Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Discuss the November 2022 Philosophy Book of the Month, In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes.

To post in this forum, you must buy and read the book. After buying the book, please upload a screenshot of your receipt or proof or purchase via OnlineBookClub. Once the moderators approve your purchase at OnlineBookClub, you will then also automatically be given access to post in this forum.
Forum rules
This forum is for discussing the book In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All. Anyone can view the forum and read the post, but only people who purchased the book can post in the forum.

If your purchase has not already been verified (i.e. if you don't already have access to post in this forum), then please upload a screenshot of your receipt or proof or purchase via OnlineBookClub. Once the moderators approve your purchase at OnlineBookClub, you will then also automatically be given access to post in this forum.
User avatar
Sushan
Book of the Month Discussion Leader
Posts: 2258
Joined: February 19th, 2021, 8:12 pm
Contact:

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Sushan »

Sheilaread wrote: January 31st, 2023, 4:20 am This is a very interesting concept of this rhythm. I’ve never thought of it this way before.

We do know that it’s often very true that we can’t begin to heal our brokenness until we reach a very low point. Usually there’s no one that can begin that healing process but us. We must reach up and out for help first. Then we find resources to help get the pieces put together and get us back on track.

This whole idea shows us that even if we seem to be failing at something, we must find ways to seek help. Not just stay in our sad and broken place.
You've raised a valid point about the potential for personal growth and healing that can come from facing adversity. It's true that many times we need to experience a low point in order to recognize that we need help and make a change in our lives. This process can lead to a deeper understanding of ourselves and our needs.

Using the Humpty Dumpty nursery rhyme as a metaphor for this journey of self-discovery and healing is an intriguing interpretation. While the original rhyme might not have been intended as a philosophical piece, it can still serve as a catalyst for meaningful discussions on the challenges we face and how we can rise above them.

The key takeaway is that we should not shy away from seeking help and support when needed, as it can ultimately lead to personal growth and a better understanding of our true selves.
“There is only one thing a philosopher can be relied upon to do, and that is to contradict other philosophers”

– William James
Yasmine M
Premium Member
Posts: 13
Joined: March 16th, 2023, 12:30 pm

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Yasmine M »

Sushan Ekanayake wrote: February 12th, 2023, 3:41 am Maybe the Humpty Dumpty had said so. But most importantly, others see who we are when we are broke. Not only when we are broke, but we get back up the others judge us and label us.
I think the point raised in the book is that, what people think of us does not define us. They can see us when we are broken, broke and on the ground but that's what their eyes see. Their opinions don't define us because, we know that we are very much here despite our broken exterior parts. The 'I am" inside me might hurt for loosing that shell but it is pretty much the same "I am" who can build another shell.
Yasmine M
Premium Member
Posts: 13
Joined: March 16th, 2023, 12:30 pm

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Yasmine M »

Taking Humpty Dumpty as reference I disagree that we see our true selves only when we are broken; It is rather: 'even if we are broken, our true selves remain'. Our consciousness, our identity deep inside remains.
User avatar
Catalina Isabel
Premium Member
Posts: 32
Joined: April 12th, 2023, 2:21 pm

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Catalina Isabel »

Shondranika Ford wrote: February 1st, 2023, 8:50 pm I love this section in the book because we are pretty much shells, masks, and any covering you can think of. Once we get rid of the outer self, we can broadcast our inner self - the REAL you.
Yes, I totally agree with this. I think once we have seen our real selves, we can never be back together again. That is, back to how we were before. It's like all the lessons learnt, especially the difficult ones shape who we are now. We can never unlearn those.
User avatar
Sushan
Book of the Month Discussion Leader
Posts: 2258
Joined: February 19th, 2021, 8:12 pm
Contact:

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Sushan »

