Origin Quesitons

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Marvin_Edwards
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Re: Origin Quesitons

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evolution wrote: May 14th, 2020, 4:00 am
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 13th, 2020, 6:00 amThere are some who presume that only a single set of galaxies related to a single Big Bang event exists. I do not presume that to be the case. Since there is no way to prove or disprove either presumption, they are equally valid.
And there are some who do not presume anything at all here but instead just look at what actually happens. This way they do not assume what could have happened. They, instead, SEE what thee actual Truth IS.
But we cannot see beyond the observable universe: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Observable_universe".

So, we don't really know what is beyond it, and we are free to theorize what may lay beyond.
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by evolution »

Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 14th, 2020, 10:50 am
evolution wrote: May 14th, 2020, 4:00 am


And there are some who do not presume anything at all here but instead just look at what actually happens. This way they do not assume what could have happened. They, instead, SEE what thee actual Truth IS.
But we cannot see beyond the observable universe: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Observable_universe".
Who even suggested we could?

Are you at all able to provide a logical explanation for some sort of boundary and/or separation between alleged different universes?
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 14th, 2020, 10:50 am So, we don't really know what is beyond it, and we are free to theorize what may lay beyond.
Yes you are right, you are absolutely free to do whatever so pleases you. You, and others, can theorize for the rest of eternity for all I care. But doing that will never actually help you to SEE what is blatantly obviously HERE right NOW, in front of you.
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Re: Origin Quesitons

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evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 3:30 am
Yes you are right, you are absolutely free to do whatever so pleases you. You, and others, can theorize for the rest of eternity for all I care. But doing that will never actually help you to SEE what is blatantly obviously HERE right NOW, in front of you.
This seems to be a problem with many theists. They tend to think that belief is nothing more than a choice. The fact is, that when you grow up and challenge the puppy-fat beliefs of god and all that stuff many who evolve into adulthood realise that taking something as true requires, thinking, criticism, skepticism, evidence, reason and justification.
Where the theist fails is in their adoption of faith. It is faith which dulls the mind, and allows it to reject all that does not quite fit cosily into the monument of lies given by the church and the scripture, by the black devils called priests, and vicars.
So, NO, no one is "free to do whatever so pleases you", because "seeing what is blatantly obvious" is the myth of the fool who has faith.
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Re: Origin Quesitons

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evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 3:30 am
Are you at all able to provide a logical explanation for some sort of boundary and/or separation between alleged different universes?
Yes. Infinite space provides the boundary. In a Big Bounce scenario a given universe expands and then contracts. Beyond the edge of that limited expansion there will be some spatial distance and then we find the edge of another universe's expansion. And so on. And on. And on.

On the other hand, there may be some exchange of material between these two-to-N universes at their edges. Who knows? I certainly don't. Neither do you.
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by evolution »

Sculptor1 wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:15 am
evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 3:30 am
Yes you are right, you are absolutely free to do whatever so pleases you. You, and others, can theorize for the rest of eternity for all I care. But doing that will never actually help you to SEE what is blatantly obviously HERE right NOW, in front of you.
This seems to be a problem with many theists.
LOL another one who continually makes assumptions, and who is continually completely and utterly WRONG.

I am as far from being a theist as could possibly be.

You are so easy to manipulate and to make you make the most absurd assumptions.
Sculptor1 wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:15 am They tend to think that belief is nothing more than a choice. The fact is, that when you grow up and challenge the puppy-fat beliefs of god and all that stuff many who evolve into adulthood realise that taking something as true requires, thinking, criticism, skepticism, evidence, reason and justification.
And when you grow wiser you will learn to ask for clarification BEFORE you make the most absurd and ridiculous assumptions that you continually do.

If you, or anyone else, ever wanted to delve into what I actually say and write, then just how much actual critical thinking I have done will soon become obvious.

As I say I am OPEN to any and all clarifying and/or challenging that anyone wants to try on me.
Sculptor1 wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:15 am Where the theist fails is in their adoption of faith. It is faith which dulls the mind, and allows it to reject all that does not quite fit cosily into the monument of lies given by the church and the scripture, by the black devils called priests, and vicars.
Besides all of this being absolute moot, did you forget that it was you who stated something like: "There is no mind"?
Sculptor1 wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:15 am So, NO, no one is "free to do whatever so pleases you", because "seeing what is blatantly obvious" is the myth of the fool who has faith.
WHY did you add the word 'you' into the first quote?

