Expanded Science

Use this forum to discuss the philosophy of science. Philosophy of science deals with the assumptions, foundations, and implications of science.
Marabod
Banned
Posts: 977
Joined: March 25th, 2010, 9:54 pm

Post by Marabod »

1-No scientific theory can be proved true.
2-A scientific theory can only be proved false.
3-A theory which cannot be refuted is not a scientific theory.
Rubbish! There is a scientific theory that if a fist of a person A comes in impact contact with the nose of a person B, then the nose of the person B would respond with intensive bleeding. Any empirical test of this theory proves it right (easy to check, just volunteer to become a person B yourself). Perhaps the Popper's nose could refute it and prove it false - but, alas, Popper is not available for such test anymore.
Noshitsherlock
Posts: 93
Joined: October 21st, 2010, 10:46 pm

Post by Noshitsherlock »

@Noshitsherlock, incidentally the link I just posted answers your question, so if you have the patience to read it, I recommend it to you.
Wowbagger it didn`t answer my question. It said something about burden of proof, but thats science framing the question to something outside of its domain. Whatever you argue against religion you can`t argue burden of proof. Its all faith based.
Wowbagger
Posts: 649
Joined: July 19th, 2010, 9:46 am
Favorite Philosopher: Peter Singer _ David Pearce

Post by Wowbagger »

Noshitsherlock wrote:Whatever you argue against religion you can`t argue burden of proof. Its all faith based.
No **** it's faith based. That's the point, and I argued that faith is a very bad way of trying to find truth. The burden of proof is indeed the argument against it.

Think about it, if I told you I have faith that after I die I become a frog, why should anyone take this seriously if there's no evidence for it? Or how should one try to disprove such a claim?
Noshitsherlock
Posts: 93
Joined: October 21st, 2010, 10:46 pm

Post by Noshitsherlock »

No **** it's faith based. That's the point, and I argued that faith is a very bad way of trying to find truth. The burden of proof is indeed the argument against it.
NO that was the point I made in the first place on this thread, you just want me to leave this thread and listen to you rant on about burdens of proof. Its your double standard at work. The people who choose to have faith have many intelligible reasons why they do, you paint a broad brush over who they are and how they think and say they have to prove to a skeptic like you and the opposer of their belief. Its pretentious when using science to frame burden of proof on those with faith which isn`t an exact science.
have faith that after I die I become a frog, why should anyone take this seriously
Indeed. So why compare what others intelligently decided is their faith to your immature assertion that you just decided you are going to be a frog after you die?
My post was asking why the double standard, not why groups and millions of people believe thats another subject. Brainwashing comes under the whys. If they repeat what they read without thinking about what they read.
Wowbagger
Posts: 649
Joined: July 19th, 2010, 9:46 am
Favorite Philosopher: Peter Singer _ David Pearce

Post by Wowbagger »

Faith is defined as "belief without evidence". And given that "x is comforting therefore x is true" is a fallacy, where exactly do the 'intelligible reasons' come in? Faith is irrational.

It's something different if people think their faith is based on evidence. But then it isn't faith in the sense I meant anymore. In that case, it simply comes down to whether 'their' evidence qualifies, which makes it a different discussion.

You're the one bringing up a double-standart. I was simply talking about science, which is a proven way of finding out 'truths' about the world. You're bringing in something else (faith) claiming, but not proving that it is useful.
Marabod
Banned
Posts: 977
Joined: March 25th, 2010, 9:54 pm

Post by Marabod »

Wow, science is not targeting to discover some "truths"! The discovery of the facts and their links is needed to make and SELL something practically usable. There is no fanatic truth-seekers in science, these are all in the religions. Science is a rational commercial enterprise, run by the pragmatics.
Wowbagger
Posts: 649
Joined: July 19th, 2010, 9:46 am
Favorite Philosopher: Peter Singer _ David Pearce

Post by Wowbagger »

Actually there are lots of people who study science for the sake of curiosity. Scientists aren't that well-paid. And think of all the astrophysicists working on GUT or m-theory. They aren't doing it for the money.

Needless to say, some people certainly do things for the money. And all the pharma company research (which pays more than the rest), I get what you mean.
Marabod
Banned
Posts: 977
Joined: March 25th, 2010, 9:54 pm

Post by Marabod »

Wowbagger wrote:Actually there are lots of people who study science for the sake of curiosity. Scientists aren't that well-paid. And think of all the astrophysicists working on GUT or m-theory. They aren't doing it for the money.

