We cannot know whether or not we have struck objective gold, or if we are biased towards we winning survivors. A metaphysical theory says more about its supporters than its tenets. My definitions of panentheism and theism show how Newme's theory is a theism, so I submit my explanation as a useful way to frame the status of final cause.Felix wrote: ↑November 5th, 2019, 12:03 pmI would question whether you can call a system "unintentional" that is constructed to operate in a particular way - I'm thinking of the anthropic principle of cosmology.Belindi: The god may be either panentheistic or theistic. If panentheistic the god is unwitting and unintentioned: if theistic the god is witting and intentioned.
Let's Say You Convince Us That God Exists....
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Re: Let's Say You Convince Us That God Exists....
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Re: Let's Say You Convince Us That God Exists....
Better still, let's consider that humans are very far from the optimal, or even final, product of evolution. That is, our nature only suggests the possible directions that life, or post-life, evolves to be.Felix wrote: ↑November 5th, 2019, 12:03 pmI would question whether you can call a system "unintentional" that is constructed to operate in a particular way - I'm thinking of the anthropic principle of cosmology.Belindi: The god may be either panentheistic or theistic. If panentheistic the god is unwitting and unintentioned: if theistic the god is witting and intentioned.
If life like (or unlike) ourself evolves in a number of places in the universe then, logically, the universe is be becoming more aware than it was before. It has pockets of concentrated awareness. As do cities and, arguably, bodies. That would make God more of a potential of the universe than a current reality, or we could say that the universe or God is currently undeveloped.
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No bias: "anthropic" can just mean intelligent life, not necessarily human, as Greta suggested.Belindi: We cannot know whether or not we have struck objective gold, or if we are biased towards we winning survivors.
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Yes and it so happens humans are the ones that are conscious of being conscious, as far as we know.I don't think the universe is conscious of being conscious.
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Re: Let's Say You Convince Us That God Exists....
There is good evidence that other forms of intelligent life on earth are too, e.g., dolphins, octopi, and perhaps chimpanzee and elephants. It's difficult to verify.Belindi: Yes and it so happens humans are the ones that are conscious of being conscious, as far as we know.I don't think the universe is conscious of being conscious.
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Re: Let's Say You Convince Us That God Exists....
The day the sun shines pink -
The logical conundrum to defeat God and prove its existence against its will. He/she/it/wE (there's no reason to think a God would be trapped by your anthropomorphics (probably a cellphone someone dropped in a bottomless gravity well anyway that had to make a time bubble so it could reach it's control tower. (No one said cellphones were logical...(they're honestly just a tool to kill you from electronic magnetic radiation poisoning)))).
If there is gift of free will not to have to believe there's a god then you must have full control of your own subjective world, the world as you choose to perceive it. If that's true and there is free will, then you should be able to turn the sky pink as you see it.
Lay on your back and look up at the blue sky on a sunny day. Imagine in your mind that it looks slightly like the nearest shade of pink, a slightly hot purple-ish pink. Enforce your belief that you do in fact see the sky as pink, after all, it's unethical to enforce others to chose your subjectivity when it's against your beliefs.
You should already begin to see the sky as pink at this time. It's honestly not hard. Anyone can do it. I've done it many times. You can't keep it pink in your mind for very long as I tend to choose to believe there's a reality my senses are dependent on. But I don't always believe myself. I doubt pretty much everything.
Anyway, one time I'm pretty sure the sun really did shine pink. Maybe for a full 10 seconds. And honestly it really might have. The sun might be a little closer to death than previously predicted. At least, that's what you'll figure if you get it to turn pink. Kinda scary so it has to be done delicately or it's terrorising everyone for no reason except that theists predict that sort of thing...
Depending on your results, you just proved.... Umm... something I guess. At the very least you can test the level you have in your capacity to believe there isn't a God
Hf gl, promise not to panic and cry. Share your results. Not spell checking it.
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