The brilliant strategy of keeping the population down by overcrowding is working well for us. And, heck, if more people are born, there will be more overcrowding, which will keep the population down even more! I'm surprised more countries haven't thought of this.
Uyghur
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Re: Uyghur
- Arjen
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Re: Uyghur
Ecurb wrote: ↑October 23rd, 2020, 8:14 pmThe brilliant strategy of keeping the population down by overcrowding is working well for us. And, heck, if more people are born, there will be more overcrowding, which will keep the population down even more! I'm surprised more countries haven't thought of this.
You use 2 sources that are very bias. But, I did try to verify the facts, however, no sources were mentioned. Therefore, I must conclude that this is propaganda. Attempts to whitewash the Uyghur genocide by an emotional response to articles obviously written to illicit an emotional response.Count Lucanor wrote: ↑October 23rd, 2020, 6:35 pm https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archi ... es/593239/
https://www.aclu.org/issues/national-se ... ntion-camp
As you might expect, the US will say that they are not concentration camps, but other type of facilities. But again, that's also what China will say about their detention facilities.
BTW, so does Israel, among many others of the "free world":
These sources are even worse. Again, no sources for 'facts' in the articles.
What disturbs me more is that you seem to think that prison facilities are the same as concentration camps and that, for some reason, innocent countries should give people without a permit to enter the country a royal welcome. Can you somehow explain those 2 incredible lapses in judgment on your part? Or should I emotionally go along with that?
This is not about synthetic hair. Slave labour is 1 thing, but you know as well as I do that the Uyghur camps are not just about slave labour. Should I emotionally go along with whitewashing genocide?count wrote: The shipment, again, is said to be suspicious of forced labor. The hair itself doesn't seem to be a problem, and I read other news of similar seizing of synthetic hair products from China.
For the same reason that CNN is going along with it. By checking the facts. Every time when we see incorrect facts, the CCP benefits.I quoted an article from New Zealand's media, which did not pretend to portrait any positive image of China's hair industry. Why should we believe that they are part of a propaganda effort?
Anyway, that that article is not reporting on more going on there doesn't mean that more is not going on there. For example, saying that Trump is corrupt, does not exclude Biden from corruption, yet somehow, this appears to be what all those propaganda articles in the news try to make us emotionally go along with. It is the Hegelian dialective. And we know that Biden made that deal with the military wing of the CCP. The wing that handles propaganda and censorship.
~Immanuel Kant
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Re: Uyghur
Unless one pointed to a technical or scientific report, all the information coming from media sources must be assumed to have some bias. That applies to all your "sources", too. Media outlets don't hide their editorial agendas and public in general is aware of this, but to be politically motivated does not necessarily imply having to lie, manipulate and spread propaganda. There's a threshold that separates credible information from propaganda, which we can see here in this thread. You are here yourself in an obvious propaganda campaign, drawing caricatures of evil vs good, which is not how the world actually is.Arjen wrote: ↑October 24th, 2020, 9:20 amYou use 2 sources that are very bias. But, I did try to verify the facts, however, no sources were mentioned. Therefore, I must conclude that this is propaganda.Count Lucanor wrote: ↑October 23rd, 2020, 6:35 pm https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archi ... es/593239/
https://www.aclu.org/issues/national-se ... ntion-camp
As you might expect, the US will say that they are not concentration camps, but other type of facilities. But again, that's also what China will say about their detention facilities.
BTW, so does Israel, among many others of the "free world":
In any case, the ACLU (American Civil Liberties Union) is engaged in the defense of civil liberties since the 1920's, including support for oppressed minorities, which is the topic you are asking us to be concerned in this thread. Why would you dismiss them all of the sudden as not relevant and bias? The systematic abuses and human rights violations by the US in its detention facilities are well documented from independent sources and even the US senate itself. Here's just one of so many well-known reports:
Prosecuting Abuses of Detainees in U.S. Counter- terrorism Operations
After September 11, 2001, U.S. counterterrorism policies authorized and fostered systematic violations of human rights standards under national and international law. Those most responsible were not held accountable. Contrary to fundamental democratic values, these policies and actions damaged the standing of the United States in the world and irreparably injured individuals. Abuses against prisoners were committed in detention facilities in Afghanistan, Iraq, and Guantánamo Bay, and in secret prisons run by the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). These violations humiliated and degraded detainees, stripped them of their core bearings in the world, and, in a number of instances, resulted in death.