Yasmine M wrote: April 13th, 2023, 5:24 am
Sushan Ekanayake wrote: February 12th, 2023, 3:41 am Maybe the Humpty Dumpty had said so. But most importantly, others see who we are when we are broke. Not only when we are broke, but we get back up the others judge us and label us.
I think the point raised in the book is that, what people think of us does not define us. They can see us when we are broken, broke and on the ground but that's what their eyes see. Their opinions don't define us because, we know that we are very much here despite our broken exterior parts. The 'I am" inside me might hurt for loosing that shell but it is pretty much the same "I am" who can build another shell.
You've touched on a profound idea here. The concept of the "true self" being separate from external circumstances, judgments, and opinions is indeed a powerful one. It highlights the importance of self-awareness and self-discovery, which can be facilitated by going through challenging experiences that strip away the layers of our identity built around material possessions and social constructs.

When we are faced with adversity, we have the opportunity to discover our inner strength, resilience, and the core essence of who we are. This understanding can help us rebuild and create a life that is more authentic and aligned with our true selves. As you said, the "I am" within us remains intact, even when the external shell is broken. Recognizing and embracing this inner essence can lead to personal growth, empowerment, and ultimately a deeper sense of fulfillment in life.
“There is only one thing a philosopher can be relied upon to do, and that is to contradict other philosophers”

– William James
User avatar
Sushan
Book of the Month Discussion Leader
Posts: 2258
Joined: February 19th, 2021, 8:12 pm
Contact:

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Sushan »

Yasmine M wrote: April 13th, 2023, 5:54 am Taking Humpty Dumpty as reference I disagree that we see our true selves only when we are broken; It is rather: 'even if we are broken, our true selves remain'. Our consciousness, our identity deep inside remains.
That's an interesting perspective, and I can see how you might interpret the Humpty Dumpty metaphor in that way. It's true that our true selves remain intact, even when we face hardships and challenges. However, the process of breaking and rebuilding can also serve as a catalyst for personal growth and self-discovery.

By experiencing adversity, we are often forced to confront aspects of ourselves that we might not have been aware of previously. This can lead to a deeper understanding of our values, strengths, and resilience, ultimately shaping our true selves in a more profound way.

So, while our true selves remain even when we are broken, the experience of being broken can reveal new dimensions of our identity and enrich our understanding of ourselves. It's a reminder that we are more than just our circumstances, and that the essence of who we are transcends the challenges we face in life.
“There is only one thing a philosopher can be relied upon to do, and that is to contradict other philosophers”

– William James
User avatar
Sushan
Book of the Month Discussion Leader
Posts: 2258
Joined: February 19th, 2021, 8:12 pm
Contact:

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Sushan »

Catalina Isabel wrote: April 14th, 2023, 4:35 am
Shondranika Ford wrote: February 1st, 2023, 8:50 pm I love this section in the book because we are pretty much shells, masks, and any covering you can think of. Once we get rid of the outer self, we can broadcast our inner self - the REAL you.
Yes, I totally agree with this. I think once we have seen our real selves, we can never be back together again. That is, back to how we were before. It's like all the lessons learnt, especially the difficult ones shape who we are now. We can never unlearn those.
I couldn't agree more. Experiencing the process of discovering our true selves, especially through difficult lessons, can be transformative. It often leads us to a deeper understanding of ourselves and our place in the world. Once we've gained that insight, it's nearly impossible to return to the way we were before.

This self-discovery journey can be both liberating and empowering. It allows us to embrace our authenticity, recognize our strengths, and accept our vulnerabilities. As we continue to grow and evolve, we become better equipped to face life's challenges and adapt to new situations. In a way, every experience, whether positive or negative, contributes to the ongoing evolution of our true selves.
“There is only one thing a philosopher can be relied upon to do, and that is to contradict other philosophers”

– William James
Osakwe Favour
Premium Member
Posts: 11
Joined: November 15th, 2023, 7:35 pm

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Osakwe Favour »

The nursery rhyme about Humpty-Dumpty might actually mean that when we face tough times or challenges, we can discover more about ourselves. It's like saying that going through difficult situations helps us understand who we really are.This is my own point of view
Mara Valentina
Premium Member
Posts: 10
Joined: November 22nd, 2023, 7:00 am