Seeing what is blatantly obvious, that is; Thee Truth, is very easy and very simple to do. Once you KNOW HOW.
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by evolution »

Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am
evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 3:30 am
Are you at all able to provide a logical explanation for some sort of boundary and/or separation between alleged different universes?
Yes. Infinite space provides the boundary.
Are you aware of the distance of infinite?
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am In a Big Bounce scenario a given universe expands and then contracts. Beyond the edge of that limited expansion there will be some spatial distance and then we find the edge of another universe's expansion. And so on. And on. And on.
LOL and what is this supposed "edge" made of exactly?

What is on one "side", and what is on the other "side"?
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am On the other hand, there may be some exchange of material between these two-to-N universes at their edges. Who knows? I certainly don't. Neither do you.
Of course I do not know. This is because an "edge" of thee Universe is illogical. As evidence by your completely inability to even explain how there could logically be one.
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by Sculptor1 »

evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 8:48 am
Sculptor1 wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:15 am

This seems to be a problem with many theists.
LOL another one who continually makes assumptions, and who is continually completely and utterly WRONG.

I am as far from being a theist as could possibly be.

You are so easy to manipulate and to make you make the most absurd assumptions.
Sculptor1 wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:15 am They tend to think that belief is nothing more than a choice. The fact is, that when you grow up and challenge the puppy-fat beliefs of god and all that stuff many who evolve into adulthood realise that taking something as true requires, thinking, criticism, skepticism, evidence, reason and justification.
And when you grow wiser you will learn to ask for clarification BEFORE you make the most absurd and ridiculous assumptions that you continually do.

If you, or anyone else, ever wanted to delve into what I actually say and write, then just how much actual critical thinking I have done will soon become obvious.

As I say I am OPEN to any and all clarifying and/or challenging that anyone wants to try on me.
Sculptor1 wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:15 am Where the theist fails is in their adoption of faith. It is faith which dulls the mind, and allows it to reject all that does not quite fit cosily into the monument of lies given by the church and the scripture, by the black devils called priests, and vicars.
Besides all of this being absolute moot, did you forget that it was you who stated something like: "There is no mind"?
Sculptor1 wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:15 am So, NO, no one is "free to do whatever so pleases you", because "seeing what is blatantly obvious" is the myth of the fool who has faith.
WHY did you add the word 'you' into the first quote?

Seeing what is blatantly obvious, that is; Thee Truth, is very easy and very simple to do. Once you KNOW HOW.
The trick of engaging in a conversation online is that you need to do a little more than rejecting a comment with such phrases as "you are wrong".
Its best to offer some detail about how and why you think that is the case.

Similarly if you are making massive claims about knowing "Thee Truth", in order that readers don't just laugh you off, you'll need to back up these wild claims, else it just seems like megalomania.

Let me ask you a question, which may clear things up a bit for you.
Do you think it at all possible that a person who takes something on faith could ever be wrong?

Without thinking, criticism, skepticism, evidence, reason and justification etc - what value has any faith based claim?
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by evolution »

Sculptor1 wrote: May 15th, 2020, 8:56 am
evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 8:48 am

LOL another one who continually makes assumptions, and who is continually completely and utterly WRONG.

I am as far from being a theist as could possibly be.

You are so easy to manipulate and to make you make the most absurd assumptions.



And when you grow wiser you will learn to ask for clarification BEFORE you make the most absurd and ridiculous assumptions that you continually do.

If you, or anyone else, ever wanted to delve into what I actually say and write, then just how much actual critical thinking I have done will soon become obvious.

As I say I am OPEN to any and all clarifying and/or challenging that anyone wants to try on me.



Besides all of this being absolute moot, did you forget that it was you who stated something like: "There is no mind"?



WHY did you add the word 'you' into the first quote?

