Why does Existence Exist?

Discuss any topics related to metaphysics (the philosophical study of the principles of reality) or epistemology (the philosophical study of knowledge) in this forum.
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Rr6
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by Rr6 »

1} "U"niverse = "G"od
....the above is inclusive of the following set of two ergo it is as the top most comprehensive wholistic heirarchy....
..1a} metaphysical-1, mind/intellect/concept,
----------------------------------------------------------
...1b} metaphysical-2, macro-infinite non-occupied space,
...1c} finite, occupied space Universe/Uni-Verse.

2} Universe = God aka Uni-V-erse = G-o-d
...i.e. our finite occupied space Universe....

Time { frequency } that is inherently a terminal set of two { 2 }-- beginning and ending ---- is inherent to any occupied space.

Cartesian XYZ in of their-selves are each a set of 2, in three distinct directions, that, are not yet, a comprehensive whole, that, defines any specific, wholistic, 3D volume.

XYZ^2 = 4 or as 2^2 = 4, is minimally the four vertexes and the four faces/surfaces/openings of a tetra{4}hedron as, the comprehensive whole, as the 3D tetra[4}hedron.
XYZ tet.png
XYZ tet.png (31.21 KiB) Viewed 3279 times
See graphic in following link to 2D, tetra-wave
http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergeti ... f3826.html

Alternative to the above scenarios, we could say, that, the XYZ set, is initially given the value of 4, rather than 2, ergo 4^2 = 16.

Why 2nd powering is another issue we consider. E = mc^2 i.e. Energy = mass * speed of radiation squared/triangulated. Fuller goes into 2nd powering as related to geodesic surface area growth of a number of vertexes of a sphere/spherical.

r6
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RJG
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by RJG »

How do we know Existence Exists?
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Alec Smart
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by Alec Smart »

RJG wrote:How do we know Existence Exists?
Because Rr6 just posted a picture of it. Apparently, it looks vey similar to a green triangle.
Smart by name and Alec by nature.
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by Rr6 »

RJG wrote:How do we know Existence Exists?
Via our occupied space relationships to other occupied space phenomena, that, is then communicated to self or others.

We have two primary kinds of communication;

1} information bits as occupied space, in specific, definitive patterns, that, may aggregate as more complex, integral wholes, ex the pattern of occupied space letters in meetaphysical-1 pattern of taxi cab,

2} information bits as metaphysical-1, mind/intellect/concepts.

For the latter #2 above, we give the following example of metaphysical-1 concept being communicated.

We take the occupied space patterns as the words 'taxi cab' and rearrange them 'bca xita', so that, there exists no concept to be communicated because of no inherent definitive association between the pattern of occupied space letters and the concept we wish to communicate, taxi cab.

There are three primary kinds of existence, irrespective of the word "know".

1} metaphysical-1, mind/intellect/concepts ex concepts of Space, Time, God, Universe, Concepts
----------------line-of-demarcation--------------------------------------
2} macro-infinite non-occupied space,
3} finite, occupied space Universe aka Uni-V-erse.

The latter Uni-V-erse context is stated is formatted so, so as to show relationship to primary aspects of our occupied space Universe in my cosmic scenarios;

1} gravity associated with blue and the prefix Uni, as the phenomena that Unifys all occupied space into a finite wholtiscally coherent whole, irrespective of whether that whole expands or contracts.
...1a} positive shaped curvature of a outer surface of a torus--- set of tori ---that I believe are associated with every particle of our finite, occupied space Universe,

2} time{ in red V } as the associated with sine-wave frequencies { ^v^v or as /\/\/ } we derive from physical/energy/reality as the finite set of fermions and bosons and we observe within the body of the collective set of a tori that define define a particle, at least define in a static abstract way,

3} dark energy as associated with blood red, inner surface of same set of tori, that is negative shaped surface.

r6
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by Son_Of_Man »

UniversalAlien wrote:"Why does Existence Exist?" Can we question the reason for existence itself :?: Or is it a totally impossible question with no hope of even a vague answer?
1) Everything that exists has a reason for its existence.
Existence exists.
Therefore, existence must have a reason for its existence.