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Mara Valentina »

This is an interesting question that I do not have a definitive answer to. However, I do think that there is some truth to the statement. When we are faced with challenges and adversity, we are forced to confront our true selves. We can no longer rely on our wealth or possessions to define us, and we must instead find strength and resilience within ourselves.
User avatar
Sushan
Book of the Month Discussion Leader
Posts: 2258
Joined: February 19th, 2021, 8:12 pm
Contact:

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Sushan »

Osakwe Favour wrote: November 21st, 2023, 10:20 am The nursery rhyme about Humpty-Dumpty might actually mean that when we face tough times or challenges, we can discover more about ourselves. It's like saying that going through difficult situations helps us understand who we really are.This is my own point of view
Indeed, the interpretation of Humpty Dumpty as a metaphor for self-discovery through adversity is fascinating. This concept resonates with the idea that it's through our trials and tribulations that our true selves are revealed. The Japanese art of Kintsugi, where broken pottery is mended with gold, beautifully illustrates this idea. The cracks in the pottery, rather than being hidden, are celebrated as part of the object's history, making it more unique and beautiful. This can be paralleled with how our challenges and 'cracks' shape our identity, making us who we are.

Furthermore, philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche's famous saying, "What does not kill me, makes me stronger," aligns with this idea. It suggests that our struggles, rather than breaking us, can actually build our character, resilience, and self-understanding.

Lastly, Carl Jung's concept of the 'shadow self' also comes to mind. Jung believed that we need to acknowledge and understand our darker, unconscious self to achieve true self-realization. Often, it's during our lowest points that these aspects come to the fore, prompting introspection and growth.

For further reading,

1. https://www.onmanorama.com/lifestyle/ne ... oductivity.

2. https://medium.com/philosophy-simplifie ... r%20shadow.
“There is only one thing a philosopher can be relied upon to do, and that is to contradict other philosophers”

– William James
User avatar
Sushan
Book of the Month Discussion Leader
Posts: 2258
Joined: February 19th, 2021, 8:12 pm
Contact:

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Sushan »

Mara Valentina wrote: November 26th, 2023, 6:24 pm This is an interesting question that I do not have a definitive answer to. However, I do think that there is some truth to the statement. When we are faced with challenges and adversity, we are forced to confront our true selves. We can no longer rely on our wealth or possessions to define us, and we must instead find strength and resilience within ourselves.
Your point about adversity stripping us of external identifiers, thus compelling us to confront our true selves, is quite profound. It aligns with the ancient philosophical concept of "tempering the spirit." Just as steel is forged and strengthened through the heat of a fire, our character and inner self may similarly be forged and refined through the fires of hardship and adversity.
“There is only one thing a philosopher can be relied upon to do, and that is to contradict other philosophers”

– William James
Josephine Adhiambo
Premium Member
Posts: 11
Joined: January 25th, 2024, 5:23 pm

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Josephine Adhiambo »

No, the saying "Humpty Dumpty sat on a wall" is from a nursery rhyme and doesn't contain the idea that we see our true selves only when we are broke. It's a simple rhyme about a character named Humpty Dumpty who falls off a wall.
User avatar
Sushan
Book of the Month Discussion Leader
Posts: 2258
Joined: February 19th, 2021, 8:12 pm
Contact:

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Sushan »

Josephine Adhiambo wrote: January 26th, 2024, 10:52 am No, the saying "Humpty Dumpty sat on a wall" is from a nursery rhyme and doesn't contain the idea that we see our true selves only when we are broke. It's a simple rhyme about a character named Humpty Dumpty who falls off a wall.

While thanking for your input, I would like to offer some insight that differs from your point.

Throughout the history, nursery rhymes and folklore have often been interpreted as carrying hidden meanings or moral lessons. For instance, the story of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf" is more than a simple tale; it teaches about the consequences of lying.