Needless to say, some people certainly do things for the money. And all the pharma company research (which pays more than the rest), I get what you mean.
Science has many layers (just like the ogres or the onions :) ) Some top areas of science are fully abstract, so they do not bring the immediate practical solutions - but their role is to establish a valid search field for the practical sciences. Astrophysics is a new science, not yet commonly recognised as a separate science, so far it is only a branch of Physics which tries to study the macro-processes in the Universe. Whatever the Astro-Physicists discover remains on their responsibility, as the other branches of science do not have practical means to experimentally verify their discoveries.

As for the Curiosity, it is certainly one of the moving forces of any scientific research, as it establishes the Initiative. A scientist is curious to know how this or that happens, and this stimulates the diversification of the approaches; all major discoveries are made by the curious people. But this does not eliminate their practical side, as one the same time can be curious if some buck can be made of a pure water :)
Noshitsherlock
Posts: 93
Joined: October 21st, 2010, 10:46 pm

Post by Noshitsherlock »

@Wowbagger

"One who seeks God through logical proof is like someone searching for the sun with a lamp."


Shihab al-Din al-Suhrawardi (1154-1191),
The Wisdom of Illuminism
Post Reply

Return to “Philosophy of Science”

2023/2024 Philosophy Books of the Month

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise
by John K Danenbarger
January 2023

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul
by Mitzi Perdue
February 2023

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness
by Chet Shupe
March 2023

The Unfakeable Code®

The Unfakeable Code®
by Tony Jeton Selimi
April 2023

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are
by Alan Watts
May 2023

Killing Abel

Killing Abel
by Michael Tieman
June 2023

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead
by E. Alan Fleischauer
July 2023

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough
by Mark Unger
August 2023

Predictably Irrational

Predictably Irrational
by Dan Ariely
September 2023

Artwords

Artwords
by Beatriz M. Robles
November 2023

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope
by Dr. Randy Ross
December 2023

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes
by Ali Master
February 2024

2022 Philosophy Books of the Month

Emotional Intelligence At Work

Emotional Intelligence At Work
by Richard M Contino & Penelope J Holt
January 2022

Free Will, Do You Have It?

Free Will, Do You Have It?
by Albertus Kral
February 2022

My Enemy in Vietnam

My Enemy in Vietnam
by Billy Springer
March 2022

2X2 on the Ark

2X2 on the Ark
by Mary J Giuffra, PhD
April 2022

The Maestro Monologue

The Maestro Monologue
by Rob White
May 2022

What Makes America Great

What Makes America Great
by Bob Dowell
June 2022

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!
by Jerry Durr
July 2022

Living in Color

Living in Color
by Mike Murphy
August 2022 (tentative)

The Not So Great American Novel

The Not So Great American Novel
by James E Doucette
September 2022

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches
by John N. (Jake) Ferris
October 2022

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All
by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
November 2022

The Smartest Person in the Room: The Root Cause and New Solution for Cybersecurity

The Smartest Person in the Room
by Christian Espinosa
December 2022

2021 Philosophy Books of the Month

The Biblical Clock: The Untold Secrets Linking the Universe and Humanity with God's Plan

The Biblical Clock
by Daniel Friedmann
March 2021

Wilderness Cry: A Scientific and Philosophical Approach to Understanding God and the Universe

Wilderness Cry
by Dr. Hilary L Hunt M.D.
April 2021

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute: Tools To Spark Your Dream And Ignite Your Follow-Through

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute
by Jeff Meyer
May 2021

Surviving the Business of Healthcare: Knowledge is Power

Surviving the Business of Healthcare
by Barbara Galutia Regis M.S. PA-C
June 2021

Winning the War on Cancer: The Epic Journey Towards a Natural Cure

Winning the War on Cancer
by Sylvie Beljanski
July 2021

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream
by Dr Frank L Douglas
August 2021

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts
by Mark L. Wdowiak
September 2021

The Preppers Medical Handbook

The Preppers Medical Handbook
by Dr. William W Forgey M.D.
October 2021

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress: A Practical Guide

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress
by Dr. Gustavo Kinrys, MD
November 2021

Dream For Peace: An Ambassador Memoir

Dream For Peace
by Dr. Ghoulem Berrah
December 2021