Gun Control and Mass Murder

Sculptor1 · Post by **Sculptor1** » September 6th, 2019, 5:32 pm

Only a mere 10,000 people have died from gunshots in the USA this year so far.
A price WELL WORTH paying for the right to have a warm gun by your side.

Post by **Sy Borg** » September 6th, 2019, 5:59 pm

Only 10,000? Things are looking up. The figure is usually closer to 30k per annum.

Look at how the US galvanised over 3,000 deaths in 9/11.

Look how they fail to galvanise over the half million or so killed by guns in the US.

My only misgiving is that, in the absence of humane and responsible euthanasia laws, guns will continue to be essential for some, and a certain portion of gun deaths would have been gentle euthanasia around a loving family in an ideal world.

Post by **LuckyR** » September 7th, 2019, 2:12 am

No doubt. If I could snap my fingers and get all the AR 15 type weapons in the US to disappear along with cheap handguns preferred by criminals, I would do it in a second. If I could get rid of every nonpermitted gun the same way, I would. But alas I can't, and to be honest I don't foresee a way to get there from here

Felix · Post by **Felix** » September 7th, 2019, 5:58 pm

LuckyR: If I could snap my fingers and get all the AR 15 type weapons in the US to disappear along with cheap handguns preferred by criminals...

Coincidentally, the San Francisco CA Board of Supervisors just snapped their proverbial fingers and declared the NRA a Domestic Terrorist Organization. See: https://nyti.ms/2m2rD0b

Problem solved!

Post by **LuckyR** » September 8th, 2019, 2:29 am

Felix wrote: ↑September 7th, 2019, 5:58 pm
LuckyR: If I could snap my fingers and get all the AR 15 type weapons in the US to disappear along with cheap handguns preferred by criminals...
Coincidentally, the San Francisco CA Board of Supervisors just snapped their proverbial fingers and declared the NRA a Domestic Terrorist Organization. See: https://nyti.ms/2m2rD0b

Problem solved!

Uummm... the NRA didn't exist within the city limits of San Francisco before anyway.

detail · Post by **detail** » September 8th, 2019, 12:18 pm

Perhaps there should be wlan control of arms sold for non-military persons, that the police can at all times shut down the usage of a weapon via a coded wlan Signal, which then prevents the usage of the aquired arms.

ernestm · Post by **ernestm** » October 1st, 2019, 6:06 am

You know, Ive been writing on this topic for a decade now, and it seems to me, almost everything I read on it is a moral opinion falsely stated as a fact, with some data thrown in some way that makes it seem less a judgment and more of a justification.

Post by **Sy Borg** » October 1st, 2019, 4:33 pm

What ernest describes above is the public conversation today in general. Lying and misrepresentating are now apparently okay, just good strategy.

Post by **LuckyR** » October 1st, 2019, 8:37 pm

Greta wrote: ↑October 1st, 2019, 4:33 pm What ernest describes above is the public conversation today in general. Lying and misrepresentating are now apparently okay, just good strategy.

This is probably one of the few discussion topics where the style of discourse hasn't changed much over the decades. But in general I agree that using opinion as fact has grown recently.

Post by **Pattern-chaser** » January 5th, 2020, 11:15 am

LuckyR wrote: ↑October 1st, 2019, 8:37 pm In general I agree that using opinion as fact has grown recently.

Yes, it started here, in this topic, right back in the OP:

UniversalAlien wrote: ↑December 14th, 2012, 7:21 pm Australia after a similar incident some years ago outlawed all guns. And then the crime rate went up so high they had to rescind the law.

I can find no evidence at all that the laws were anything but successful. I can't find the evidence for those laws being rescinded. Anyone got links?

Post by **LuckyR** » January 5th, 2020, 9:10 pm

Pattern-chaser wrote: ↑January 5th, 2020, 11:15 am
LuckyR wrote: ↑October 1st, 2019, 8:37 pm In general I agree that using opinion as fact has grown recently.
Yes, it started here, in this topic, right back in the OP:

UniversalAlien wrote: ↑December 14th, 2012, 7:21 pm Australia after a similar incident some years ago outlawed all guns. And then the crime rate went up so high they had to rescind the law.
I can find no evidence at all that the laws were anything but successful. I can't find the evidence for those laws being rescinded. Anyone got links?

Aside from the reality that the OP quote you cite is odd sounding on its' face, if you have done a cursory attempt to verify the claim and failed, likely puts you miles ahead of a poster without a citation.

Post by **Pattern-chaser** » January 7th, 2020, 8:35 am

LuckyR wrote: ↑January 5th, 2020, 9:10 pm Aside from the reality that the OP quote you cite is odd sounding on its' face, if you have done a cursory attempt to verify the claim and failed, likely puts you miles ahead of a poster without a citation.

I don't quite understand what you're saying here. I have searched quite hard, and found nothing at all to confirm that Australian gun laws have been repealed. They remain in force, and their effect remains successful. If anyone knows different, I would be grateful to see links, otherwise I shall ignore the claim as an opinion (or wishful thinking) presented as fact.

Post by **LuckyR** » January 8th, 2020, 3:26 am

Pattern-chaser wrote: ↑January 7th, 2020, 8:35 am
LuckyR wrote: ↑January 5th, 2020, 9:10 pm Aside from the reality that the OP quote you cite is odd sounding on its' face, if you have done a cursory attempt to verify the claim and failed, likely puts you miles ahead of a poster without a citation.
I don't quite understand what you're saying here. I have searched quite hard, and found nothing at all to confirm that Australian gun laws have been repealed. They remain in force, and their effect remains successful. If anyone knows different, I would be grateful to see links, otherwise I shall ignore the claim as an opinion (or wishful thinking) presented as fact.

Exactly (and a bit more clearly stated)

Post by **Sy Borg** » January 9th, 2020, 5:43 am

Australia's gun laws have only been slightly relaxed since the amnesty in the 90s after the Port Arthur massacre.

Universal Alien's information is completely wrong. However, I do not believe he is a bad actor. Rather, it is such an outrageous, bald-faced lie that I can only imagine that he was lied to by Fox and/or the NRA. https://www.factcheck.org/2017/10/gun-c ... a-updated/

It is disgraceful the way Fox twists good people's minds with their lying and misrepresentation.

GE Morton · Post by **GE Morton** » January 9th, 2020, 11:02 am

Greta wrote: ↑January 9th, 2020, 5:43 am Australia's gun laws have only been slightly relaxed since the amnesty in the 90s after the Port Arthur massacre.

Universal Alien's information is completely wrong. However, I do not believe he is a bad actor. Rather, it is such an outrageous, bald-faced lie that I can only imagine that he was lied to by Fox and/or the NRA. https://www.factcheck.org/2017/10/gun-c ... a-updated/

It is disgraceful the way Fox twists good people's minds with their lying and misrepresentation.

UA's claim was clearly false. But so is the claim that Australia's 1996 gun laws substantially reduced gun homicides. They have declined since then, but so have they in other English-speaking countries. Indeed, the decline in the US since the mid-90s has been steeper than Australia's, which has liberalized its guns laws over that period.

https://fee.org/articles/the-myth-that- ... homicides/