Seeing what is blatantly obvious, that is; Thee Truth, is very easy and very simple to do. Once you KNOW HOW.
The trick of engaging in a conversation online is that you need to do a little more than rejecting a comment with such phrases as "you are wrong".
Its best to offer some detail about how and why you think that is the case.
I already told you how and why you are WRONG.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am Similarly if you are making massive claims about knowing "Thee Truth", in order that readers don't just laugh you off, you'll need to back up these wild claims, else it just seems like megalomania.
I can do this. I have also informed of what is needed as well.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am Let me ask you a question, which may clear things up a bit for you.
And take notice of what I do, which you rarely ever do. That is; I will answer your question.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am Do you think it at all possible that a person who takes something on faith could ever be wrong?
OF COURSE.

I also think it is possible that a person who takes something on belief, and makes assumptions, could also be WRONG. This is why I do not do belief, faith, nor assumptions.

Remember it is you who is continually making assumptions here and continually being WRONG in regards to me.

You are completely and utterly WRONG in any assumption that I am an theist, or even talking about theists as though they have anything at all to do with me.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am Without thinking, criticism, skepticism, evidence, reason and justification etc - what value has any faith based claim?
If you want an answer to this question, then you will have to direct this question to those who have faith.
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by Marvin_Edwards »

evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 8:55 am
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am Yes. Infinite space provides the boundary.
Are you aware of the distance of infinite?
Of course. It is precisely one infinity long. And half of infinity is also precisely one infinity long. Have you never encountered the concepts of infinity and eternity before?
evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 8:55 am
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am In a Big Bounce scenario a given universe expands and then contracts. Beyond the edge of that limited expansion there will be some spatial distance and then we find the edge of another universe's expansion. And so on. And on. And on.
LOL and what is this supposed "edge" made of exactly?
It's not made of anything. The edge between my house and my neighbor's house is basically a line marking the boundary between my yard and his.
evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 8:55 am What is on one "side", and what is on the other "side"?
On one side is my universe and on the other side is someone else's universe. A universe is that set of galaxies generated by a specific Big Bang. Given infinity, there's plenty of room for an infinite number of such universes.

evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 8:55 am
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am On the other hand, there may be some exchange of material between these two-to-N universes at their edges. Who knows? I certainly don't. Neither do you.
Of course I do not know. This is because an "edge" of thee Universe is illogical. As evidence by your completely inability to even explain how there could logically be one.
The thing without an edge is called "infinity".
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by Marvin_Edwards »

evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 9:10 am
Sculptor1 wrote: May 15th, 2020, 8:56 am

The trick of engaging in a conversation online is that you need to do a little more than rejecting a comment with such phrases as "you are wrong".
Its best to offer some detail about how and why you think that is the case.
I already told you how and why you are WRONG.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am Similarly if you are making massive claims about knowing "Thee Truth", in order that readers don't just laugh you off, you'll need to back up these wild claims, else it just seems like megalomania.
I can do this. I have also informed of what is needed as well.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am Let me ask you a question, which may clear things up a bit for you.
And take notice of what I do, which you rarely ever do. That is; I will answer your question.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am Do you think it at all possible that a person who takes something on faith could ever be wrong?
OF COURSE.

I also think it is possible that a person who takes something on belief, and makes assumptions, could also be WRONG. This is why I do not do belief, faith, nor assumptions.

Remember it is you who is continually making assumptions here and continually being WRONG in regards to me.

You are completely and utterly WRONG in any assumption that I am an theist, or even talking about theists as though they have anything at all to do with me.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 6:40 am Without thinking, criticism, skepticism, evidence, reason and justification etc - what value has any faith based claim?
If you want an answer to this question, then you will have to direct this question to those who have faith.
Hey! Evolution. Stop putting my name on quotes taken from someone else! Thanks. Marvin.
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by evolution »

Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 10:54 am
evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 8:55 am

Are you aware of the distance of infinite?
Of course. It is precisely one infinity long. And half of infinity is also precisely one infinity long. Have you never encountered the concepts of infinity and eternity before?
I am the one who is proposing that thee one and only Universe is infinite and eternal. So, yes I have OBVIOUSLY encountered the concepts of infinity and eternity before. Oh, and by the way, unlike you so far, I am able to back up and support my proposition with logical explanations.

Obviously the intent of your question here to detract away, does not follow in line with the intention of your previous answer, which is; according to your logic, the boundary between these supposed and alleged "separate universes" is, what you call, ''infinite space". Now, it appears that you have not really thought this through at all. How can there be as you call it "one infinity long" space between two physically visible things?

