Self defense for civilian vs police

Discuss morality and ethics in this message board.
Featured Article: Philosophical Analysis of Abortion, The Right to Life, and Murder
Post Reply
User avatar
Obi1
New Trial Member
Posts: 9
Joined: August 31st, 2016, 11:19 pm

Self defense for civilian vs police

Post by Obi1 »

With all you see on TV sometimes the grey areas are hard to come to a personal position on. One such area is the standard for self defense for a police officer vs for a civilian in an ambiguous situation.

For a civilian who's day to day activities likely do not include crossing paths with a great number of criminals I suppose the law stays on the side of caution. If someone has you cornered or is approaching you, you do not preemptively disable them.

For a police officer who encounters a large number of criminals and is also in uniform and there is an understanding this person's duty is to detain criminals, they are at a much higher risk for being assaulted by a criminal. If police used the same caution as civilians in ambiguous situations they would put them self at great risk on a daily basis and no one would want to be an officer.

This is how I rationalize the difference in what a police officer can do to stay safe and what a civilian can. Anyone have thoughts on this?
User avatar
ThamiorTheThinker
Posts: 281
Joined: October 21st, 2015, 9:07 pm
Favorite Philosopher: Yoda

Re: Self defense for civilian vs police

Post by ThamiorTheThinker »

I don't really see a controversial or otherwise conflicting set of views to be had on this matter. Are you sure there is even a problem here?
User avatar
LuckyR
Moderator
Posts: 7935
Joined: January 18th, 2015, 1:16 am

Re: Self defense for civilian vs police

Post by LuckyR »

Obi1 wrote:With all you see on TV sometimes the grey areas are hard to come to a personal position on. One such area is the standard for self defense for a police officer vs for a civilian in an ambiguous situation.

For a civilian who's day to day activities likely do not include crossing paths with a great number of criminals I suppose the law stays on the side of caution. If someone has you cornered or is approaching you, you do not preemptively disable them.

For a police officer who encounters a large number of criminals and is also in uniform and there is an understanding this person's duty is to detain criminals, they are at a much higher risk for being assaulted by a criminal. If police used the same caution as civilians in ambiguous situations they would put them self at great risk on a daily basis and no one would want to be an officer.

This is how I rationalize the difference in what a police officer can do to stay safe and what a civilian can. Anyone have thoughts on this?
Oh hell yes. You are correct that civilians and LEOs are different. They have different experience, capabilities, training and expectations. Having acknowledged that, they both share the goal of making it home safely at the end of the day, especially if they have acted reasonably. Recently, there has been more attention placed in this area. What do we know? Well the number of LEOs killed by gunfire is dropping slowly and is between 100-150 per year. The number of civilians shot and killed by LEOs is about 3 per day. Obviously there are way, way fewer police than citizens, so a straight numerical comparo is probably less important but the trends are disturbing and the individual stories are downright frightening.
"As usual... it depends."
User avatar
h_k_s
Posts: 1243
Joined: November 25th, 2018, 12:09 pm
Favorite Philosopher: Aristotle
Location: Rocky Mountains

Re: Self defense for civilian vs police

Post by h_k_s »

[quote=Obi1 post_id=276649 time=1476903136 user_id=46629]
With all you see on TV sometimes the grey areas are hard to come to a personal position on. One such area is the standard for self defense for a police officer vs for a civilian in an ambiguous situation.

For a civilian who's day to day activities likely do not include crossing paths with a great number of criminals I suppose the law stays on the side of caution. If someone has you cornered or is approaching you, you do not preemptively disable them.

For a police officer who encounters a large number of criminals and is also in uniform and there is an understanding this person's duty is to detain criminals, they are at a much higher risk for being assaulted by a criminal. If police used the same caution as civilians in ambiguous situations they would put them self at great risk on a daily basis and no one would want to be an officer.

This is how I rationalize the difference in what a police officer can do to stay safe and what a civilian can. Anyone have thoughts on this?
[/quote]

State law in the USA spells out what is legal behavior for civilians, security guards, and police.

All are required to show the same level of care -- applying only such proportionate reasonable force as is necessary in the situation.

