Regard of blood relatives

[WanderingGaze22]

You get the family you get, not the family you want. Numerous ways to say this sentence over the years and no one seems to be able to fully answer when do people related to you by blood stop becoming family. We know family is connected by many ways. What makes up the base, foundation that hold family all together so to speak? Being estranged is no unfamiliar concept to us, so when a family member does wrong, where do we stop forgiving them for their mistakes/ When do we start blaming ourselves for what they do? All family is complicated, but the biggest question of all would be how to start seeing them as a part of you and could you actually cut them out of your lives with no consequences?

If this is too personal, I would like to debate on how you can tell who is an independent yet agreeable and flexible person and who is going to be a bad influence.

[Steve3007]

All family is complicated, but the biggest question of all would be how to start seeing them as a part of you and could you actually cut them out of your lives with no consequences?

My own personal experience is that I've never been through the serious family rifts and estrangements from blood relatives that other people have, although I know a lot of people who have, and I've seen various degrees of estrangement. So, perhaps partly because of never having been through those things myself, I've naturally always thought of my immediate family (my parents, siblings and children) as part of me, and me a part of them. My wife and her daughter (my step-daughter) have grown to be a part of me (and me of them). The situation with my ex (mother of my children) is different, complex and continuously evolving. Obviously no, I couldn't cut any of the people I've mentioned out of my life with no consequences.

[Newme]

For most of my life I turned a blind eye to a lot of family dysfunction - no easy task with BPD & narcissistic parents. Actually, maybe it is easy - more comfortable to pretend everything is good - then no need to rock the boat & risk heartbreaking rejection. Then after so many times of them crossing the line, I finally opened my eyes to the bad & established boundaries. I keep in mind their good for which I’m grateful. But I realized that “honoring your parents” (& family) cannot be at the sacrifice of your or others’ well-being.

WanderingGaze,
If you have been holding in a bunch of repressed anger - or if that anger was turned inward to depress you - then you may want to vent and work through it at least some, before confronting them. For me, it’s been a process - still have issues not entirely resolved, but working on them. And sometimes I have screwed up on my part - too blunt, not communicating well, being inconsiderate, not asserting myself, etc. It helps to consider boundaries like a gate to let in good & keep out bad.

[Pattern-chaser]

My life experience has taught me that those closest, and most important, to me are those who do positive things for me; those people who bring value to my life. [ I hope to offer something in return, of course! ] This has led me, in my life, to value friends much more highly than family. I am estranged from most of my family. Others have different experiences of life, and I don't doubt this will affect their opinions on these matters.

[LuckyR]

You get the family you get, not the family you want. Numerous ways to say this sentence over the years and no one seems to be able to fully answer when do people related to you by blood stop becoming family. We know family is connected by many ways. What makes up the base, foundation that hold family all together so to speak? Being estranged is no unfamiliar concept to us, so when a family member does wrong, where do we stop forgiving them for their mistakes/ When do we start blaming ourselves for what they do? All family is complicated, but the biggest question of all would be how to start seeing them as a part of you and could you actually cut them out of your lives with no consequences?

If this is too personal, I would like to debate on how you can tell who is an independent yet agreeable and flexible person and who is going to be a bad influence.

Chronologically we are taught from a young age that family supports you more than not family and therefore should be supported more than not family.

Later we find that this guideline is not perfectly accurate and therefore the logic for following it will diminish. Various individuals in various individual situations will choose to address their situation in various ways. Some cut off close family (perhaps to their benefit) while others will continue to interact with dysfunctional family (often to their detriment).

We all have slightly different ways of addressing the inaccuracy of early childhood "rules to live by".

[stevie]

... What makes up the base, foundation that hold family all together so to speak?

Behavioural habits and habitual affects.

[WanderingGaze22]

All family is complicated, but the biggest question of all would be how to start seeing them as a part of you and could you actually cut them out of your lives with no consequences?

My own personal experience is that I've never been through the serious family rifts and estrangements from blood relatives that other people have, although I know a lot of people who have, and I've seen various degrees of estrangement. So, perhaps partly because of never having been through those things myself, I've naturally always thought of my immediate family (my parents, siblings and children) as part of me, and me a part of them. My wife and her daughter (my step-daughter) have grown to be a part of me (and me of them). The situation with my ex (mother of my children) is different, complex and continuously evolving. Obviously no, I couldn't cut any of the people I've mentioned out of my life with no consequences.

Do you believe "good separations" are possible? How do you live on good terms with a child who has never met you and yet has to trust you as a caretaker?

[WanderingGaze22]

my[/i] life, to value friends much more highly than family. I am estranged from most of my family. Others have different experiences of life, and I don't doubt this will affect their opinions on these matters.

Preaching to the choir here. Seems so meaningless when you have to choose between your friends or family, gambling to a near life or death degree at times. That is why you have to spend time with both, to learn how they feel about you possibly at your worst so to speak.

[WanderingGaze22]

... What makes up the base, foundation that hold family all together so to speak?

Behavioural habits and habitual affects.

Can you elaborate on these points please?

