Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
- anon13d4
- New Trial Member
- Posts: 1
- Joined: March 14th, 2020, 8:35 pm
Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
I'm charing near or close to the same it would cost to get one in store, I'm not charing $800 like some other ppl.
But is what I'm doing unethical?
These mask are more of a security blanket than something that would prevent you from getting the virus.
- Terrapin Station
- Posts: 6227
- Joined: August 23rd, 2016, 3:00 pm
- Favorite Philosopher: Bertrand Russell and WVO Quine
- Location: NYC Man
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
People need to know how to put them on correctly, or they won't be effective, and they also impede breathing, so it's not wise to wear one unless you need to, and then only for the length of time you need to wear it.
Most masks that people are buying and wearing (not N95s) are useless period for preventing acquisition of the virus, by the way. The virus is smaller than the gaps in the mask material.
- Pattern-chaser
- Premium Member
- Posts: 8380
- Joined: September 22nd, 2019, 5:17 am
- Favorite Philosopher: Cratylus
- Location: England
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
"Who cares, wins"
- h_k_s
- Posts: 1243
- Joined: November 25th, 2018, 12:09 pm
- Favorite Philosopher: Aristotle
- Location: Rocky Mountains
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
- h_k_s
- Posts: 1243
- Joined: November 25th, 2018, 12:09 pm
- Favorite Philosopher: Aristotle
- Location: Rocky Mountains
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
So fearing a similar shelter in place order here in my state, I stocked my freezer full of beef, chicken, shrimp, vegies, and bagels. This way I could survive a shelter in place order for a month or two.
But I did not get any masks. I have large handkerchiefs that I can use as masks if I need them. Masks are needed by healthcare workers to treat the sick, not by civilians who otherwise never would see the inside of a hospital.
I should have stocked up on Everclear. I did not imagine the liquor store would run out of this branded product. However Everclear is now being used to make hand sanitizer, which is one of the most useless products in the world. Washing hands does not require hand sanitizer.
Instead of Everclear, which never gives you a headache because it is so pure, I have had to start buying Bombay Sapphire gin, which is twice as expensive. But any gin is better than no gin.
- Terrapin Station
- Posts: 6227
- Joined: August 23rd, 2016, 3:00 pm
- Favorite Philosopher: Bertrand Russell and WVO Quine
- Location: NYC Man
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
I was using hand sanitizer a lot when gyms were still open. There was conflicting evidence on how much good hand sanitizers were against the virus, but I figured it couldn't hurt, in addition to wiping the equipment down before and after use like normal.h_k_s wrote: ↑March 25th, 2020, 1:25 pm I should have stocked up on Everclear. I did not imagine the liquor store would run out of this branded product. However Everclear is now being used to make hand sanitizer, which is one of the most useless products in the world. Washing hands does not require hand sanitizer.
Doesn't matter now that gyms are unfortunately closed.
- LuckyR
- Moderator
- Posts: 7984
- Joined: January 18th, 2015, 1:16 am
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
Well, yes and no. The pores in the masks are indeed larger than the size of the virus itself. Though since airborne virus is aerosolized within water droplets (upon coughing) the pores are smaller than those droplets and will prevent their crossing to the inside of the mask. Having said that, if you are not hanging out with folks who are actively coughing, the mask will provide the much more vital role of blocking you rubbing your face after touching hard surfaces that happen to harbor virus. So still useful.Terrapin Station wrote: ↑March 25th, 2020, 12:07 pm I wouldn't say it's unethical (and there isn't a correct answer as to whether anything is ethical or unethical, by the way), but buying just one is pretty useless. They're not designed to be worn more than once. If one is going to attempt to wear the same mask multiple times, they really need to be sterilized before each wear, or they're not going to be effective.
People need to know how to put them on correctly, or they won't be effective, and they also impede breathing, so it's not wise to wear one unless you need to, and then only for the length of time you need to wear it.
Most masks that people are buying and wearing (not N95s) are useless period for preventing acquisition of the virus, by the way. The virus is smaller than the gaps in the mask material.