2) Everything that exists must have an essence-nature in which and by which it exists.
Existence exists.
Therefore, existence has an essence-nature by which and in which it exists.

If anyone can SEE this essence-nature of Existence then he/she will KNOW the 'reason why' existence exists.
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by Stepanok1 »

The question ''why does existence exist'' is without meaning. This is a question that ''I" "YOU" or "SOMEONE'' can ask. It does not appear in a void ,so to speak. It has to be asked by someone who EXISTS and replied , or not , by someone who EXISTS as well. The question otherwise exist in a vacuum. The only valid question that one can ask is why do ''I'', ''YOU" exist, and what does it means to exist as opposed to not existing.....(then perhaps, one of the meanings of someone existing could be his ability to ask the question)
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by Rr6 »

Occupied Space cannot be created nor destroyed.
...Space ( ) - Time ^v - Space )(.....
...1st of rational, logical common sense as an integral wholism.....

Physical/energy cannot be created nor destroyed
...1st law of thermodynamics.....

r6
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Keiran
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by Keiran »

But does something need to 'exist' in order to experience itself?

This world is of self-sufficient logic. It's a gigantic game of information and we are apart of it, that's why to us it 'exists'.
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by Rr6 »

Existence exist soley for the purpose of the existence of philosophers. Most philosphers know this at some time in there existent, if they exist long enough. :wink:
Rr6 wrote:Occupied Space cannot be created nor destroyed.
...Space ( ) - Time ^v - Space )(.....
...1st of rational, logical common sense as an integral wholism.....

Physical/energy cannot be created nor destroyed
...1st law of thermodynamics.....

r6
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by UniversalAlien »

Rr6 wrote:Existence exist soley for the purpose of the existence of philosophers. Most philosphers know this at some time in there existent, if they exist long enough. :wink:
Possible BUT - it is also possible that existence exists only because a 'philosophical mind' can conceive of a state of existence.

If there was no philosophical mind contemplating an existent state - no existent state would exist.

The key word here is the word 'existence' - the quality of existing.

Nothing can exist without an 'a priori' existent mind to say it exists.

Again, I will ask anybody to prove existence without mind - that mind came from an empty void,

Don't atheists believe that? - So who is really more guilty at proposing a supernatural, magical universe,
the Atheist or the Theist :?:
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by Rr6 »

UniversalAlien--Possible BUT - it is also possible that existence exists only because a 'philosophical mind' can conceive of a state of existence.

UA, to clarify, I was only kidding attempting humorous concepts. Sorry if did not clarify in that post.
If there was no philosophical mind contemplating an existent state - no existent state would exist.
YEah this is in around the anthropic and strong anthropic principel or theory etc....
The key word here is the word 'existence' - the quality of existing.
...1a} metaphyhsical-1, mind/intellect/concepts existence for what it is
-----line of demarcation----------------

....1b} metaphysical-2, macro-infinite non-occupied space existence, for what it is, and embraces the following,
...a void that does not constrain or restrain our finite occupied space Universe expansion or contraction.....

...1c} finite, occupied space Universe aka Uni-Verse.
Nothing can exist without an 'a priori' existent mind to say it exists.


No things { occupied space } or metaphysical-1, mind/intellect/concepts can be conscious { expressed } without consciousness if not specfically complex consciousnes we find with humans.
Again, I will ask anybody to prove existence without mind - that mind came from an empty void,
First we need to clarify with specific definitions of the terms we use as I do above with 1a - 1c.

2nd I agree with you in that, our finite, occupied space, Universe of dynamic inter-relationshisp are eternally complemented by shape/geometry/form/pattern that, can be complemented by metaphysical-1, abstract mathmatics i.e. not occupied space can exist that does not have matehmatical geometry nor more abstract mathematics.

