It is preferable to live one day with inner peace than a thousand years without.

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Jake4020
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Re: It is preferable to live one day with inner peace than a thousand years without.

Post by Jake4020 »

I would say anything is better than nothing but you know if you live long enough you will live regret everything you've ever done even the good things.
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ADNamin
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Re: It is preferable to live one day with inner peace than a thousand years without.

Post by ADNamin »

Hi,
I agree with all of these that, yes, it is indeed preferable to do as mentioned in the first part of each sentence listed.

I think we can move to the metaphysical and state that it is essential to experience refined states of consciousness in which joy, wellbeing, radiant health, love, intelligence and Reason exist.

If we look, for example at Plato, we can see that it is posited that we need to go beyond the world presented to us by the senses in order to do this.

Our senses are, of course, important ... but to experience the states you have mentioned we need to go beyond them. Most spiritual practice involves achieving this transcendence. However, there may be many ways of doing this. It is perhaps only important that we are able to experience 'truth' by any number of possible means. The joy is - that it is possible to do so - I'd really recommend meditation for anyone seeking this. I'd also recommend profound philosophy such as that found in Buddhism and Vedanta.

If we look at Kant's, Schopenhauer's or Hegel's work we can see that these selfsame these are approached - nature of reality and how we may experience it, particularly via Reason.

Philosophy's real purpose is to provide knowledge which leads to Reason, that is, knowledge beyond the information provided by the mechanations of the senses within the subjective self.
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Re: It is preferable to live one day with inner peace than a thousand years without.

Post by Belindi »

ADNamin wrote:
I'd really recommend meditation for anyone seeking this.
Meditation is a distinct brain-mind state. Constant meditation awareness would not keep you alive. Sometimes, maybe most of one's waking time, you have to try to make decisions to act in focused ways. To stay alive it is best to be at least a little worried about what is going to happen.
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Re: It is preferable to live one day with inner peace than a thousand years without.

Post by Scott »

Count Lucanor wrote: May 8th, 2021, 12:25 am The properties of some things simply cannot be measured in grades, such as being pregnant, being a male, being a mammal, being inanimate, being pregnant, etc.
I disagree.

Is Caitlyn Jenner a male? What about a person born with a Y Chromosome and a vagina, namely someone with androgen insensitivity syndrome?

If aliens put my body in a special machine that steadily morphed it second-by-second into a lizard over the course of 100 days, such that each second over those 100 days I become a bit more lizard-like and a bit less Scott-like, on what day would I suddenly instead move from the discreet state of being 100% a mammal to being 100% non-mammal? Wouldn't a nominalistic view require realizing that concept of Scott-ness, human-ness-, and mammalianess are all actually imaginary and thus on roughly day 50 of 100 I'd be roughly 50% the human Scott and 50% lizard?

Count Lucanor wrote: May 8th, 2021, 12:25 am I don't thing an egg, fertilized or not, is considered an inanimate object.
I would tend to agree, but for the same reason I would tend to think of a self-driving car as animate as well, at least partly. But again that's because I don't look at really things as being 100% absolutely totally animate or 100% absolutely totally inanimate.

I don't believe discreet states really exist. I'm surprised that as a nominalist you do.

Count Lucanor wrote: May 8th, 2021, 12:25 am No, you're confusing the level of development of the woman's pregnancy (a process in itself) with the property of the women being pregnant.
Perhaps I am misunderstanding what you are saying, or misunderstanding nominalism, or both, but the above statement appears to me to be incompatible with nominalism.

Scott wrote: I think a better analogy may be age of consent laws, such as how in one jurisdiction it could be the case that a day before someone's 18th birthday (when the person is 17 years, 364 days old, counting from time of birth) the person is considered 100% unable to consent, and then two days later is considered totally able to consent. The idea of discreet states is a symptom of conceptualization, not reality itself. As such, the exact conceptual borders between the black-states and the white-states tend to be arbitrary and controversial, since reality is actually a continuum of dancing grays.
Count Lucanor wrote: May 8th, 2021, 12:25 am Since human psychology and social life are so complex, since there's so much diversity, variations among individuals, precise definitions of people's characteristics and behaviors according to given parameters are impossible, so for practical purposes average estimations are used and conventions set, and then people judged against the convention (which is not unfair at all, given that conventions [laws] are public and people are aware they can be made accountable on that basis). So the age of consent is merely a rule, not a stated property of individuals.
I agree, and I think that's essentially how biological taxonomy works as well, and more roughly speaking how all taxonomy works.

