true, right, AND correct.

Tell me what is the "true nature" of 'time' and of 'space', and I will ask you a series of questions, which, if you answer them openly and honestly, will themselves reveal and prove that what you say is the "true nature" of 'time' and of 'space' is actually NOT factual at all.

If you are up for this challenge, then let us proceed.

What is the "true nature" of 'time' and of 'space', from your perspective?
gater
Posts: 267
Joined: September 6th, 2019, 12:02 am

Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by gater »

Creation - The Universe has always been here - fact.
Space extends forever - fact.
There was no beginning of time - fact.
Time is a constant, it never slows or changes - fact.
Nothing effects time or space - facts.
Matter creates gravity and only effects other matter - fact.

When you understand these facts get back to me.
creation
Posts: 1172
Joined: November 22nd, 2019, 10:39 pm

Re: Thoughts on Time and Space.

Post by creation »

gater wrote: January 12th, 2020, 4:39 pm Creation - The Universe has always been here - fact.
Space extends forever - fact.
There was no beginning of time - fact.
Time is a constant, it never slows or changes - fact.
Nothing effects time or space - facts.
Matter creates gravity and only effects other matter - fact.

When you understand these facts get back to me.
These facts have already been well understood, for some time now. But the ones that are not facts you do not yet understand, so when you do understand the facts get back to me.

What you are intending by 'space' extends 'forever' can not be true in the absolute sense. Because the 'forever' word is misleading and so not truly factual at all. Of course the Universe extends forever, but the Universe is made up of space AND matter. So, it could said that matter and space together extend forever, but obviously because the Universe is just not space itself, then space, by itself, does not extend forever. Space is limited by matter. Space is not bounded by matter, but because exists together with matter. Space can not in the absolute sense extend forever. If there is a moon, a sun, and/or an earth, for example, there is some thing preventing the extend of 'forever' of space.

And,

There is no such physical thing as 'time', for it to be a constant. If there was, then you could demonstrate what 'time' is, and what its constant is exactly.

So, like I said, when you understand these facts get back to me.
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