Here again, people have to able to distiguish between metaphysical-1, abstract mathematics-- that includes geometry ---and that which occupies space. We do not see abstract matematicals in space, except when expressed via ink, pencil, crayons, pixels by mind-accessing creatures.
Don't atheists believe that? - So who is really more guilty at proposing a supernatural, magical universe,
the Atheist or the Theist :?:
Generally speaking, those who believe there exists a God outside of our finite, occupied space Universe are in error with there thoughts.

Universe is natural but it is also super-natural and magical in that some physics that humans did or not or do not understand appears as magical. Ex Ghosts may exist, but if they do, then they occupy space. People who say they saw a ghost means that the ghost was reflecting EMRadiation of a visible light frequencies.

r6

-- Updated September 5th, 2016, 10:59 am to add the following --

Also, to clarify, the exist no existence, beyond/outside of the the three I listed 1a, 1b and 1c. Those are the top of my cosmic hierarcy entigthled, "U"niverse: The Cosmic Hierarchy
Rr6 wrote:
UniversalAlien--Possible BUT - it is also possible that existence exists only because a 'philosophical mind' can conceive of a state of existence.

UA, to clarify, I was only kidding attempting humorous concepts. Sorry if did not clarify in that post.
If there was no philosophical mind contemplating an existent state - no existent state would exist.
YEah this is in around the anthropic and strong anthropic principel or theory etc....
The key word here is the word 'existence' - the quality of existing.
...1a} metaphyhsical-1, mind/intellect/concepts existence for what it is
-----line of demarcation----------------

....1b} metaphysical-2, macro-infinite non-occupied space existence, for what it is, and embraces the following,
...a void that does not constrain or restrain our finite occupied space Universe expansion or contraction.....

...1c} finite, occupied space Universe aka Uni-Verse.
Nothing can exist without an 'a priori' existent mind to say it exists.


No things { occupied space } or metaphysical-1, mind/intellect/concepts can be conscious { expressed } without consciousness if not specfically complex consciousnes we find with humans.
Again, I will ask anybody to prove existence without mind - that mind came from an empty void,
First we need to clarify with specific definitions of the terms we use as I do above with 1a - 1c.

2nd I agree with you in that, our finite, occupied space, Universe of dynamic inter-relationshisp are eternally complemented by shape/geometry/form/pattern that, can be complemented by metaphysical-1, abstract mathmatics i.e. not occupied space can exist that does not have matehmatical geometry nor more abstract mathematics.

Here again, people have to able to distiguish between metaphysical-1, abstract mathematics-- that includes geometry ---and that which occupies space. We do not see abstract matematicals in space, except when expressed via ink, pencil, crayons, pixels by mind-accessing creatures.
Don't atheists believe that? - So who is really more guilty at proposing a supernatural, magical universe,
the Atheist or the Theist :?:
Generally speaking, those who believe there exists a God outside of our finite, occupied space Universe are in error with there thoughts.

Universe is natural but it is also super-natural and magical in that some physics that humans did or not or do not understand appears as magical. Ex Ghosts may exist, but if they do, then they occupy space. People who say they saw a ghost means that the ghost was reflecting EMRadiation of a visible light frequencies.

r6
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by UniversalAlien »

I'll put it to you this way Rr6 - How valid and'or meaningful is your view and your theory of occupied, non-occupied and/or
metahphysical if you were not there to propose it :?:

Do theories have a life of their own :?: Probably not :!:

So we come back to what is called the 'observer effect' in physics - proven to actually effect what is being observed.

Now back to the original question 'Why does Existence Exist?' ........

And let me ask a better question - 'Can existence exist independently ?' - and what would that mean :?:

Amd I know I brought this up before - What would an existent state look like without some type of conscious mind
defining it :?:

So now I postulate that existence only exists if it can be observed to exist :idea:

No observer - No existence :idea: :arrow: :!:
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

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UniversalAlien--I'll put it to you this way Rr6 - How valid and'or meaningful is your view and your theory of occupied, non-occupied and/or
metahphysical if you were not there to propose it :?:
UA, if no one is here is offer any viewpoint, then the word "meaningful" is irrelevant/moot. Only humans assign meaning and purpose to this, that and Universe.

