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How does one lose one's innocence?

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Kingkool
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How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Kingkool » May 24th, 2012, 11:36 pm

How does a child becomeman adult? Is there an exact moment? Does knowledge of terrible things make you lose it, or does perfoming those things? Is doing a terrible thing, but not knowing it was terrible make you no longer innocent?

If you haven't already, I strongly recomend reading Lord of the Flies.
Ralph wept for the end of innocence, the darkness of man's heart, and the fall through the air of the true, wise friend called Piggy.
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Schaps
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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Schaps » May 25th, 2012, 1:21 pm

To a degree the concept of one losing innocence describes as "watershed" like phenomenon of immediate irrevocable change. I hope that I never completely lose my innocence to be categorized finally as an "adult". "Adults" bore me and most are dull-witted, complacent insensitive shells of their childhood.

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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by wanabe » May 25th, 2012, 1:28 pm

When a child does something only an adult is supposed to do they loose a little bit of their innocence. This is one of the ways they become adults. This is of course a general answer. There is no exact moment in most cases where one looses their innocence and becomes and adult. Knowing of terrible things does not change a thing, it must be an action. The thing about terrible actions is that no matter your age you know you have done something wrong.

Childhood and adulthood do not have the fine line that many attribute those groups. Neither just being a child or adult immature or mature is the answer to promote 'good'.
Secret To Eternal Life: Live Life To The Fullest, Help All Others To Do So.Meaning of Life Is Choice. Increase choice through direct perception. Golden rule+universality principal+Promote benefits-harm+logical consistency=morality.BeTheChange.

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Quizzical18
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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Quizzical18 » May 25th, 2012, 4:37 pm

Losing one's innocence begins at the point that the person realizes the difference between right and wrong and then intentionally doing wrong knowing that.

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Kingkool
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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Kingkool » May 27th, 2012, 9:50 am

In the show, Supernatural, one of the charecters, Bobby, had an abusive father who beat him, and his mother. When bobby was tweleve, he picked up his fathers gun, while his father was holding the wife by the hair, pointed it at his father, and shot him. His mother then said, Bobby, now you can't get into heaven. So when did he lose his innocence? When he first contemplated shooting his father? Taking the gun? Pointing it at him? Or actually pullong the trigger?
“In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.”- Douglas Adams A Hitchhiker's Guide To the Galaxy

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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by A Poster He or I » May 27th, 2012, 1:21 pm

Some of the posts so far seem to suggest the loss of innocence implies the fact of guilt. But to me what is required is either the sense of guilt or the avoidance of this sense through rationalization. Innocence, therefore, is a psychological state. A child is innocent so far as he or she can take appearances at face value, have no duplicity in thought and no rationalization of his actions to avoid the sense of guilt.

Irrevocable action is one way to lose one's innocence, of course. But the loss entails the acknowledgement of the action in terms of its consequences; consequences which must be apprehended at least subconsciously. If there is no sense of guilt about one has done, the perpetrator remains innocent in his own mind.

The loss of innocence that comes with adulthood seems due to the growing sense of the consequences of one's own and others' actions, as one experiences how actions are interconnected with every aspect of life and the world, and one senses their own responsibility toward those consequences. Therefore the loss of innocence is a natural consequence of increasing wisdom. Carrying innocence into adulthood implies to me the breeding of naïveté.

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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Misty » May 27th, 2012, 2:00 pm

Kingkool wrote:In the show, Supernatural, one of the charecters, Bobby, had an abusive father who beat him, and his mother. When bobby was tweleve, he picked up his fathers gun, while his father was holding the wife by the hair, pointed it at his father, and shot him. His mother then said, Bobby, now you can't get into heaven. So when did he lose his innocence? When he first contemplated shooting his father? Taking the gun? Pointing it at him? Or actually pullong the trigger?
I think one begins to lose ones innocence at birth. All that is learned begins a child in the direction of innocence lost in order to make decisions. In the above scenario Bobby was losing his innocence observing the parents fighting, and being beat by his father, thus already learning a sense of right and wrong, knew his father to be behaving wrong, then took action to alleviate his hurting mother and self. I think Bobby's mother's statement to him was awful. If one is asking about a child's innocence lost in the sexual realm, it should be a gradual coming of age when a child is old enough to accept the consequences and responsibility sex, and being an adult entails. (this also includes other adult expectations of society)
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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Fanman » May 27th, 2012, 2:58 pm