If you recall correctly I asked you; Are you at all able to provide a logical explanation for some sort of boundary and/or separation between alleged different universes?

Providing the response: Yes. Infinite space provides the boundary. is NOT a logical explanation at all, from my perspective anyway. Now, of course, you may now be able to provide a logical explanation of how 'one infinitely long space' could be logically possible between two physically visible things, like universes, but until then I am non the wiser in regards to what you allege is possible. So, are you now able to provide a logical explanation for an 'infinitely long space' supposedly separating different universes?
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 10:54 am
evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 8:55 am

LOL and what is this supposed "edge" made of exactly?
It's not made of anything. The edge between my house and my neighbor's house is basically a line marking the boundary between my yard and his.
So, are you now suggesting the "edge" between your universe and your neighbor's universe is basically a "line", which you place yourself by marking the boundary between your yard and your neighbor's universe's yard?

If this is anything like what you are now suggesting and/or proposing, then really there is no actual distinction other than some imagined and made up "line" by you, and/or them.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 10:54 am
evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 8:55 am What is on one "side", and what is on the other "side"?
On one side is my universe and on the other side is someone else's universe. A universe is that set of galaxies generated by a specific Big Bang.
But how do you know which galaxies are generated from one specific alleged and supposed "big bang", from another so called "big bang"? If, as you say, the distinction between two galaxies is not made up of anything other than some self proclaimed "line", then really there is obviously no actually thing separating the two.

Just like there is really no actual thing separating your house from your neighbors house other than some agreed upon "line", and a few words on a piece of paper to make it so called "legal", there is also no actual thing separating these imagined different universes.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 10:54 am Given infinity, there's plenty of room for an infinite number of such universes.
Given infinity, there is also enough room for one infinite Universe as well.

Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 10:54 am

The thing without an edge is called "infinity".
Which sums up this one and only Universe quite nicely.
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by evolution »

Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 15th, 2020, 10:58 am
evolution wrote: May 15th, 2020, 9:10 am

I already told you how and why you are WRONG.



I can do this. I have also informed of what is needed as well.



And take notice of what I do, which you rarely ever do. That is; I will answer your question.



OF COURSE.

I also think it is possible that a person who takes something on belief, and makes assumptions, could also be WRONG. This is why I do not do belief, faith, nor assumptions.

Remember it is you who is continually making assumptions here and continually being WRONG in regards to me.

You are completely and utterly WRONG in any assumption that I am an theist, or even talking about theists as though they have anything at all to do with me.



If you want an answer to this question, then you will have to direct this question to those who have faith.
Hey! Evolution. Stop putting my name on quotes taken from someone else! Thanks. Marvin.
Sorry about this profusely. I have a very bad habit of not changing previous copied usernames, and not checking when I paste. I have to do much better than this. Apologies again.
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by Marvin_Edwards »

evolution wrote: May 16th, 2020, 8:26 pm Which sums up this one and only Universe quite nicely.
So, for you, infinity is the single universe. Using your terms then, I am suggesting that within that single universe of infinite size there will be room for more than one Big Bang to occur. Each Big Bang would have its own set of expanding galaxies. And, given infinite space, they would never interact with each other.

Now, you ask for me to provide some logical argument for this notion. The logic is that, given infinite space, it would be unlikely that our observable set of galaxies would be the only one. In the same fashion that early man imagined the Earth to be the center of everything, it may be equally short-sighted of us to presume that our observable set of galaxies is the only one out there in infinite space.

I don't offer any proof of this. It is simply a notion of a possibility.
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by evolution »

Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 16th, 2020, 9:25 pm
evolution wrote: May 16th, 2020, 8:26 pm Which sums up this one and only Universe quite nicely.
So, for you, infinity is the single universe. Using your terms then, I am suggesting that within that single universe of infinite size there will be room for more than one Big Bang to occur.
I do not disagree with this at all, except I would not call more than one bang "a big bang", for the obvious reason of what the word 'big' means and refers to.

To me, there could be countless bangs, which have happened in this Universe, and maybe are happening right now. But the chances of them being the exact same size and so all being 'big bangs' I think will be highly unlikely. So, to me anyway, although there may be many 'bangs' happening they probably are of varying different sizes, and so not all 'big bangs' at all.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 16th, 2020, 9:25 pm Each Big Bang would have its own set of expanding galaxies. And, given infinite space, they would never interact with each other.
Just because there is an area of infinite size that in no way infers that expanding universes would not interact with each other. They all in fact could be interacting with each other.