And since your opening post references The Guardian, I should assume that's a credible reference source for you, so here we go again:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... e-disgrace
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... ns-reports
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... er-georgia
As we can see, your whole opening post is an attempt to elicit an emotional response against China by portraying the political control of the Uyghur minorities far more worst than the evidence seems to show. I mean, comparing it to the Nazi death camps and suggesting in purely rhetorical and dramatic fashion that we might be on the verge of a third world war, is a ludicrous claim.
I find it more disturbing that you, quite candidly, are very eager to buy the pubic relations narrative from the governments you like to endorse. It is "prison and educational facilities" for the US and Chinese governments, and it is concentration camps for others. The Chinese say that their detention facilities for the Uyghurs are for counteracting Muslim terrorism, and something similar will say the US about their own camps. China has its "war on terror" and so does the US. No government calls its own facilities concentration camps. Such policies should be addressed with criticism, not with propaganda. It is not the US government, nor the so called "free world" (whatever that is) that has a saying and a moral stance on this, they only represent geopolitical interests, which will readily endorse human rights violations if they advance such interests.Arjen wrote: ↑October 24th, 2020, 9:20 am What disturbs me more is that you seem to think that prison facilities are the same as concentration camps and that, for some reason, innocent countries should give people without a permit to enter the country a royal welcome. Can you somehow explain those 2 incredible lapses in judgment on your part? Or should I emotionally go along with that?
Actually, you don't know yourself as a fact what's exactly happening at the Chinese facilities. Any sources other than the US government?
Most of the sources criticizing Chinese treatment of the Uyghurs talk about "cultural genocide". I suspect that if it were something worst than "cultural", like plain literal genocide, they would have not gone in the trouble of giving it a softer label.
― Marcus Tullius Cicero
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Re: Uyghur
If EVERY one in the, so called, "free world" or not looked at their own human right violations, openly and honestly, FIRST, before they started looking at "other's" human right violations, then this would be much better.Arjen wrote: ↑September 27th, 2020, 2:16 pm Recently, Mulan made headlines concerning looking away from the CCP's atrocities.
We see hashtags like:
#StandwithHongKong
#StandwithHumanRights
#BoycotMulan
I suppose everyone knows about the concentration camps containing the Uyghur minority. Some reports say 1 million are in camps like that, others say 3-5 million. Many never come back. Some come back really "disturbed" after years. In this article, for example, a clear idea can be found concerning what is going on:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/resources/id ... dden_camps
More disturbingly, this parallel exists:
http://auschwitz.org/en/gallery/exhibit ... mes,1.html (no good link; it is about the tons of human hair)
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/07/02/us/c ... index.html
The idea is horrifying, but as now 500000 Tibetans are reportedly also in camps:
https://canadafreepress.com/article/chi ... bour-camps
https://nypost.com/2020/09/22/china-rep ... bor-camps/
And by my own calculations 10000 arrested in the last few months in HK:
https://www.dw.com/en/chinas-influence- ... a-54842597
It can't be denied that the CCP is doing something with the population that is not Han-Chinese.
People call it Chinazi nowadays and the leader Xitler. Communism is a form of fascism ofcourse, but until Xitler's rise, I think everyone was happy with the breath of fresh air that was going through China. Since the CCPvirus, we see many military escalations:
https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/05/23/in ... kirmishes/
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-taiw ... SKBN25M0VE
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/ ... nds-switch
etc.
Are we ramping up to a 3rd world war against Chinazi?
Should the free world strike hard and fast, or try to talk teh CCP out of these human rights violations?
What is your opinons?
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Re: Uyghur
~Immanuel Kant
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