I think that one losses one's innocence, when one commits immoral acts. I believe that an adult can be innocent if they do not commit immoral acts. Ultimately, I think that this question depends on what one perceives as immoral, and as innocence?
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Misty
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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Misty » May 29th, 2012, 8:12 am

Fanman wrote:I think that one losses one's innocence, when one commits immoral acts. I believe that an adult can be innocent if they do not commit immoral acts. Ultimately, I think that this question depends on what one perceives as immoral, and as innocence?

If a child is raped they lose their innocence (lack of knowledge) of sex and yet the child did not commit an immoral act. Living in a world of good and evil subjects all humans to the acts of evil. Innocence of anything is simply lack of knowledge of, or lack of involvement in, invited or uninvited.
Things are not always as they appear; it's a matter of perception.

The eyes can only see what the mind has, is, or will be prepared to comprehend.

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Douglaspocock
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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Douglaspocock » May 30th, 2012, 6:00 pm

Quizzical18 wrote:Losing one's innocence begins at the point that the person realizes the difference between right and wrong and then intentionally doing wrong knowing that.
Wouldn't innocence just be the lack of realization between right and wrong? To lose innocence by choosing one aspect rather than another of a previously unacknowledged idea seems to be illogical. :)

Couldn't just the knowledge of right and wrong be the loss of innocence? :)

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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Wittgenstoned » June 1st, 2012, 1:56 pm

Schaps wrote:To a degree the concept of one losing innocence describes as "watershed" like phenomenon of immediate irrevocable change. I hope that I never completely lose my innocence to be categorized finally as an "adult". "Adults" bore me and most are dull-witted, complacent insensitive shells of their childhood.
I am a guilty adult. I have leather sex with my own gender. I love gloryholes. And I am not dull-witted or boring. Also, most of my friends are greasy, guilty bastards too. It goes with being an adult. Children are lame.

To OP. You become an adult when you are physically outgrown and robust. Legally, most countries stipulate an age. I would say most are fully adult around 24 from a biological point of view. The moral point of view most likely models adulthood on, say, matureness. Then it is a predicate of praise.

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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Steve3007 » June 1st, 2012, 2:25 pm

I am a guilty adult. I have leather sex with my own gender. I love gloryholes
I don't often use the acronym LOL. But LOL.

Interesting that you think that makes you guilty! Obviously most people would think there's nothing immoral about consenting acts between adults, whatever those acts are, and even if they involve leather. (Although cows might possibly disagree.) But is the perception that you are doing something immoral an important part of the act? Is being immoral (even though it's not really immoral) a defining property of adulthood?

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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Gareth » June 18th, 2012, 9:40 pm

Quizzical18 wrote:Losing one's innocence begins at the point that the person realizes the difference between right and wrong and then intentionally doing wrong knowing that.
Close, but I think innocence is lost when having understood the difference between right and wrong one realises that doing wrong can benefit oneself.
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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Misty » June 19th, 2012, 6:37 am

Fanman wrote:I think that one losses one's innocence, when one commits immoral acts. I believe that an adult can be innocent if they do not commit immoral acts. Ultimately, I think that this question depends on what one perceives as immoral, and as innocence?

Yes, the word innocence needs to be qualified. One can 'know' about murder but that knowing does not make that person guilty of murder. So what is innocence?
Things are not always as they appear; it's a matter of perception.

The eyes can only see what the mind has, is, or will be prepared to comprehend.

I am Lion, hear me ROAR! Meow.

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Re: How does one lose one's innocence?

Post by Bermudj » June 20th, 2012, 12:35 pm

Well I remember watching the Kung Fu series and in one episode, Grasshopper tells the master he has felt something, an awakening.

Master Khan replies, just like a caterpillar turns into a butterfly, you have lost your innocence.

Grasshopper must have been about 14 at the time.
Do whatever you do, do what a good man would do, and what is a good man?, I do not know, but at every point, every turn, do what a good man would do.

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