- Terrapin Station
- Posts: 6227
- Joined: August 23rd, 2016, 3:00 pm
- Favorite Philosopher: Bertrand Russell and WVO Quine
- Location: NYC Man
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
Every expert I read said the non N95 masks do no good against the virus. Maybe you can link to an expert saying otherwise?LuckyR wrote: ↑March 25th, 2020, 4:40 pm Well, yes and no. The pores in the masks are indeed larger than the size of the virus itself. Though since airborne virus is aerosolized within water droplets (upon coughing) the pores are smaller than those droplets and will prevent their crossing to the inside of the mask. Having said that, if you are not hanging out with folks who are actively coughing, the mask will provide the much more vital role of blocking you rubbing your face after touching hard surfaces that happen to harbor virus. So still useful.
- Bluemist
- Posts: 129
- Joined: November 15th, 2009, 10:11 pm
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
LuckyR wrote: ↑March 25th, 2020, 4:40 pmWell, yes and no. The pores in the masks are indeed larger than the size of the virus itself. Though since airborne virus is aerosolized within water droplets (upon coughing) the pores are smaller than those droplets and will prevent their crossing to the inside of the mask. Having said that, if you are not hanging out with folks who are actively coughing, the mask will provide the much more vital role of blocking you rubbing your face after touching hard surfaces that happen to harbor virus. So still useful.Terrapin Station wrote: ↑March 25th, 2020, 12:07 pm People need to know how to put [masks] on correctly, or they won't be effective, and they also impede breathing, so it's not wise to wear one unless you need to, and then only for the length of time you need to wear it.
Most masks that people are buying and wearing (not N95s) are useless period for preventing acquisition of the virus, by the way. The virus is smaller than the gaps in the mask material.
The virus isn't attacking any one of us but the genetics of the entire species. With the air currents that carry tiny moisture droplets it will in time circle the Earth and find everyone no matter where we hide. Airplanes do make the process so much more efficient by creating many remote silent origins. This is quite normal and regular in the biosphere that Earth is. Maybe we'll all wake up tomorrow morning having all of us been metamorphosed into giant Kafka-esque creatures?
The vast majority of people, perhaps 90%, will have sufficient built-in biological resources to combat and subdue the invaders just as we do for other novel viruses as children. For the other 10% it gets complicated.
Whether the masks are or are not effective in preventing the virus is the wrong question to ask. The right question is to what degree does this mask, or wet handkerchief, decrease the density of viruses we absorb given the circumstances of use. For simpler analysis one can ask if the mask, and the necessary complementary goggles of course, make things worse? This second question builds a decision cutoff that is easier to judge, rightly or wrongly, by gut reaction.
- Terrapin Station
- Posts: 6227
- Joined: August 23rd, 2016, 3:00 pm
- Favorite Philosopher: Bertrand Russell and WVO Quine
- Location: NYC Man
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
It doesn't float around indefinitely, and it doesn't last forever. It's susceptible to UV radiation among other things. It's not attacking anyone's genetics, let along the "entire species." It's not a genetic disorder. It's just a virus.
- Bluemist
- Posts: 129
- Joined: November 15th, 2009, 10:11 pm
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
I'm confused. Don't viruses contain RNA or DNA genetic material from foreign sources?
- Terrapin Station
- Posts: 6227
- Joined: August 23rd, 2016, 3:00 pm
- Favorite Philosopher: Bertrand Russell and WVO Quine
- Location: NYC Man
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
Again, the virus doesn't remain viable indefinitely. It has a limited time span before it becomes degraded enough that it's inert, especially in some environments, such as when exposed to strong, sustained UV radiation, when exposed to certain chemicals (including simple soap), etc.Bluemist wrote: ↑March 26th, 2020, 7:10 pm It may not float around indefinitely but it will stay in the air of rooms, streets even pastures to find everyone. Just a matter of time. Time is a variable in reaching everyone. Contact with infected surfaces is also a factor. It might take years in some cases, but it will get there.
I'm confused. Don't viruses contain RNA or DNA genetic material from foreign sources?
