Divine Command Theory

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Jaiyson
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Divine Command Theory

Post by Jaiyson »

Hey guys, whether you are religious or not I was wondering what your thoughts on the DCT were. I believe in God but I can see where Plato's Euthyphro Dilemma makes sense. Another view against the DCT could be the lack of proof that God even exists.

Thoughts?
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Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
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Post by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes »

I believe words and phrases like immoral, moral, morally right, morally good, morally bad, morally wrong, should, ought and so forth are very equivocal. For instance, when one person says, "X is immoral," or "X is morally good," they do not usually mean the same thing as when a different person says, "X is immoral," or "X is morally good." This is analogous to if one person says, "this feather is light," and second person says about the same feather, "this is not light." Do they disagree about the qualities of the feather? Maybe, but likely not. One person may mean that the feather is not dark in terms of color and the other means that it is not heavy in terms of weight. Lightness may only have two common definitions, but moral terms are even more equivocal, having perhaps countless common definitions. I named 5 of the most common, general definitions of moral terms in my post What Moral Terms Can Mean. A 'divine command theory' definition would fall into the last category I name.

The Euthyphro dilemma: "Is an action morally good because God commands it, or does God command it because it is morally good?" Is an equivocal question. If one believes a singular god exists and believes that god would only command morally good things, then it seems like a moot question since one would get the same practical results regardless. Besides, since moral terms are so equivocal, it may just be that any given person using a phrase such as 'morally good' as synonymous with 'commanded by god' which makes the question nonsensically self-referencing.

But let's say for the sake of argument we have a hypothetical person, Josh, who believes there is a singular god, believes that god commands a number specific things (e.g. "don't rape," "don't murder"), and believes the same things that are commanded by this god are morally good (or bad if he's commanding you not to do it) to the degree that the god commands it. I don't think it's interesting to merely ask Josh the moot question, "Is an action morally good because God commands it, or does God command it because it is morally good?" But what if rephrase the question: Do you personally conclude an action is morally good because you believe god has commanded it or do you personally conclude god commands an action because you believe the action is morally good? In other words, we aren't asking which is the actual cause of the other as we are in the way the Euthyphro dilemma is usually phrased; instead we are asking which one he uses to learn the other. For instance, I may conclude that it has rained outside because it is wet even though I never saw the rain or I may conclude that it is wet on the ground outside because I saw (or heard) the rain but never actually saw the rain hit the ground or saw the ground wet. It's different to ask me which actually caused the other than simply to ask me--since I'm considering each to be a necessary condition of the other--which one I believe first and then use to conclude the other. In this way, the question isn't about the nature of god and morality exactly but about the nature of the way the believer in divine command theory comes up with his beliefs about what is moral vs. his beliefs about what god wants.

Incidentally, I don't believe in any gods. But if hypothetically there was an omnipotent, omniscient, philanthropic creator in line with the basis of popular monotheism, then I do not think she would be as foolish as us to use equivocal terms to describe her most beloved or despised actions. If she could even get herself to use our relatively pathetic language at all, I'm sure she would use more clear, specific, elegant, authoritative words and phrases. Would this god really just ambiguously condemn the actions of, for instance, Nazi Germany with equivocal words? I think she would unequivocally denounce such things.
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Post by Jaiyson »

Scott, do you believe in an afterlife at all?
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Post by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes »

If we debate the general question of the existence of god(s) or not in this thread, that will overshadow and derail your specific questions regarding the DCT. Since I do not believe any gods exist, I cannot answer your questions about the DCT from the perspective of a genuinely religious person. I imagine that exactly which god one believes in and what qualities they believe that god has would effect whether they use the DCT as their definition of morality.

What use is the afterlife question in regards to the DCT unless it is meant to be a talking point in a debate about whether or not a god or gods exist? The short answer is, no, I do not believe in a supernatural afterlife. In that regard, I suggest you check out my topic, Individuality and the Body in a Supposed [Supernatural] Afterlife.