The main difference is that police are further impowered to shoot fleeing suspects based on their own judgment for the protection of society. Civilians and security guards may not shoot anyone who is fleeing, unless they are fleeing with a kidnapped person.
User avatar
Thrylix
Posts: 70
Joined: January 11th, 2014, 2:42 am

Re: Self defense for civilian vs police

Post by Thrylix »

Civilians should be allowed a bit more latitude in defending themselves than police.
User avatar
Spiral Out
Posts: 5014
Joined: June 26th, 2012, 10:22 am

Re: Self defense for civilian vs police

Post by Spiral Out »

Every person is allowed by law to use lethal force if they believe their life to be in danger, but that will be different for each person, each situation and each set of specific circumstances. An elderly or disabled person may feel their life is in danger where a young or able-bodied person may not. Self-defense is just that, defense of the self. If one can show reasonable evidence or valid argument that they were justified in the belief that their life was in peril, then they may legally use lethal force in that capacity.
Dedicated to the fine art of thinking.
User avatar
LuckyR
Moderator
Posts: 7935
Joined: January 18th, 2015, 1:16 am

Re: Self defense for civilian vs police

Post by LuckyR »

Reality check : the vast majority of self defense doesn't involve lethal force
"As usual... it depends."
User avatar
Empiricist-Bruno
Moderator
Posts: 582
Joined: July 15th, 2014, 1:52 pm
Favorite Philosopher: Berkeley
Location: Toronto
Contact:

Re: Self defense for civilian vs police

Post by Empiricist-Bruno »

Sex workers are at great risk too. Maybe they should be given more latitude too, just like cops. Well, maybe not but my point is that having a risky job should not mean you can make others more at risk from you.
Watch out for the hidden paradoxes around you!
User avatar
LuckyR
Moderator
Posts: 7935
Joined: January 18th, 2015, 1:16 am

Re: Self defense for civilian vs police

Post by LuckyR »

Empiricist-Bruno wrote: January 13th, 2019, 12:33 pm Sex workers are at great risk too. Maybe they should be given more latitude too, just like cops. Well, maybe not but my point is that having a risky job should not mean you can make others more at risk from you.
Unfortunately for your idea, public policy is made by legislators whose motivation is to please voters and donors and sex workers tend to be neither.
"As usual... it depends."
Post Reply

Return to “Ethics and Morality”

2023/2024 Philosophy Books of the Month

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise
by John K Danenbarger
January 2023

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul
by Mitzi Perdue
February 2023

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness
by Chet Shupe
March 2023

The Unfakeable Code®

The Unfakeable Code®
by Tony Jeton Selimi
April 2023

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are
by Alan Watts
May 2023

Killing Abel

Killing Abel
by Michael Tieman
June 2023

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead
by E. Alan Fleischauer
July 2023

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough
by Mark Unger
August 2023

Predictably Irrational

Predictably Irrational
by Dan Ariely
September 2023

Artwords

Artwords
by Beatriz M. Robles
November 2023

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope
by Dr. Randy Ross
December 2023

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes
by Ali Master
February 2024

2022 Philosophy Books of the Month

Emotional Intelligence At Work

Emotional Intelligence At Work
by Richard M Contino & Penelope J Holt
January 2022

Free Will, Do You Have It?

Free Will, Do You Have It?
by Albertus Kral
February 2022

My Enemy in Vietnam

My Enemy in Vietnam
by Billy Springer
March 2022

2X2 on the Ark

2X2 on the Ark
by Mary J Giuffra, PhD
April 2022

The Maestro Monologue

The Maestro Monologue
by Rob White
May 2022

What Makes America Great

What Makes America Great
by Bob Dowell
June 2022

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!
by Jerry Durr
July 2022

Living in Color

Living in Color
by Mike Murphy
August 2022 (tentative)

The Not So Great American Novel

The Not So Great American Novel
by James E Doucette
September 2022

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches
by John N. (Jake) Ferris
October 2022

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All
by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
November 2022

The Smartest Person in the Room: The Root Cause and New Solution for Cybersecurity

The Smartest Person in the Room
by Christian Espinosa
December 2022

2021 Philosophy Books of the Month

The Biblical Clock: The Untold Secrets Linking the Universe and Humanity with God's Plan

The Biblical Clock
by Daniel Friedmann
March 2021

Wilderness Cry: A Scientific and Philosophical Approach to Understanding God and the Universe

Wilderness Cry
by Dr. Hilary L Hunt M.D.
April 2021

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute: Tools To Spark Your Dream And Ignite Your Follow-Through

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute
by Jeff Meyer
May 2021

Surviving the Business of Healthcare: Knowledge is Power

Surviving the Business of Healthcare
by Barbara Galutia Regis M.S. PA-C
June 2021

Winning the War on Cancer: The Epic Journey Towards a Natural Cure

Winning the War on Cancer
by Sylvie Beljanski
July 2021

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream
by Dr Frank L Douglas
August 2021

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts
by Mark L. Wdowiak
September 2021

The Preppers Medical Handbook

The Preppers Medical Handbook
by Dr. William W Forgey M.D.
October 2021

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress: A Practical Guide

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress
by Dr. Gustavo Kinrys, MD
November 2021

Dream For Peace: An Ambassador Memoir

Dream For Peace
by Dr. Ghoulem Berrah
December 2021