And yes, viruses contain RNA or DNA (it depends on the virus), but that doesn't amount to something that attacks our genetics.
- h_k_s
- Posts: 1243
- Joined: November 25th, 2018, 12:09 pm
- Favorite Philosopher: Aristotle
- Location: Rocky Mountains
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
Clorox wipes are the best microbe killing product available.Terrapin Station wrote: ↑March 25th, 2020, 1:36 pmI was using hand sanitizer a lot when gyms were still open. There was conflicting evidence on how much good hand sanitizers were against the virus, but I figured it couldn't hurt, in addition to wiping the equipment down before and after use like normal.h_k_s wrote: ↑March 25th, 2020, 1:25 pm I should have stocked up on Everclear. I did not imagine the liquor store would run out of this branded product. However Everclear is now being used to make hand sanitizer, which is one of the most useless products in the world. Washing hands does not require hand sanitizer.
Doesn't matter now that gyms are unfortunately closed.
I use a couple of these folded together to clean off my desk top, keyboard, mouse, and phone every morning when I get to work. I also wipe down the chairs and electronic signature pad and anything else that yesterday's clients might have touched.
The Clorox wipes kill anything that is on my hands as well. I then rinse off my hands in cold water in the sink in the bathroom and then get to work.
I avoid shaking hands all day long now, as advised by our State Governor recently. Then after a client leaves, I wash my hands in the sink again.
Clorox wipes work. Hand sanitizer is a joke.
-
- Posts: 1172
- Joined: November 22nd, 2019, 10:39 pm
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
Do doctors and nurses who work with patients with viruses use marks, N95 or not?Terrapin Station wrote: ↑March 25th, 2020, 7:09 pmEvery expert I read said the non N95 masks do no good against the virus. Maybe you can link to an expert saying otherwise?LuckyR wrote: ↑March 25th, 2020, 4:40 pm Well, yes and no. The pores in the masks are indeed larger than the size of the virus itself. Though since airborne virus is aerosolized within water droplets (upon coughing) the pores are smaller than those droplets and will prevent their crossing to the inside of the mask. Having said that, if you are not hanging out with folks who are actively coughing, the mask will provide the much more vital role of blocking you rubbing your face after touching hard surfaces that happen to harbor virus. So still useful.
Are they experts? Or, are you looking for other types of so called "experts"?
Do you need to be told, by an expert, that any mask is better than no mask before you would walk into a ward full of patients with viruses without a mask on?
I am not sure an "expert" would say that any mask other than a N95 mask is no good. So, there is no use in wearing no mask at all, other than a N95 mask, when working and dealing with patients with viruses. Maybe you could link to an expert saying something like this?
Or, maybe you or those so called "experts" might like to show how much faith you have in that belief that those masks "do no good against viruses" by removing the only masks you have to wear that are not N95 if and when you have to work with or deal with patients with viruses?
Do you think you would be up for that challenge?
Surely, if those masks "do no good against viruses", then there is absolutely no use at all in wearing them, when working with those with a virus, correct?
- Terrapin Station
- Posts: 6227
- Joined: August 23rd, 2016, 3:00 pm
- Favorite Philosopher: Bertrand Russell and WVO Quine
- Location: NYC Man
Re: Is it unethical or immoral to sell N95 mask RN?
What I'd be interested in response to my comment is a link quoting an expert saying that the non-N95 masks are effective against the virus. What you wrote isn't something I'm interested in as a response.creation wrote: ↑March 29th, 2020, 2:42 pmDo doctors and nurses who work with patients with viruses use marks, N95 or not? . . .Terrapin Station wrote: ↑March 25th, 2020, 7:09 pm
Every expert I read said the non N95 masks do no good against the virus. Maybe you can link to an expert saying otherwise?
2023/2024 Philosophy Books of the Month
Mark Victor Hansen, Relentless: Wisdom Behind the Incomparable Chicken Soup for the Soul
by Mitzi Perdue
February 2023
Rediscovering the Wisdom of Human Nature: How Civilization Destroys Happiness
by Chet Shupe
March 2023