A question about Reality QM vs Classical world view

Discuss any topics related to metaphysics (the philosophical study of the principles of reality) or epistemology (the philosophical study of knowledge) in this forum.
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Wanderer101
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Re: A question about Reality QM vs Classical world view

Post by Wanderer101 »

@quotidian

I could refute many if not all of the statements you just made but it is this statement I would like you to elaborate more on.
So I think it would benefit you to turn your attention to other questions
Why do you think it would benefit me more to think about other questions?

I think that the status quo should be challenged not just for the sake of being difficult but for the sake of truth and advancement.

Now lets take a different tack on this whole thing. I can continue to poke holes in quantum mechanics and you can continue to espouse its virtues. I really started this discussion not to get my view out there but to hear reasons why people believe in QM and defend it with such intensity. I do know that someday if my model is proven by experiment I will have to go up against QM. It looks like I will be going it alone. That's a battle for another day.

Let us suppose for a minute that I have a way of breaking the light speed barrier and this is something that QM does not predict can happen. If I were then able to propose an experiment to prove my idea and that experiment then confirmed my theory, would you be willing to break away from the status quo. This is a theory that does not use or require quantum mechanics in anyway. It uses only an extension of a classical theory. Would you be willing to consider based on that evidence that perhaps QM is incomplete as Einstein believed? Lets take it a step further let us also suppose that using the same theory I could give the mechanical details that would explain both gravity and inertia and this could be done by using the same theory. Would you consider that maybe QM is not the right path?
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Quotidian
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Re: A question about Reality QM vs Classical world view

Post by Quotidian »

I'm sorry, Wanderer, but this is an exercise in futility. You're saying that I 'believe' in quantum mechanics - as if it is a matter for belief! Then you say you're 'poking holes in the status quo' by challening 'my belief'. I'm afraid you are very seriously confused about the whole subject. I have no beliefs at all in respect of quantum mechanics, what I am saying is simply what is reported in the popular press about it. And if you think you can exceed light speed, or prove that quantum mechanics is fundamentally flawed, then go right ahead. Please don't forget to invite me to your Nobel ceremony.

I have also repled to one of your posts in another thread.
'For there are many here among us who think that life is but a joke' ~ Dylan
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Wanderer101
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Re: A question about Reality QM vs Classical world view

Post by Wanderer101 »

Well I would agree that this is futile. As I can see that you are getting more and more annoyed. That is too bad.

So all you were doing was stating someone else's ideas and not your own beliefs or thoughts. Well that is kind of pointless to do as I and everyone else is already aware of those things that are reported in the news and magazines etc. Do you really think that I am not aware of those items you brought up. That is really naive on your part. Why not just be honest and give me your ideas and not just recite other peoples ideas without any conviction. What I am confused about is why you would bother to discuss something and seeming express a point of view and then say I have no beliefs at all on the subject.
what I am saying is simply what is reported in the popular press about it. I have no beliefs at all in respect of quantum mechanics I doubt the sincerity of that statement.


The whole point about forums such as this is to discuss ideas. We may not agree and that is okay. I really wanted to know what you and other people think about QM and classical physics. I did not need a news report.

Obviously my statements that I made when attacking QM, in some way you have taken personally. I am sorry as I did not mean them as an attack on you or what you were saying in defense of QM. I did put you on the spot on occasion and I think that is what really got you going and that is my fault. In further discussions I will try and do better and restrain myself from putting people on the spot.
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Quotidian
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Re: A question about Reality QM vs Classical world view

Post by Quotidian »

I'm not taking your statements personally at all, and you're not 'attacking my beliefs'.

There's a saying that 'everyone has a right to their own opinions, but not to there own facts'. With respect to what I know about quantum physics, which is not much, what I'm saying isn't a question of belief. The strange puzzles that quantum mechanics have thrown up are a matter of public record - these are facts. What you or I believe about such things is totally irrelevant. You're not going to solve the problems of quantum mechanics by wishing them away on an internet forum.

The tone of exasperation you're detecting in my posts, is because it seems to me that you think you know better than the experts, without presenting any evidence for that, other than your assertion that 'QM must be wrong'. That's really all your posts amount to.
'For there are many here among us who think that life is but a joke' ~ Dylan
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Wanderer101
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Re: A question about Reality QM vs Classical world view

Post by Wanderer101 »

Thanks this was very valuable opinion you give.
The tone of exasperation you're detecting in my posts, is because it seems to me that you think you know better than the experts, without presenting any evidence for that, other than your assertion that 'QM must be wrong'.
I must learn how not to sound that way and still get my point across.
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Quotidian
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Re: A question about Reality QM vs Classical world view

Post by Quotidian »

You're welcome, and thanks for being so open to criticism! Many are not.
'For there are many here among us who think that life is but a joke' ~ Dylan
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