Morally legitimate wealth

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Good_Egg
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Joined: January 27th, 2022, 5:12 am

Morally legitimate wealth

Post by Good_Egg »

This seems like a candidate for one of the Big Political Questions.

Some people think the concept "morally legitimate" is meaningless. That perspective is being discussed elsewhere - no point in repeating it here. One can only hope that those who adopt this view are consistent enough to abstain from political views that incorporate the proposition that some or all wealth is morally problematic.

Some people think that the concept of "morally legitimate" is meaningful, but relates to a domain that is separate from economics. "All's fair in love and commerce" might describe this position.

Some people think all wealth is morally illegitimate. Which leads to a discussion on what they consider to be wealth...

I would count myself in those who take the common-sense view that some wealth is morally legitimate and some is not. Which leads to the question of how we distinguish the two.

What's your take on the above ?

Starter for 10:
In a society based largely on subsistence agriculture, one family has a single son who inherits the land, while their neighbours have two sons who divide the family farm between them. Anything morally wrong with that ?
"Opinions are fiercest.. ..when the evidence to support or refute them is weakest" - Druin Burch
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LuckyR
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Re: Morally legitimate wealth

Post by LuckyR »

Good_Egg wrote: September 10th, 2022, 6:27 am This seems like a candidate for one of the Big Political Questions.

Some people think the concept "morally legitimate" is meaningless. That perspective is being discussed elsewhere - no point in repeating it here. One can only hope that those who adopt this view are consistent enough to abstain from political views that incorporate the proposition that some or all wealth is morally problematic.

Some people think that the concept of "morally legitimate" is meaningful, but relates to a domain that is separate from economics. "All's fair in love and commerce" might describe this position.

Some people think all wealth is morally illegitimate. Which leads to a discussion on what they consider to be wealth...

I would count myself in those who take the common-sense view that some wealth is morally legitimate and some is not. Which leads to the question of how we distinguish the two.

What's your take on the above ?

Starter for 10:
In a society based largely on subsistence agriculture, one family has a single son who inherits the land, while their neighbours have two sons who divide the family farm between them. Anything morally wrong with that ?
I see no ethical problem with the passage of the farmland.

I agree with you that personally I find wealth derived from practices I find immoral, to also be immoral.
"As usual... it depends."
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Sculptor1
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Re: Morally legitimate wealth

Post by Sculptor1 »

Good_Egg wrote: September 10th, 2022, 6:27 am This seems like a candidate for one of the Big Political Questions.

Some people think the concept "morally legitimate" is meaningless. That perspective is being discussed elsewhere - no point in repeating it here. One can only hope that those who adopt this view are consistent enough to abstain from political views that incorporate the proposition that some or all wealth is morally problematic.

Some people think that the concept of "morally legitimate" is meaningful, but relates to a domain that is separate from economics. "All's fair in love and commerce" might describe this position.

Some people think all wealth is morally illegitimate. Which leads to a discussion on what they consider to be wealth...

I would count myself in those who take the common-sense view that some wealth is morally legitimate and some is not. Which leads to the question of how we distinguish the two.

What's your take on the above ?

Starter for 10:
In a society based largely on subsistence agriculture, one family has a single son who inherits the land, while their neighbours have two sons who divide the family farm between them. Anything morally wrong with that ?
Yeah. Land ownership is immoral.
Good_Egg
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Joined: January 27th, 2022, 5:12 am

Re: Morally legitimate wealth

Post by Good_Egg »

Is that on the basi that you think all ownership immoral, or is it something peculiar to land ?
"Opinions are fiercest.. ..when the evidence to support or refute them is weakest" - Druin Burch
heracleitos
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Joined: April 11th, 2022, 9:41 pm

Re: Morally legitimate wealth

Post by heracleitos »

Good_Egg wrote: September 10th, 2022, 6:27 am This seems like a candidate for one of the Big Political Questions.

Some people think the concept "morally legitimate" is meaningless.
We would first have to agree on what the term "morality " means.

When Martin Luther used his epistemic stance on morality, "If you can show me through scripture and reason that I would be wrong, I will retract what I have written.", Luther took the position that morality is an axiomatic system of first-principle rules from which moral conclusions syntactically entail as theorems.

The Holy Apostolic Church resolutely rejected Luther's view, because according to the transcript of the court case, the Catholic position is that the Bible is "an arsenal of deceptive arguments".

I personally subscribe to Luther's view. Morality is an axiomatic system, i.e. a rule-based theory, that is essentially similar to arithmetic theory or set theory. That is how I use it. In all practical terms, the only contemporary moral system that operates on the basis of syntactic entailment, is Islamic jurisprudence.
Good_Egg wrote: September 10th, 2022, 6:27 am What's your take on the above ?