In regards to morality and the afterlife, I think this goes to show how equivocal moral terms can be. If one defines morality using the DCT, then when they say, "doing X is morally good," that would also entail, since it is what god wants, that you would be later rewarded by god for doing X through divine intervention in this life or in some so-called afterlife. But in the way other people use the term morality, if one is only willing to do X (where X may be some kind act like donating to charity or saving the life of a child at minor inconvenience) if one will receive some great reward (such as a million dollars or the equivalent of a million dollars as luxury in some heaven) than one would be an immoral selfish pig using a different definition of moral terms. And neither person's claim (that doing X for some promised reward by god is moral or immoral) is necessarily correct or incorrect in the same way that neither person need be incorrect or correct when they say, "This feather is light;" they may just mean something different by the word light and the words 'morally good' and 'immoral.'
My entire political philosophy summed up in one tweet.

"The mind is a wonderful servant but a terrible master."

I believe spiritual freedom (a.k.a. self-discipline) manifests as bravery, confidence, grace, honesty, love, and inner peace.
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rdaro0311
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Re: Divine Command Theory

Post by rdaro0311 »

I agree with Scott in that morality can be a very equivocal term, especially because it means different things when used in certain theories and relativisms.
In terms of my response, I don't believe in Divine Command Theory due to the incarnation, God's true will, and free will.

As a practicing Catholic, I believe in the incarnation. However, the incarnation would be unnecessary for a Divine Command Theorist because it is all focused on God's will. If Divine Command theory is true, the incarnation was unnecessary. I believe that the incarnation is necessary, so therefore, I believe that Divine Command Theory is false.

Also, I don't always know what God's will is, either. Divine command theory states that morality equals God's will. However, we don't always know what God's will is. There is no objective moral standard of God. Also, with how ambiguous the term "morality" is, we may not know what it means in this context. Therefore, since it's very difficult to know God's will, Divine Command Theory is false.

Finally, we as humans have free will, as defined by the 1st amendment. However, God's will may not always equal free will, and this here proves that Divine Command Theory is false. It's just not something I believe in due to my morals and views.
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LuckyR
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Re: Divine Command Theory

Post by LuckyR »

rdaro0311 wrote: October 1st, 2021, 12:44 pm I agree with Scott in that morality can be a very equivocal term, especially because it means different things when used in certain theories and relativisms.
In terms of my response, I don't believe in Divine Command Theory due to the incarnation, God's true will, and free will.

As a practicing Catholic, I believe in the incarnation. However, the incarnation would be unnecessary for a Divine Command Theorist because it is all focused on God's will. If Divine Command theory is true, the incarnation was unnecessary. I believe that the incarnation is necessary, so therefore, I believe that Divine Command Theory is false.

Also, I don't always know what God's will is, either. Divine command theory states that morality equals God's will. However, we don't always know what God's will is. There is no objective moral standard of God. Also, with how ambiguous the term "morality" is, we may not know what it means in this context. Therefore, since it's very difficult to know God's will, Divine Command Theory is false.

Finally, we as humans have free will, as defined by the 1st amendment. However, God's will may not always equal free will, and this here proves that Divine Command Theory is false. It's just not something I believe in due to my morals and views.
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novaAftermath
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Re: Divine Command Theory

Post by novaAftermath »

I think Euthyphro's dilemma highlights the fact that a religion-inspired morality would necessarily be based on "divine subjectivity" (DCT) or "moral objectivity" (natural law of goodness outside of God). Appeals to God for objective morality fail on this precept.
heracleitos
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Re: Divine Command Theory

Post by heracleitos »

You are free to do as you please unless you are trying to do something that is in violation of religious law.

Abrahamic faith revolves around God's Law ("The Law and the Prophets") and not around God's "command". What you can find in the Torah, the Bible, and the Quran, is not his "command" but his Law.

In fact, God has only ever commanded a handful of people, who had been appointed by him to lead his congregation of believers out of one, pernicious problem straight into another one. Seriously, in my impression, he could as well have left them in Egypt.

So, no, you do not need to potentially exacerbate climate change by opening the Red Sea, unless you are one of the few exceptional people explicitly commanded by God to do exactly that.
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Blive
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Re: Divine Command Theory

Post by Blive »

I have enjoyed reading all your points on DCT.
DCT states that morality comes from god’s command or gods will. In order for that to be, we would have to agree on the existence of a higher being, which cannot be proven. However, let’s say that there is a god. Why then would we do often go against what is written down as moral? (His law) If his law/ command is moral, which we all often break, then it could be argued that we are all immoral. Since it is improbable we are all immoral, then DCT is false.
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