The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

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Greta
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Re: The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

Post by Greta » July 16th, 2020, 12:15 am

gad-fly wrote:
July 15th, 2020, 6:17 pm
Greta wrote:
July 14th, 2020, 12:33 am

I see Singapore, HK and Tokyo as the future, not one I want personally, but seemingly where things are headed in urban areas around the world. As the old saying goes, "All roads lead to Rome"; in this case, all events lead to remote digital interactions replacing face-to-face ones. COVID is one more nail in the coffin of the physically interactive world that older people remember.
By following your argument on the trend to replace face-to-face contact, would there not be more population dispersal from the metropolis to suburb and rural areas? Do you mean this to be a new normal?
That depends on infrastructure and distribution networks. No sense for the elderly, for instance, to move to a place where you have to wait a month to see the town's only doctor.

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Re: The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

Post by gad-fly » July 16th, 2020, 12:57 am

Alias wrote:
July 15th, 2020, 10:34 pm

What makes you think the next emergency will be prevented by the same expedients that help to decrease the effects of this one?
Physical distance will not be the least bit effective against rising sea levels. Physical distancing will not avail against nuclear fallout, or global crop failure or any of the other things coming down the pipeline we should never have built.
Once bitten, twice shy. That applies more or less to all creatures, don't you think? We may be kicked into the New Normal, a more prepared position.
I agree with you that distancing is not cure-all.

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Re: The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

Post by h_k_s » July 20th, 2020, 3:54 pm

We are simply in the early stages of Covid, the Chinese bat virus from Wuhan.

Eventually everyone will get this virus, and many people will die, similar to the 1918 pandemic.

Once all that happens, then there will be less angst (Yiddish word from the German, meaning anxiety) over it.

I then see only facemasks remaining in world culture both eastern and western like it already is in Japan. But otherwise this will mostly be forgotten soon, after however long it takes to get all the way around, maybe a couple of years, just like 1918-1919.

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Re: The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

Post by Alias » July 22nd, 2020, 10:44 pm

gad-fly wrote:
July 16th, 2020, 12:57 am
Once bitten, twice shy.
I don't see the relevance. We have never, afaik, had the same threat twice in a row, except for wars, and we do those with eyes wide open, willingly, enthusiastically.
That applies more or less to all creatures, don't you think?
It applies to all the creatures that do learn from their past mistakes. Humans are exempt.
We may be kicked into the New Normal, a more prepared position.
No. There is no normal, and we will never be prepared for what's about to happen. Perfectly doable protocols were set out after the SARS epidemic, but they were abandoned as soon as somebody started weighing cost vs risk. The cost consideration always wins in the short term and the risk always bites us in the ass.
h_k_s wrote:
July 20th, 2020, 3:54 pm
Eventually everyone will get this virus, and many people will die, similar to the 1918 pandemic.
Once all that happens, then there will be less angst (Yiddish word from the German, meaning anxiety) over it.
Probably. So, if Gaia has anything to say about it, the next one will wipe us out.
I then see only facemasks remaining in world culture both eastern and western like it already is in Japan.
That's for the air pollution. In 'normal' times, about three times as many people die of [normal] industrial air pollution as will die of covid-19 this year. And masks do nothing against pollutants in the water, soil and food supply.
But otherwise this will mostly be forgotten soon, after however long it takes to get all the way around, maybe a couple of years, just like 1918-1919.
Sure. The next catastrophe will displace it.

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Re: The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

Post by gad-fly » July 23rd, 2020, 12:18 am

Alias wrote:
July 22nd, 2020, 10:44 pm
gad-fly wrote:
July 16th, 2020, 12:57 am
Once bitten, twice shy.
I don't see the relevance.
That applies more or less to all creatures, don't you think?
It applies to all the creatures that do learn from their past mistakes. Humans are exempt.
We may be kicked into the New Normal, a more prepared position.
No. There is no normal


Learning from experience has been generally recognized as a common trait in human behavior. Admittedly such learning capability can vary widely, from one person to another person, from one group to another group, and from one occasion to another occasion. I can see your gloomy view in this respect which cannot be dismissed as unjustified. I believe you are tolerant of more open view.

There is no normal? It depends on what you can understand as Normal. Until recently, homosexual was a sickness. Now it is called gay, a normal, even though the community will remain the minority. If Social Distancing does become the new normal, more likely we would be kicked rather than be persuaded into it. Against our will, we may be shouting all the way: No new Normal.