Applying this perspective to Humpty Dumpty, while the rhyme on the surface narrates a tale of a character falling off a wall, symbolically it could be interpreted to reflect the fragility of life and the irreversible nature of certain actions. The inability to put Humpty Dumpty back together again might represent the irreversible consequences of certain life choices or events.

Historically, many nursery rhymes had hidden meanings or were coded messages about contemporary politics or social issues. For example, "Ring Around the Rosie" is often thought to reference the Great Plague, though this is debated.

Do you think that interpreting nursery rhymes and folklore with deeper philosophical meanings provides valuable insights, or should they be viewed strictly in their literal context?
“There is only one thing a philosopher can be relied upon to do, and that is to contradict other philosophers”

– William James
Gladis Ratish Kumar
Premium Member
Posts: 7
Joined: January 24th, 2024, 7:42 pm

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Gladis Ratish Kumar »

The inclusion of Humpty Dumpty in the book took me by surprise. While I've encountered the rhyme numerous times, I never realized its profound meaning until now. The idea that Humpty Dumpty doesn't require a surgeon but must discover his true self was truly eye-opening. As for the question, the answer is not necessarily. When encountering such literature, there is an inclination to reflect on our true selves. However, in the majority of cases, it appears that one must undergo a state of brokenness to truly recognize and embrace their authentic self. It becomes a necessity rather than a choice when we are broken.
User avatar
Sushan
Book of the Month Discussion Leader
Posts: 2258
Joined: February 19th, 2021, 8:12 pm
Contact:

Re: Does Humpty-Dumpty say that we see our true selves only when we are broke?

Post by Sushan »

Gladis Ratish Kumar wrote: January 31st, 2024, 5:41 am The inclusion of Humpty Dumpty in the book took me by surprise. While I've encountered the rhyme numerous times, I never realized its profound meaning until now. The idea that Humpty Dumpty doesn't require a surgeon but must discover his true self was truly eye-opening. As for the question, the answer is not necessarily. When encountering such literature, there is an inclination to reflect on our true selves. However, in the majority of cases, it appears that one must undergo a state of brokenness to truly recognize and embrace their authentic self. It becomes a necessity rather than a choice when we are broken.
I agree with your insightful analysis of Humpty Dumpty's metaphorical significance.

Deliberate vulnerability, or the act of consciously opening ourselves to challenges, failures, and even pain, emerges as a powerful means to foster personal growth and self-discovery. It suggests that by choosing to face our fears and limitations, we engage in a more active form of self-exploration, one that complements the involuntary experiences of brokenness. This approach can lead to a deeper understanding of our true nature, one that is perhaps more nuanced and accessible than waiting for life to break us.

Reflecting on this, we might recall Nietzsche's perspective, 'What does not kill me makes me stronger,' which resonates with our discussion. It highlights the importance of our responses to the trials we face—both sought out and those that come unbidden. These experiences of overcoming adversity are not just obstacles but opportunities for profound personal transformation and the revelation of our authentic selves.

Given this, can the act of intentionally embracing our vulnerabilities lead to a more authentic and resilient self, even without the extremity of being 'broken' in the traditional sense? And how does this perspective align with or differ from the themes discussed in this book regarding the journey to understanding and embracing our true selves?
“There is only one thing a philosopher can be relied upon to do, and that is to contradict other philosophers”

– William James
Post Reply

Return to “Discuss "In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All" by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes”

2024 Philosophy Books of the Month

Launchpad Republic: America's Entrepreneurial Edge and Why It Matters

Launchpad Republic: America's Entrepreneurial Edge and Why It Matters
by Howard Wolk
July 2024

Quest: Finding Freddie: Reflections from the Other Side

Quest: Finding Freddie: Reflections from the Other Side
by Thomas Richard Spradlin
June 2024

Neither Safe Nor Effective

Neither Safe Nor Effective
by Dr. Colleen Huber
May 2024

Now or Never

Now or Never
by Mary Wasche
April 2024

Meditations

Meditations
by Marcus Aurelius
March 2024

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes

Beyond the Golden Door: Seeing the American Dream Through an Immigrant's Eyes
by Ali Master
February 2024