As for what Ive stated, in regards to 1a, 1b, and 1c being valid is same as asking are they true. If they are true{ a fact/absolute }, then whether there exists someone to propose them, or not, they are valid. Universe existence is valid, irrespective of whether there exists mind-accessing creatures.

What I read in some book I have, by some very intellectual university type, regarding anthrpic princi[-le, strong weak whatever, was that, if there is no mind-accessing creatures to observe parts of Universe and conceive of a whole Universe, then what is the point?

Again, there is no conceptual point, meaning purpose to Universe, beyond those that mind-accessing creatures asssign them. Understand?
Do theories have a life of their own :?: Probably not :!:
No, not as biological life. However, like a good jokes, it is said, that, yo only need to tell it once, then it will spread because it is a good one. Of course jokes require mind-accessing creatures.
So we come back to what is called the 'observer effect' in physics - proven to actually effect what is being observed.
You mean it is some uncertain phase/state of existence, that, we believe is associated with a sine-wave pattern, because when we collapse the wave pattern by observing them, an electron goes ding, since one photon is gained, and that electron is part of set of atoms that compose a pixel so we see the pixel become active and after many pings and many pixels lighting we see the they all average out to form a wave pattern.

So we just we say that the photon takes a journey on all possible wavy paths, to the next placed that is is observed. I would say those paths involve gravity and or dark energy geodesics at ultra-micro scales of existence.
Now back to the original question 'Why does Existence Exist?' .......
.

I believe Ive answered that previously. There is no purpose to Universe or its existence except the one that any mind-accessing creature assigns it to it. We are each at the center of our "I"-verse. Most times when I use italics i'm implying a metaphysical-1, mind/intellect/concept.
And let me ask a better question - 'Can existence exist independently ?' - and what would that mean :?:
Three kinds of existence. Occupied space existence cannot exist without non-occupied space existent and metaphysical-1, mind/intellect/concept existence. These three are distinctly differrent catgories as Ive laid out in this thread or many others,as 1a, 1b and 1c and exist at the top of my cosmic heirarchy.
And I know I brought this up before - What would an existent state look like without some type of conscious mind
defining it :?:
Ditto all my above. Plus add in my scenarios that involve geometry torus defining every particle of Universe, except fro perhaps graviton and whatever quanta we may assign to dark energy.
So now I postulate that existence only exists if it can be observed to exist :idea:
I state that consciousness is twoness, ergo and two particles that have and inter-realtionship via gravity--- at minimum --is consciousness. I dont believe mind-accessing creatures are required for our finite, occupied space Universe to exist.

There is no rational, logical common sense evidence to suggest otherwise, that I'm aware of. And yes i'm aware of that movie on DVD that came out from the consciousness community some years back, tho cant recall its name.
No observer - No existence :idea: :arrow: :!:
Ditto my above any two particles that have at minimum, a gravitational inter-relationship are conscious ergo the most simple consciousness.

Gravity is two way relationship. Russell from 20's and more recently Bil Gaedes makes a point of this with their ideas that as one stream of relationship { rope/fiber/tension } is going this way, there is another stream { rope fiber/tension } going the other ways between two particles.

I believe we can say that is the case within any particle, that is composed of set of inter-relationships that we can assign some name to. Ex vertexia, nodes, nodal events, rope, fiber, tension, events,

vertexions ( Y } i.e 3 relationship sharing common vertex, and can only exist within parameters of three other vertexions as tetrahedral set/phenomena that, can only exist as dynamic physical/energy, gravity or dark energy

nippions { . } i.e. exists as a concept of only, a single nodal event,

yippions{ V } i.e. two relationships sharing a common nodal event and again, only exists as concpts


Hope that helps to clarify where I coming from, what I believe etc....

r6

-- Updated September 5th, 2016, 5:00 pm to add the following --

I remember now I wanted to give you an idea of how I see gravities relationship between any two particles of Universe.

