EricPH wrote: ↑May 17th, 2022, 11:20 pm
God created good and evil, and we have been given the knowledge of good and evil. it's up to each one of us how we use that knowledge.
A company might produce a top quality range of kitchen knives. Do you hold them responsible if one is used as a murder weapon?
Aside from the initial baseless and unjustified assertions - based on on Iron Age superstition - if a company is omnipresent, omnipotent and omniscient then, yes, it is 100% responsible for any misuse of its products.
You can always talk about God's mysterious ways, but it's a cop out.
EricPH wrote: ↑May 17th, 2022, 11:20 pmIf God truly desires evil, we would have laws like don't bother working, kill your neighbour and take what you want.
No, all social animals have rules, just that ours are written down.
If God does not approve of evil, then why is it necessary for all but autotrophs to kill in order to survive? I note that autotrophs also regularly kill each other in competition and they also kill herbivores with various defences.
If God exists, as posited, then it sees evil and good as the same, a la the Hindu models. BTW, have you noticed how much more sensible and less reliant on superstition the religions of east and central Asia are than those of west Asia?
EricPH wrote: ↑May 17th, 2022, 11:20 pmBut we have commands from God to love our neighbours, to help the poor and oppressed. If we could all obey God's laws, there would be no evil. Why do we blame God for all the evil that happens, when we know it is our desire to go against God.
Let's check this unsubstantiated claim.
"No gods before me". Prosperity gospel evangelists worship Mammon, believing that wealth is a sign of righteousness and poverty the
mark of sin.
Graven images? Again, religions are replete with worship of Mammon (even Trump!). How about going to our souvenir shop to buy plastic White Jesus on the cross?
Taking the God's name in vain. Tell me how obeying this would save the world.
Remember the Sabbath. Do you think obeying this would save the world? Anyway, it's right wing theistic politicians who fought the unions and forced ever more people to work without taking adequate leave.
Honour father and mother. What if parents that sell their children into prostitution and slavery? What of the violent, the drunkards, the mentally abusive? Do they deserve honour? Honour must be earned. Most parents are worthy of gratitude, but there's a minority who are not. To make a blanket rule is a recipe for accepting abuse.
Killing? We must kill to eat, and don't give me that anthropocentric excuse about only human lives mattering. Many animals we kill to eat are intelligent and sensitive, vastly more sentient that sleeping foetuses (noting that foetuses only become conscious at birth). Further, we must kill other humans to protect ourselves at times, unless you posit that Ukrainians resisting Putin's invasion are evil sinners and they should just lay down and let Russia take over.
Committing adultery? That didn't work out for theists, did it? Like these eighteen homophobic leaders caught having same sex relations out of wedlock?
https://www.advocate.com/politicians/20 ... -gay-or-bi
Not to mention the millions of theists routinely committing adultery on the sly. It's hardly something that is ruining the world, though, unlike nature-destroying theistic anthropocentrism. I could speak of religious institutions facilitating child abuse and covering up the abuse to protect the perps.
Stealing? Churches continue to claim their tax exempt status - for all of their operations - when the exemption was designed to cover charitable activities. Churches have thus been stealing from people for decades, at least. How about Paula White and others telling believers that they will buy themselves a place in heaven by sending money?
As for bearing false witness, no one bears false witness like theists criticising atheists. The lies and misrepresentations come in a constant flow. Or how about the amazing lies of US's most beloved theist, Donald Trump? Remember the Mexican "murderers and rapists"?
Coveting? Christianity covets power like no one else.
So, why would theists expect secularists to take their commandments seriously when so many of their own number treat those rules with contempt?
Surely we can do better than following Iron Age Middle Eastern mythology. The religions of the far east are already more sophisticated, although still infused with much woo.