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Re: The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

Post by h_k_s » July 23rd, 2020, 5:10 pm

Alias wrote:
July 22nd, 2020, 10:44 pm
gad-fly wrote:
July 16th, 2020, 12:57 am
Once bitten, twice shy.
I don't see the relevance. We have never, afaik, had the same threat twice in a row, except for wars, and we do those with eyes wide open, willingly, enthusiastically.
That applies more or less to all creatures, don't you think?
It applies to all the creatures that do learn from their past mistakes. Humans are exempt.
We may be kicked into the New Normal, a more prepared position.
No. There is no normal, and we will never be prepared for what's about to happen. Perfectly doable protocols were set out after the SARS epidemic, but they were abandoned as soon as somebody started weighing cost vs risk. The cost consideration always wins in the short term and the risk always bites us in the ass.
h_k_s wrote:
July 20th, 2020, 3:54 pm
Eventually everyone will get this virus, and many people will die, similar to the 1918 pandemic.
Once all that happens, then there will be less angst (Yiddish word from the German, meaning anxiety) over it.
Probably. So, if Gaia has anything to say about it, the next one will wipe us out.
I then see only facemasks remaining in world culture both eastern and western like it already is in Japan.
That's for the air pollution. In 'normal' times, about three times as many people die of [normal] industrial air pollution as will die of covid-19 this year. And masks do nothing against pollutants in the water, soil and food supply.
But otherwise this will mostly be forgotten soon, after however long it takes to get all the way around, maybe a couple of years, just like 1918-1919.
Sure. The next catastrophe will displace it.
The Earth (Gaia) was overdue for a population adjusting pandemic, yes. Now it's here. Many will die. Nothing can be done about it. The vaccines won't work. The corona virus like all corona viruses is already morphing into new strains.

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Re: The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

Post by Angel Trismegistus » August 1st, 2020, 2:31 am

Nothing is ever the same, really. Heraclitus had this right a long time ago. There's always a new normal in development.

Social distancing is not a bad idea for humankind. It may herald a new golden age of moderation.

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Re: The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

Post by gad-fly » August 1st, 2020, 4:42 pm

Angel Trismegistus wrote:
August 1st, 2020, 2:31 am
Nothing is ever the same, really. Heraclitus had this right a long time ago. There's always a new normal in development.

Social distancing is not a bad idea for humankind. It may herald a new golden age of moderation.
A new normal can only be so qualified if the impact on the specified normality has undergone game change. A normal is what people can expect as usual, common, and standard. For example, if you fly economy, you can expect to seat spaced as in Second Class, and pay Second Class.

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Re: The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

Post by Sculptor1 » August 1st, 2020, 5:42 pm

h_k_s wrote:
July 23rd, 2020, 5:10 pm
Alias wrote:
July 22nd, 2020, 10:44 pm

I don't see the relevance. We have never, afaik, had the same threat twice in a row, except for wars, and we do those with eyes wide open, willingly, enthusiastically.

It applies to all the creatures that do learn from their past mistakes. Humans are exempt.

No. There is no normal, and we will never be prepared for what's about to happen. Perfectly doable protocols were set out after the SARS epidemic, but they were abandoned as soon as somebody started weighing cost vs risk. The cost consideration always wins in the short term and the risk always bites us in the ass.


Probably. So, if Gaia has anything to say about it, the next one will wipe us out.


That's for the air pollution. In 'normal' times, about three times as many people die of [normal] industrial air pollution as will die of covid-19 this year. And masks do nothing against pollutants in the water, soil and food supply.


Sure. The next catastrophe will displace it.
The Earth (Gaia) was overdue for a population adjusting pandemic, yes. Now it's here. Many will die. Nothing can be done about it. The vaccines won't work. The corona virus like all corona viruses is already morphing into new strains.
The COVID infection will have no effect on the human population. Early indications suggest quite the opposite of that expected.
The population increase since January is already.
47,630,000.
Shutting people together in houses with not much to do is more likely to lead to more pregnancies.

And as for the Covid strain itself. You are wrong about that too. Much can, and has been done about it; several vaccines are now in production.

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Re: The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

Post by Sculptor1 » August 1st, 2020, 5:49 pm

h_k_s wrote:
July 20th, 2020, 3:54 pm
We are simply in the early stages of Covid, the Chinese bat virus from Wuhan.
So many misconceptions in such a small mind.
The source of the virus is unknown. There is an equal chance that humans gave it to bats.

Eventually everyone will get this virus, and many people will die, similar to the 1918 pandemic.
Not everyone will get it since the virus relies on transmission of previously uninfected individuals. That means the transmission requires a certian density uninfected. Social distancing speeds up virtual herd immunity.

Once all that happens, then there will be less angst (Yiddish word from the German, meaning anxiety) over it.
Angst is not Yiddish. It is a perfectly ordinary German word, tracing its roots through most Germanic languages from OHG.


I then see only facemasks remaining in world culture both eastern and western like it already is in Japan. But otherwise this will mostly be forgotten soon, after however long it takes to get all the way around, maybe a couple of years, just like 1918-1919.

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Re: The Impact of Social-Distancing as a New Normal

Post by Angel Trismegistus » Yesterday, 4:39 pm

gad-fly wrote:
August 1st, 2020, 4:42 pm
Angel Trismegistus wrote:
August 1st, 2020, 2:31 am
Nothing is ever the same, really. Heraclitus had this right a long time ago. There's always a new normal in development.

Social distancing is not a bad idea for humankind. It may herald a new golden age of moderation.
A new normal can only be so qualified if the impact on the specified normality has undergone game change. A normal is what people can expect as usual, common, and standard. For example, if you fly economy, you can expect to seat spaced as in Second Class, and pay Second Class.
Yes, that is what we mean by "normal" in this context.

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