The conceptual line drawn between the 17-year-364-day-old and the 18-year-old with one being 100% child and the other being 100% adult would be analogous the conceptual line drawn that would have one say that mammals suddenly popped into existence in one day and didn't exist the previous previous day at all even partly in some gray area between non-mammal and mammal, such that the parent(s) of a creature were 100% not mammals but their offspring was 100% mammal.

The same goes for the process of abiogenesis. I simply disagree with the idea there is no gray area between the black-and-white concepts of total 100% lifelessness and total 100% lifefulness. Even if Newtonian mechanics were true such that it makes sense to think of things happening at the same time across even small units of space, it just doesn't make sense to think that the universe from some discreet 100% lifeless state one second to having life the next second, with no gray area between the two black-and-white binary conceptual states.

I believe binary-ness is a symptom of conceptualization, not something that exists in actual concrete reality. Figuratively speaking, concrete reality is shades of gray on a continuous spectrum of infinite shades of gray, with no black and white. Our human minds conceive of it using binary conceptualization such that we create a label X and say every single thing must either strictly be X or strictly be -X, which among other fallacies assumes that there are things and thus real thinghood. But the X-ness--whatever it is--never really exists, at least not in a binary black-and-white way.

Scott wrote: April 21st, 2021, 4:57 pm Do you think it's possible that a man-made robot with AI could ever be more like a human than an ant is human-like?

[Emphasis added.]
Count Lucanor wrote: April 23rd, 2021, 10:42 pm No. I guess it would be possible to make a machine so complex and sophisticated as to simulate almost perfectly the behavior of humans, but it would not be real human-like behavior, which implies conscious will, agency and self-regulating processes; it would be just a good imitation of a lifeless machine.
Scott wrote: April 24th, 2021, 3:16 pm What if the AI-building robots accidentally made an atom-by-atom replica of an ant?
Count Lucanor wrote: May 2nd, 2021, 10:44 pm Then it would have made an actual ant, not a replica.
Scott wrote: May 3rd, 2021, 7:40 pm So then you agree that human-made AI machines can make living and animate creatures?
Count Lucanor wrote: May 8th, 2021, 12:25 am No, I cannot agree. I never said anything like that. I only said that in the hypothetical scenario that you proposed (which I don't think is possible), if a robot made something identical to an ant, it would be an ant by its own right. Robots are simply way too far from achieving such a thing and they are most likely completely unable to do so, as the current state of technology shows.
The question isn't if it's possible with current technology or anytime soon. But rather what if humans--or alternatively our machines, descendants, cyborgs, and/or AI technology--don't all go extinct--what about in a million years or a billion years?

Are you saying that not even in a million years could our machines out-do an ant?

What about the digitally evolved creatures made non-virtual as described in this Ted talk?

Could those ever out-do an ant?
My entire political philosophy summed up in one tweet.

"The mind is a wonderful servant but a terrible master."

I believe spiritual freedom (a.k.a. self-discipline) manifests as bravery, confidence, grace, honesty, love, and inner peace.
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Re: It is preferable to live one day with inner peace than a thousand years without.

Post by Count Lucanor »

Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm
Count Lucanor wrote: May 8th, 2021, 12:25 am The properties of some things simply cannot be measured in grades, such as being pregnant, being a male, being a mammal, being inanimate, being pregnant, etc.
I disagree.