Also, if as you propose there are these different so called "big bangs" causing or creating expanding galaxies, then how do you explain where these bangs came from and what caused them? If there are bangs occurring and appearing in completely empty areas, and the expansion of them would not interact with other expansions, then what could possibly cause these bangs to occur in the first place, and how and where did the material from them come from exactly? Are you able to explain this in any logical way?

See, from my perspective, what I am proposing is can all be very logically explained, and be actually very possible.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 16th, 2020, 9:25 pm Now, you ask for me to provide some logical argument for this notion. The logic is that, given infinite space, it would be unlikely that our observable set of galaxies would be the only one.
What has the observable area of the Universe, and this tiny minute area and minuscule set of galaxies, got to do with the whole Universe, Itself?

Your so called "logic" still does not stand up at all, well to me anyway. Actually, what you are saying is becoming more illogical.
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 16th, 2020, 9:25 pm In the same fashion that early man imagined the Earth to be the center of everything, it may be equally short-sighted of us to presume that our observable set of galaxies is the only one out there in infinite space.
Is there any human being in the days of when this is being written who actually thinks that the observable part of the Universe is the only thing here, or as you call it "out there"?
Marvin_Edwards wrote: May 16th, 2020, 9:25 pm I don't offer any proof of this. It is simply a notion of a possibility.
But it is not yet simply a notion of possibility at all.

For your notions/ideas to become even a possibility, then you will have to:
1. Explain logically where all these so called "big bangs" could come from, and how they could occur in the beginning.
2. Explain logically how there could be an infinite distance between physical matter.
3. Explain logically how physical matter that is expanding from two so called "separate big bangs" and the matter from two separate bangs never collide.

See, ALL of these things can be logically explained and be shown to be extremely possible in this one and only Universe, and this can be explained and understood very simply and very easily,
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Re: Origin Quesitons

Post by Marvin_Edwards »

evolution wrote: May 17th, 2020, 3:05 am
For your notions/ideas to become even a possibility, then you will have to:
1. Explain logically where all these so called "big bangs" could come from, and how they could occur in the beginning.
2. Explain logically how there could be an infinite distance between physical matter.
3. Explain logically how physical matter that is expanding from two so called "separate big bangs" and the matter from two separate bangs never collide.

See, ALL of these things can be logically explained and be shown to be extremely possible in this one and only Universe, and this can be explained and understood very simply and very easily,
1. The answer to where all the other big bangs come from is simple: the same place that the local big bang came from. Each is a separate, eternal cycling between a big bang and a big crunch. The only difference is their location.
2. How can there be an infinite distance between two physical objects? I don't know, but that is how the notions of infinity and eternity work. Infinity divided by 2 is infinity. Eternity divided by 2 is eternity. We are always precisely in the middle of infinity, with an infinite space in any direction. Now, things may be in that space which are not infinitely distant from us, like all the stuff around me in this room. Even the location of the big bang is a finite distance from us and a finite time ago.
3. The reason two big bang expansions never collide is because black holes are all over the place re-accumulating the planets and stars and galaxies. This is the big crunch part of the big bounce cycle.
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April 2021

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute: Tools To Spark Your Dream And Ignite Your Follow-Through

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute
by Jeff Meyer
May 2021

Surviving the Business of Healthcare: Knowledge is Power

Surviving the Business of Healthcare
by Barbara Galutia Regis M.S. PA-C
June 2021

Winning the War on Cancer: The Epic Journey Towards a Natural Cure

Winning the War on Cancer
by Sylvie Beljanski
July 2021

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream
by Dr Frank L Douglas
August 2021

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts
by Mark L. Wdowiak
September 2021

The Preppers Medical Handbook

The Preppers Medical Handbook
by Dr. William W Forgey M.D.
October 2021

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress: A Practical Guide

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress
by Dr. Gustavo Kinrys, MD
November 2021

Dream For Peace: An Ambassador Memoir

Dream For Peace
by Dr. Ghoulem Berrah
December 2021