Starter for 10:
In a society based largely on subsistence agriculture, one family has a single son who inherits the land, while their neighbours have two sons who divide the family farm between them. Anything morally wrong with that ?
I will use the admiral ship of morality, i.e. Islamic jurisprudence, to address the question.

According to the Quranic scripture, the children of the defunct inherit his estate. Children of other families do not inherit and should not inherit, because such is the will of God (SWT). Furthermore, Allah (SWT) knows best, and in his axiomatization we fully trust.

You can find excellent calculation examples for the immutable rules governing the Islamic system of inheritance in Algorithmi's book, "Liber Algebrae".
Good_Egg
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Re: Morally legitimate wealth

Post by Good_Egg »

LuckyR wrote: September 11th, 2022, 2:33 am I agree with you that personally I find wealth derived from practices I find immoral, to also be immoral.
Does this mean that it's OK to get rich selling a better mousetrap ? But not to get rich selling guns, recreational drugs, or sexual services ?
"Opinions are fiercest.. ..when the evidence to support or refute them is weakest" - Druin Burch
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LuckyR
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Re: Morally legitimate wealth

Post by LuckyR »

Good_Egg wrote: March 4th, 2023, 4:29 am
LuckyR wrote: September 11th, 2022, 2:33 am I agree with you that personally I find wealth derived from practices I find immoral, to also be immoral.
Does this mean that it's OK to get rich selling a better mousetrap ? But not to get rich selling guns, recreational drugs, or sexual services ?
Depends on what you mean by "OK". If you mean: legal, then that's a question for a lawyer. If you mean: immoral (which is what I was discussing), then that would depend on whether you thought that owning a gun, taking recreational drugs and paying for sex is immoral. Since I don't think they are, I think making money from those activities is "OK". Having said that, there are certain gun selling, drug selling and sex selling entrepreneurs who also engage in certain acts that I do find immoral as part of their business model. I am not "OK" with their business practices on those grounds.
"As usual... it depends."
Good_Egg
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Joined: January 27th, 2022, 5:12 am

Re: Morally legitimate wealth

Post by Good_Egg »

LuckyR wrote: March 4th, 2023, 10:46 pm
Good_Egg wrote: March 4th, 2023, 4:29 am
LuckyR wrote: September 11th, 2022, 2:33 am I agree with you that personally I find wealth derived from practices I find immoral, to also be immoral.
Does this mean that it's OK to get rich selling a better mousetrap ? But not to get rich selling guns, recreational drugs, or sexual services ?
Depends on what you mean by "OK". If you mean: legal, then that's a question for a lawyer. If you mean: immoral (which is what I was discussing), then that would depend on whether you thought that owning a gun, taking recreational drugs and paying for sex is immoral.
Yes I'm talking about whether wealth can be morally OK.

Those were just examples of actions that some would consider immoral.
Since I don't think they are, I think making money from those activities is "OK".
Perfectly logical.
Having said that, there are certain gun selling, drug selling and sex selling entrepreneurs who also engage in certain acts that I do find immoral as part of their business model.
Such as ?

Just wanting to be clear on where you (and others) draw the line.
"Opinions are fiercest.. ..when the evidence to support or refute them is weakest" - Druin Burch
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LuckyR
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Re: Morally legitimate wealth

Post by LuckyR »

Good_Egg wrote: March 7th, 2023, 4:35 am
LuckyR wrote: March 4th, 2023, 10:46 pm
Good_Egg wrote: March 4th, 2023, 4:29 am
LuckyR wrote: September 11th, 2022, 2:33 am I agree with you that personally I find wealth derived from practices I find immoral, to also be immoral.
Does this mean that it's OK to get rich selling a better mousetrap ? But not to get rich selling guns, recreational drugs, or sexual services ?
Depends on what you mean by "OK". If you mean: legal, then that's a question for a lawyer. If you mean: immoral (which is what I was discussing), then that would depend on whether you thought that owning a gun, taking recreational drugs and paying for sex is immoral.
Yes I'm talking about whether wealth can be morally OK.

Those were just examples of actions that some would consider immoral.
Since I don't think they are, I think making money from those activities is "OK".
Perfectly logical.
Having said that, there are certain gun selling, drug selling and sex selling entrepreneurs who also engage in certain acts that I do find immoral as part of their business model.
Such as ?

Just wanting to be clear on where you (and others) draw the line.
Selling unregistered guns to felons, selling fentanyl laced lethal drugs, killing rival drug dealers, abusing sex workers under your employment, hiring underage sex workers and robbing Johns are all actions that violate my moral standard.
"As usual... it depends."
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