Is Caitlyn Jenner a male?
What do you think this person is? Because that which you think this person is, will be that and not the opposite in a binary relation, nor something in between. Biological sex is dimorphic = binary.
Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm What about a person born with a Y Chromosome and a vagina, namely someone with androgen insensitivity syndrome?
They used to call them hermaphrodite, now intersex, but even when those conditions are seen, people are identified with being either male or female. In any case, even if it were true that sex categories are not discrete states, but continuous states in a spectrum, that would not change the distinction between discrete/continuous states.
Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm If aliens put my body in a special machine that steadily morphed it second-by-second into a lizard over the course of 100 days, such that each second over those 100 days I become a bit more lizard-like and a bit less Scott-like, on what day would I suddenly instead move from the discreet state of being 100% a mammal to being 100% non-mammal? Wouldn't a nominalistic view require realizing that concept of Scott-ness, human-ness-, and mammalianess are all actually imaginary and thus on roughly day 50 of 100 I'd be roughly 50% the human Scott and 50% lizard?
I guess in any sci-fi story one can imagine the impossible, such as morphing into another species. What would happen if the impossible became suddenly possible in that imaginary world, you ask. Well then it would be true that species is a continuum, not a discrete state, in that imaginary world...In this actual world, that is not the case.
Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm
Count Lucanor wrote: May 8th, 2021, 12:25 am I don't thing an egg, fertilized or not, is considered an inanimate object.
I would tend to agree, but for the same reason I would tend to think of a self-driving car as animate as well, at least partly. But again that's because I don't look at really things as being 100% absolutely totally animate or 100% absolutely totally inanimate.
Although you still would be wrong, you could think of a self-driving car as animate, but you could not think of it as partly animate. The first proposition is synthetic and simply has a problem of evidence based on the properties of living things, but the second one fails analytically: by being "partly" it's already denying the discrete property that is essential to being animate/inanimate. Of course, you can come up with your own personal definition of what being animate/inanimate is, and apply those properties to the problem, but that would run contrary to the standard scientific convention of what a living thing is.
Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm
I don't believe discreet states really exist. I'm surprised that as a nominalist you do.
I don't see any problem with nominalism and having discrete and continuous states. Just because one denies universals and abstract objects doesn't mean one can make concepts arbitrary.
Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm
Count Lucanor wrote: May 8th, 2021, 12:25 am No, you're confusing the level of development of the woman's pregnancy (a process in itself) with the property of the women being pregnant.
Perhaps I am misunderstanding what you are saying, or misunderstanding nominalism, or both, but the above statement appears to me to be incompatible with nominalism.
I don't see why. There are gradual stages of growth in pregnancy, but either one is pregnant or not.
Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm
Count Lucanor wrote: May 8th, 2021, 12:25 am Since human psychology and social life are so complex, since there's so much diversity, variations among individuals, precise definitions of people's characteristics and behaviors according to given parameters are impossible, so for practical purposes average estimations are used and conventions set, and then people judged against the convention (which is not unfair at all, given that conventions [laws] are public and people are aware they can be made accountable on that basis). So the age of consent is merely a rule, not a stated property of individuals.
I agree, and I think that's essentially how biological taxonomy works as well, and more roughly speaking how all taxonomy works.

The conceptual line drawn between the 17-year-364-day-old and the 18-year-old with one being 100% child and the other being 100% adult would be analogous the conceptual line drawn that would have one say that mammals suddenly popped into existence in one day and didn't exist the previous previous day at all even partly in some gray area between non-mammal and mammal, such that the parent(s) of a creature were 100% not mammals but their offspring was 100% mammal.
No, that's not how taxonomy works. Even if one can say that all such classifications are arbitrary conventions, once the criteria is set, and precise, distinctive properties used, the taxonomic definitions draw very clear lines. What makes a mammal is a pretty solid convention, while the age of consent is not and can easily change.
Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm
The same goes for the process of abiogenesis. I simply disagree with the idea there is no gray area between the black-and-white concepts of total 100% lifelessness and total 100% lifefulness.
Perhaps you may want to disagree with the scientific consensus, I choose not to.
Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm
Even if Newtonian mechanics were true such that it makes sense to think of things happening at the same time across even small units of space, it just doesn't make sense to think that the universe from some discreet 100% lifeless state one second to having life the next second, with no gray area between the two black-and-white binary conceptual states.
It doesn't matter. Once the criteria for what counts as living matter is set, then that's the border line that separates one state from the other.
Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm
I believe binary-ness is a symptom of conceptualization, not something that exists in actual concrete reality. Figuratively speaking, concrete reality is shades of gray on a continuous spectrum of infinite shades of gray, with no black and white. Our human minds conceive of it using binary conceptualization such that we create a label X and say every single thing must either strictly be X or strictly be -X, which among other fallacies assumes that there are things and thus real thinghood. But the X-ness--whatever it is--never really exists, at least not in a binary black-and-white way.
I disagree. There are plenty of binary states in the natural world, which even though are conceptualized by humans, rely on specific, objective properties. Sexual dimorphism, for example.
Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm
The question isn't if it's possible with current technology or anytime soon. But rather what if humans--or alternatively our machines, descendants, cyborgs, and/or AI technology--don't all go extinct--what about in a million years or a billion years?

Are you saying that not even in a million years could our machines out-do an ant?
Theoretically it may be possible in the future, but so what?
Scott wrote: May 12th, 2021, 2:57 pm
What about the digitally evolved creatures made non-virtual as described in this Ted talk?

Could those ever out-do an ant?
"Video unavailable".
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Nikita
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Re: It is preferable to live one day with inner peace than a thousand years without.

Post by Nikita »

A person strives for happiness as the highest good and since happiness is serenity then one day is worth infinity itself and even has the advantage of mortality relative to an immortal being having achieved tranquility it is divine
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