The In-Between: Life in the Micro

The In-Between: Life in the Micro
by Christian Espinosa
January 2024

2023 Philosophy Books of the Month

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise

Entanglement - Quantum and Otherwise
by John K Danenbarger
January 2023

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul

Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul
by Mitzi Perdue
February 2023

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness

Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness
by Chet Shupe
March 2023

The Unfakeable Code®

The Unfakeable Code®
by Tony Jeton Selimi
April 2023

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are

The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are
by Alan Watts
May 2023

Killing Abel

Killing Abel
by Michael Tieman
June 2023

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead

Reconfigurement: Reconfiguring Your Life at Any Stage and Planning Ahead
by E. Alan Fleischauer
July 2023

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough

First Survivor: The Impossible Childhood Cancer Breakthrough
by Mark Unger
August 2023

Predictably Irrational

Predictably Irrational
by Dan Ariely
September 2023

Artwords

Artwords
by Beatriz M. Robles
November 2023

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope

Fireproof Happiness: Extinguishing Anxiety & Igniting Hope
by Dr. Randy Ross
December 2023

2022 Philosophy Books of the Month

Emotional Intelligence At Work

Emotional Intelligence At Work
by Richard M Contino & Penelope J Holt
January 2022

Free Will, Do You Have It?

Free Will, Do You Have It?
by Albertus Kral
February 2022

My Enemy in Vietnam

My Enemy in Vietnam
by Billy Springer
March 2022

2X2 on the Ark

2X2 on the Ark
by Mary J Giuffra, PhD
April 2022

The Maestro Monologue

The Maestro Monologue
by Rob White
May 2022

What Makes America Great

What Makes America Great
by Bob Dowell
June 2022

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!

The Truth Is Beyond Belief!
by Jerry Durr
July 2022

Living in Color

Living in Color
by Mike Murphy
August 2022 (tentative)

The Not So Great American Novel

The Not So Great American Novel
by James E Doucette
September 2022

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches

Mary Jane Whiteley Coggeshall, Hicksite Quaker, Iowa/National Suffragette And Her Speeches
by John N. (Jake) Ferris
October 2022

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All

In It Together: The Beautiful Struggle Uniting Us All
by Eckhart Aurelius Hughes
November 2022

The Smartest Person in the Room: The Root Cause and New Solution for Cybersecurity

The Smartest Person in the Room
by Christian Espinosa
December 2022

2021 Philosophy Books of the Month

The Biblical Clock: The Untold Secrets Linking the Universe and Humanity with God's Plan

The Biblical Clock
by Daniel Friedmann
March 2021

Wilderness Cry: A Scientific and Philosophical Approach to Understanding God and the Universe

Wilderness Cry
by Dr. Hilary L Hunt M.D.
April 2021

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute: Tools To Spark Your Dream And Ignite Your Follow-Through

Fear Not, Dream Big, & Execute
by Jeff Meyer
May 2021

Surviving the Business of Healthcare: Knowledge is Power

Surviving the Business of Healthcare
by Barbara Galutia Regis M.S. PA-C
June 2021

Winning the War on Cancer: The Epic Journey Towards a Natural Cure

Winning the War on Cancer
by Sylvie Beljanski
July 2021

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream

Defining Moments of a Free Man from a Black Stream
by Dr Frank L Douglas
August 2021

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts

If Life Stinks, Get Your Head Outta Your Buts
by Mark L. Wdowiak
September 2021

The Preppers Medical Handbook

The Preppers Medical Handbook
by Dr. William W Forgey M.D.
October 2021

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress: A Practical Guide

Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress
by Dr. Gustavo Kinrys, MD
November 2021

Dream For Peace: An Ambassador Memoir

Dream For Peace
by Dr. Ghoulem Berrah
December 2021