With gravity being spherical, or toroidal, I see gravity always being the outer surface.

A torus has outer and inner surface, whereas spherical only has outer and inside surface.

O = particle A

O = particle B

( ) = gravity

(O)()()()()()(O)

this above is a rough approximation of geodesics that surround and embrace the particles and exist in the space, irrespective of distance between any two particles.

r6
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by UniversalAlien »

Rr6 wrote:
Ditto my above any two particles that have at minimum, a gravitational inter-relationship are conscious ergo the most simple consciousness.
That might be - And that I might agree with......

But then we get into the once again popular with some, the ancient theory of Pan-Psychism:

Minds Everywhere: 'Panpsychism' Takes Hold in Science
Materialism to panpsychism:

Philosophers have put forward many notions of consciousness. The materialist notion holds that consciousness can be fully explained by the the firing of neurons in the human brain, while mind-body dualism argues that the soul or mind is distinct from, and can potentially outlive, the body. Under the notion of panpsychism, a kind of re-boot of ancient animistic ideas, every speck of matter has a kind of proto-consciousness. When aggregated in particular ways, all this proto-consciousness turns into a sense of inner awareness. And other, Eastern philosophies have held that consciousness is the only real thing in the universe, Kuhn said.

Neuroscientists and many philosophers have typically planted themselves firmly on the materialist side. But a growing number of scientists now believe that materialism cannot wholly explain the sense of "I am" that undergirds consciousness, Kuhn told the audience.........
See whole article here:
http://www.livescience.com/53791-what-i ... sness.html

'IF' consciousness is universal and pervades all that exists - the 'observer effect' would take on a whole new paradigm
of meaning - As the observer effect might, and would, be relative to the point of, and nature of, the observation.

Who or what, is observing who or what from where and when.

You would not need a Human observer as the universe would be able to observe itself.

Of course the theists will be saying we told you so - BUT there is a big difference between a universal consciousness
and a creator in the religious sense - which is not supported by observation.


"All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force... We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent Mind. This Mind is the matrix of all matter."
-Max Planck



"I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness. We cannot get behind consciousness. Everything that we talk about, everything that we regard as existing, postulates consciousness."
-Max Planck



" “We are a way for the cosmos to know itself.”
-Carl Sagan
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Re: Why does Existence Exist?

Post by Rr6 »

r6--Ditto my above any two particles that have at minimum, a gravitational inter-relationship are conscious ergo the most simple consciousness.
UA--That might be - And that I might agree with.....
.

The sum-total of varied and many special-case occurrences of consciousness exist as, our finite, occupied space Universe.

That is not the same as saying Universe is conscious of it self. However, there is some sort of cosmic accounting ergo occupied space cannot be created nor destroyed, only eternally transformed between fermions and bosons, if not also gravity and dark energy.

I have a belief that, if gravity gains a boson, then something else has to move over, if not actually pop out of gravitational existence elsewhere.

One of the things about geodesic domes and more specifically tensegrity structures, is that what happens on one side structure affect rest of structure much more than the typical/conventional home/building/dwelling.

Geodesic dome typically expand contract more than other conventional building, becuase they have higher degree structural integrity i.e. the whole is affected by change anyhwere on the dome.

With concrete, cinder block work generally a 1/4 to half-inch is negligable, Wood framing could be 1/8th inch off on every cut and house still ok.

With wood domes a 1/16th is really all that is allowed to get pieces to all fit together as they should.

And with steel geodesics i recall Fuller stating something like a 1/32th or something like that to get all of the pieces to connect properly with out fudging something somewhere.

So cosmic integrity accounting may not allow for any tolerance of some gravitonic or dark energy quanta to not be accounted for.

Whereas I sometimes speak of some machinery allow for some slop in the system so as not to get bound/stuck from being too tight, I dont know if that scenario translates to the whole of Universe.

r6
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