[stevie]

... What makes up the base, foundation that hold family all together so to speak?

Behavioural habits and habitual affects.

Can you elaborate on these points please?

Please be referred to behaviour theory and 'learning and conditioning'.

[Belindi]

Some members of my family are or were better company than others but I don't let go of feeling loyalty towards any of them. I suppose if I had been treated badly enough by any family or friend I'd not feel loyal any more, although I can't imagine that ever happening with my feelings towards my sons, and most of my immediate family are dead which stops any further relationship.

I aim to follow the examples of three people I have known well, two blood relations and one friend, who could accept others' faults and bad behaviours and still love them.

There are power relations among both family and friends which can make familial and companionate relationships impossible if the more powerful individual is a bully. In those cases if the bully lacks insight and can't change then the less powerful individual has to escape from the relationship for self preservation.

[Steve3007]

Do you believe "good separations" are possible?

Yes, they're undoubtedly possible, but I suspect they're rarely easy (very few serious events in life are). Sometimes, no doubt, but very rarely. Mine wasn't easy. But even during the worst of times, when we hated each other, we both managed to keep sight of what was important. Ultimately, it's undoubtedly been best for our children that we separated. We have a slightly more complex family arrangement now than the "standard" mother, father and their children living together arrangement. But it works for us. And I think it shows a reasonably good example to our children of how real life adult relationships work and change.

How do you live on good terms with a child who has never met you and yet has to trust you as a caretaker?

I don't know. I imagine that would be difficult. Since we separated, about 7 years ago now, me and my ex have shared custody of our children.

[Steve3007]

Some members of my family are or were better company than others but I don't let go of feeling loyalty towards any of them.

Yes, it's funny how often old clichés, like "blood is thicker than water" turn out to be true. When I was a kid, my immediate family (siblings and parents) were (I can see now with the benefit of hindsight and knowledge of other families) very close. We tended to take the p out of the various idiosyncrasies of other family members (uncles, aunts and grandparents) while also never forgetting that sense of loyalty. An aspect of that true cliché is the unwritten but widely accepted rule that we can mock our own family members, but woe betide anybody outside the family who does it.

[Belindi]

WanderingGaze wrote:

Do you believe "good separations" are possible? How do you live on good terms with a child who has never met you and yet has to trust you as a caretaker?

Some people relate to each other superficially and for superficial people it's easy to let the relationship go in reality and in memory. In proportion as the relationship matters more than superficially a relationship break up is damaging, painful, and never forgotten and in such cases it's impossible to have a painless separation. You get used to the pain and you think "Oh yes, I remember what I usually do about this permanent and incurable pain, I am not forced to recall the pain so I think about something else."


There are many adults who embark on a long search for a mother or father who abandoned them when they were babies.

A child who has never met you can become feelingly attached to you like and more so than how a child becomes attached to a loved character in a children's story or the pop world. This sort of attachment really happens, and the absent parent or even parent figure can be a beacon of happiness for the child after he becomes an adult. I hardly knew my elder brother as a companion and when he was absent which was nearly all of the time that we were both living in the world he wrote letters and sent me thoughtful presents even after I grew up and left home. It is far better for the child that he has and knows a parent who loves him at a distance than that he relates to some distant popular celebrity or worse.

My elder brother's letters were about what I liked doing and the games I and my chums played, and what he was doing as he thought it would interest me such as some clever dog he met in a bar, and how he rode a bike with no brakes down the Rock of Gibraltar.

[Sculptor1]

You get the family you get, not the family you want. Numerous ways to say this sentence over the years and no one seems to be able to fully answer when do people related to you by blood stop becoming family. We know family is connected by many ways. What makes up the base, foundation that hold family all together so to speak? Being estranged is no unfamiliar concept to us, so when a family member does wrong, where do we stop forgiving them for their mistakes/ When do we start blaming ourselves for what they do? All family is complicated, but the biggest question of all would be how to start seeing them as a part of you and could you actually cut them out of your lives with no consequences?

If this is too personal, I would like to debate on how you can tell who is an independent yet agreeable and flexible person and who is going to be a bad influence.

It's all a bit vauge. My general view is that I feel no obligation to parallel relationships. Siblings have had the same chances as me to get their **** together. That is not to say that I would not help them, as I would any friend.
Any relative I have will have spawned qualifies for my support and forgiveness 100%. That would be my children and any children they have.
On the other end of the scale. Parents and other relatives that have contributed to my growth get any help they need. I no longer have parents, or grand parents, but my concern and care for them extended to the degree to which they supported me. My Dad was a bit of a **** up and I was always waiting to see if he would make nay contributions to his responsibility, so I would have helped him out of a ditch, but wold not have felt obligated to pay his electricity bill.

Any distant cousins that might turn up on the door would get adequate treatment deserved of any stranger or guest, but no special case for help beyind the normal trust you can rely on of any person who you can know well enough to trust. That could be a lot of help - and more than other strangers for the simple practical reason of knowing who they are.

|I do not regard shared genes are of any special significance. Its all about the relationships.